The Mike Miller Farewell Tour
3 teams, 2 trades, 1 Kevin McHale.
Before I go on, it's time for some personal accountability here at Hoopus. At the time of the O.J. Mayo trade I wrote this:
Wow. That's highway f'ing robbery. That's worse than the Lakers deal. They just cleaned out the Wolves' entire stash of bad contracts with an expiring deal (Collins) and a 1/4 way serviceable bench player in Cardinal. Miller pushes this thing way over the top. That's an amazing deal for the Wolves. I went from hating this draft (thanks to the insane Chalmers trade) to being a big fan.
Because of this over-the-top paragraph, I had highlighted each and every single Laker and Memphis game on the schedule in the event that I could crow or, in this case, eat crow.
I still 100% believe that Kevin Love is going to be a fantastic player in this league. I've never held any illusions that he will be a superstar but he does have the makings of an upper-level glue guy; the type of player that can really bring together a fantastic team.
What I didn't believe is that O.J. Mayo had the makings of an upper-level NBA scorer who could jettison the bad things (turnovers, lack of free throws, inability to score without jumper) associated with his college game.
Perhaps the thing that really put the deal over the top, for me, was the addition of Mike Miller and the subtraction of Antoine Walker and Marko Jaric. Getting to the point, I still think the Wolves made the deal they had to make; just like the KG deal was the deal they had to make. It's just no where near the highway robbery I said it was at the time and I was completely off on that take. There's no other way to put it. It was a terrible, no-good, awful prediction and I was wrong to make it. Accountability is something that I think is important to this site and I just wanted our readers to know how badly I got it wrong with the Mayo/Love trade. Consistency and accountability are two things I hope you will always find on this site.
Still, if this team does not pull off the Love/Mayo trade, I think we're looking at a team filled with Toine, Marko, even less outside shooting than it already has, even fewer serviceable big men, and a high-scoring rookie guard under the direction of one Randy Wittman.
Here is my big fear with the Love/Mayo deal: Love becomes the whipping boy for Kevin McHale's sins as VP of Basketball Operations. After the 99 Draft, Joe Smith debacle, McCants over Granger, Foye over Roy, and Brewer over Young, one more too-cute-by-half McHale selection was too much for fans to handle. Regardless of just how good a player he took (it could have been Brook "he had his shot blocked by J-Pete" Lopez or DJ "he's way to small for the Wolves" Augustine) the aftermath of this particular deal will be weighted down with the aftermath of not just one selection, but many. The way things are headed with Mayo, Michael Beasley may not have even been enough to stem the anger.
Kevin Love is a year removed from high school and he is averaging 10/10 with nearly 5 Oreb over his last 10 games off the bench and in 25 minutes of play. He is a better passer and help defender than the team's best player. He doesn't turn the ball over a lot and he can get to the free throw line. He's doing so on arguably the worst team in the league that just went through a coaching change less than 20 games into the season. Does he have issues with man defense? Yes, but on a team with Mike Miller and Al Jefferson, you have to play mental jujitsu to assign things to Mr. Love that cannot be turned around on the team's veteran leadership.
Getting around to last night's game...well, you've seen it before. Bad shooting, a general lack of talent, nice work on the offensive glass, a somewhat close game for 2 1/2 or 3 quarters, and then an opponent who suddenly decides to try and put the game out of reach. It's like the plot to some bad move we've all seen one too many times.
Speaking of movies, here are the recommended comedies from last night's game thread: Kingpin, Flight of the Conchords (season 1), Tongan Ninja, Spinal Tap, The Big Lebowski, Bringing up Baby, Raising Arizona, Hudsucker Proxy, Balls of Fury, Superbad, Bullworth, Ghostbusters, Knocked Up, Forgetting Sarah Marshall, Pineapple Express, MST3K, and Shrek.
Enough movies. Let's take a look at the Four Factors:
| Pace | Eff | eFG | FT/FG | OREB% | TOr | |
| MIN | 92.0 | 93.5 | 41.0% | 21.7 | 30.2 | 18.5 |
| LAL | 106.5 | 47.6% | 20.0 | 19.6 | 10.9 |
Yes, the Wolves almost broke basketball's equivalent of the Mendoza line with a 41% eFG. Here's how Yahoo Sports led off their coverage of the game:
LOS ANGELES (AP)—Playing a bunch of teams with losing records isn’t exactly bringing out the best in the Los Angeles Lakers.
But for the most part, they’re winning.
At least the bad plot has made national news.
I honestly don't know what to write about these games anymore. The Wolves typically blow their opponents away on the glass (especially on offense), they perform well enough at the line, they have a decent pace (although last night it should have been much quicker), and they get done in by horrible shooting and opponents who suddenly "turn it on".
Last night the Wolves shot 39% in the 1st, 29% in the 2nd, and 47/32 in the 3rd and 4th. They were down by 5 at the 1/2 with 33% shooting. Big Al and Foye were a combined 10-36 from the floor. The bench was 6-22. They could have turned the ball over about 2 times last night and still lost with shooting that bad.
Defensively, OBZs were lucky the Lakers decided to only play 15 minutes of good ball last night. Upon the Wolves taking a small lead midway through the 3rd, LA went on a 10-0 run to end that nonsense before going on a 5-0 and a 6-0 run midway through the 4th to put the game away. You could see it coming. In the game thread we joked about how teams don't have to try for 3 quarters against the Wolves and can still walk away with a 10-point victory.
Following the coaching change I took note of the increased effort by the players under new coach Kevin McHale. I also took note of the fact that it's pretty damn hard to play "fun" while losing a ton of games. League Pass spared me the trouble of having to listen to J-Pete and Hanny, but I wonder if they are still talking about McHale's Fun Ball. Free-wheeling ball is great to play when you're ahead. Not so much when you're losing 10-15 in a row. Speaking of which, if the team doesn't win on the 2nd night of a B2B against Sacramento tonight, their next 3 games are against Cleveland, Houston, and San Antonio. That's probably 13 losses in a row before they run up against their next winnable opponent (New York) on the 26th. After the Knicks, they play Orlando and then a home and away B2B against Memphis and Dallas to end the year. In other words, they have a very real possibility of ending 2008 in exactly the same way they ended 2007:
Again, if they can't walk away from [the pre New Year] schedule with more than 4 wins, something is drastically wrong.
Something is most certainly drastically wrong. Which brings us all the way back around to the picture and title of this post. Mike Miller shot the ball 6 times last night (2 of which were down the stretch when it didn't matter). He didn't bother to play much of any defense and while he may be struggling to come back from a bad ankle injury, it's becoming more and more apparent that he is a luxury this team cannot afford.
Today marks the first day that free agents signed over the summer can be traded. This means Craig Smith, Ryan Gomes, and Sebastian Telfair can now be used as (relatively) meaningful assets. This team needs to do something. The status quo isn't even close to being average or acceptable. No one on this team should be considered untradable, Big Al included. Since it is a Mega-Deal Monday, here are a few trades I'd try to pull off in Fantasy GM Land:
Trade #1 (the as-realistic-as-I-can-get edition)
To the Cavs: Mike Miller, Brian Cardinal
To the Bobcats: Jason Collins, Craig Smith, Rashad McCants, JJ Hickson
To the Wolves: Wally, Nazr Mohammed, Gerald Wallace, Alexis Ajinca
Trade #2 (the crazy karma edition):
To the Knicks: Miller, Booth, Cardinal, Celtic pick
To the Wolves: Steph, Knicks' #1 pick
Trade #3 (the let's blow it all up/pie-in-the-sky edition):
To the Blazers: Al Jefferson, Brian Cardinal, Mike Conley
To the Griz: Lamarcus Aldridge
To the Wolves: Raef Lafrentz, Rudy Fernandez, Pryz, 1st round considerations
Well, that about does it for today. These games are getting harder and harder to watch, listen to, write about, and, I'm sure, read about.
Until later.
PS: If you haven't already, please take the time to read the latest Diary of a Madman Genius Coach from Peter. Also, don't forget to check out my interview with the Kamenetzky brothers here.
UPDATE: Whenever I put up a Mega-Deal Monday post or a tidbit about nobody being off limits, I tend to get a few emails about how the team shouldn't blow anything up and that Al Jefferson is an All Star. I'd just like to clarify a few things with a comment I made in a recent post:
I’m not advocating a Jefferson trade but no one should be off limits at this point. Unless they have some inside-the-locker room notion that he’s more than an empty 20/10 that can lead a team, he shouldn’t be untouchable. Ideally, I’d like to see them keep Foye, Jefferson, Brewer, and Love. I think they need to move whatever they can for Wallace and then shop Miller to Cleveland, Portland, and LA. Then, all mega-deal Mondays and for-the-sake-of-it arguments aside, I think they sit on what they have, lose a bunch of games, and hope for the best in the lottery. My ideal scenario is that they walk away with a real guard, a solid 2/3 like Danny Green, and a defensively proficient 4/5 or 5 (whether by draft or trade).
I put up Mega-Deal Mondays because it's fun to speculate about trades with a 4-win team. However, if pressed to give a 110% serious take on the matter, I think they try their best for Wallace, move Miller, and then sit on a bunch of losses until the draft. Guys like Gomes, Smith, McCants, and Bassy shouldn't get in the way of making these two deals happen. Patience is key here and there is no need to panic, but you need to realize that they're dealing with a very limited number of remotely average players. It's frustrating as all hell and that's why we speculate about the draft and trades here on Hoopus. However, I can't say that I disagree with too many moves this team has made since the KG trade. It's one thing to say that they should have fired McHale or drafted Mayo, but it's quite another to deal with the situation that would have been left behind in the wake of those two decisions. The team is paying for over a decade of piss-poor general management. The upcoming draft and the (likely) selection of the next coach will be the ultimate test of Jim Stack, Fred Hoiberg, and Rob Babcock's collective worth. That being said, they shouldn't turn up their noses at any deal at this point. When you're this close to the bottom, nothing is sacred.
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Marko vs. Miller
Perhaps the thing that really put the deal over the top, for me, was the addition of Mike Miller and the subtraction of Antoine Walker and Marko Jaric
I’m not sure that the Miller we got this year is a better player than Marko from last year. Marko could hit a three point shot he was set up for, and he played much better defense than Miller. He also probably does all the other intangibles better. Still, it was nice to get out from under the contracts of Marko and Antwoine.
This is a dark day...
Andy B has positively compared Marko to Mike Miller (sans contract) and I find myself nodding in agreement.
I third that...
… and I was a big Marko hater. But he was better than Miller at defense, his equal at rebounding, and equally good at passing. And he could play point. Ugh.
I think..
…the frustrating thing right now is that I find myself agreeing that they are headed on the right direction but they’re still FUBAR’ing their way along. While I admit the highway robbery take is off I still like the trade and I think it did a number of good things for them. Last year I wrote that this season would be rock bottom. It had to be. They pieced together whatever they could until the draft picks came and they could start making some moves. The whole rebuilding effort depends on this draft. This is what they cashed all the chips in for. Of course, they’re lucky enough where it’s shaping up to be one of the weakest drafts in recent memory.
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You know things are bad when...
even newspapers halfway round the world are picking up the very storylines we’ve been obsessing over.
http://www.gazzetta.it/Sport_Vari/Basket/Usa/Primo_Piano/2008/12/15/partite.shtml
Headline: “Kobe turns on the jets for the Lakers; Mayo wins the battle of the rookies.” They’re talking about Mayo-Beasley in last night’s Grizz-Heat game, but still…ouch. Story highlight: “the light at the end of the tunnel seems a long way away for the Timberwolves despite the change on the bench.” Nice post by the way – I still think it’s way too early for the final word on that trade, but it’s getting later by the minute…
Quick Notes
I have a few other quick notes…
1. I think I may have a new highlight of the season…Jim Peterson’s commentary on the “stars” that came out for the Sunday night game. Nothing like KSTC showing us “the nip tuck guy”, Diane Canon (whose face is an absolute disaster), and a few other D list celebrities. I may be in the minority here, but I’ve always been a huge fan of Jim Pete and Hanny. Both great guys and they’re fun to listen to, even if I have to take some of what they tell me with a grain of salt.
2. That picture of Gasol and Miller is FANTASTIC. Just fantastic.
Didn't Pete intimate that he had eaten one of Canon's pot brownies?
… I’m not anti-pot, but I thought it was odd that he’d even joke on the air about eating a brownie and “feeling lightheaded.” Pete was a little quieter than usual last night. Maybe he actually was baked.
Maybe he'll talk about hot boxing it tonight
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Another Trade Idea
How about Miller and Madsen, for Dalembert in Phi and perhaps some draft pick considerations. This would move Al to power forward and put him next to a true defensive center. Philly is desperate for shooters and would consider moving Dalembert. I like the following line-up:
Foye
McCants
Love
Jefferson
Dalembert
Obviously Love might have trouble guarding quick small forwards, so you could swap in Gomes there when appropriate. Losing Miller certainly would leave a hole at shooting guard, but we would finally get the defensive center to put alongside Al.
Thoughts?
Dalembert...
…is a tad down this year. I know he’s come up before but if he’s not doing it next to Brand, I’d be a bit worried about him next to Al.
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I'm not high on Dalembert either...
… he doesn’t seem like a smart player, and as far as I can tell, it looks like he has some of his best games against our undersized guys and then disappears for games at a time. I’d rather look at a center in the draft or trade for Sean Williams, who could potentially do the same things Dalembert does at a fraction of the cost.
Love at SF???
Love isn’t quick enough to defend PFs…how do you envision him guarding Tracy McGrady, Carmelo Anthony etc?
by TWolvesFanInLA on Dec 15, 2008 2:06 PM CST up reply actions
Love really struggles on the perimeter...
… that just isn’t where he would be best used. I’d rather bring him off the bench or start him at the four with Al at the five until either Love or Al gets traded. And yes, I do believe that it is only a matter of time (possibly a long time) until the Wolves trade one of the two.
Defense
True, Dalembert has struggled a bit, and his trade value is definitely lower right now. Even if he struggles offensively, his defense would immediately improve the wolves. I would do this trade, especially if the wolves could upgrade their #1 pick by trading the celtics pick for philly’s first rounder. Getting Dalembert would solidify the frontcourt and the wolves could focus on upgrading the backcourt. The problem right now is that there are so many holes in the line-up management just doesn’t know where to start. Shooting guards are much easier to find that long active 7 foot centers.
Its alot
You covered alot here and I’m just going to give my opinions.
1. Kevin Love could work well at SF in a half court orientated team, it would play to his range advantage and offset his strength/size disadvantage playing at PF.
2. OJ Mayo is a much better pro thana college player (even Wade agrees). The bad things “(turnovers, lack of free throws, inability to score without jumper)” have been vastly decreased because he barely plays PG. He is a SG who handles the ball in crunch must score situations (a la Kobe, LeBron, Wade or R*y)
3. The Nets are one of my teams. Brook Lopez is looking pretty good- he has a strong defensive prescence and some good post moves. He is having trouble scoring/defending against the stronger centres who can back people down. He needs to be more confident when he recieves the ball and dunk more often.
4. Mike Miller is also struggling because this team has no slashers. There is NO ONE willing to take it to the rim and the wolves have no one who plays above the rim. Miller had the benefit of playing with Rudy Gay (or stoudamire back in the day) who would drive and kick and command alot of attention. A slasher is more essential when you consider AL Jefferson camps in the left low post commanding double teams opening the lane on the right.
5. Antoine Walker was bought out by one of the cheapest teams in the league and is now a free agent. The Wolves could easily have done the same.
6. those trades- the Cavs dont need Miller anymore, Wally is good off the bench. I still dont understand what the bobcats are doing. Does Steph want to play in meinnesota again- if not he is on the bench again and all you get is a late lottery pick. LaMarcus Aldrige works well in the Blazers offense- they wouldnt want Al Jefferson and Mike Conley hasn’t got "it " yet. Raef Lafrenz isnt coming back soon so essentially all you get is Rudy Fernandez (a flight risk on bad teams- see Navarro) and unathletic aging Pryzbilla for Al Jefferson. Bad moves
Thanks for the input..
….good points. I’d just add that the whole Mega-Deal Monday thing is just a talking piece for a bad team. We ran into it last year with not a lot of good things to talk about and we all figured that a bunch of trade proposals was the best way to pass the time. I think I’ve caveatted them enough (crazy karma, etc) to make sure they’re not taken too seriously…just a way to pass time during a looooonnnnnnnngggg losing season without having to resort to a message board.
Ultimately, I’ll stick by what I wrote in the update. I think they pursue the Wallace and Miller trades and sit on a bad team with a lot of picks, cap space, and short free agent contracts that expire in 2 years. They take the BPA with their first pick and then try to get some athleticism or trade resources for a free agent to be in hopes that he will sign here.
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Good post...
and thanks for the continued coverage. It’s not an easy team to continually watch and try to analyze. The same mistakes get made over and over by the same players—until Foye, Love or Jefferson makes a significant leap forward in their all-around games, we’ll continue to flounder. I hope that that happens, so that we’re not banking on the lottery to solve all problems, like we have for the last few years and all of the pre-Garnett years.
BTW, one concern I have about future moves this year: Miller does help us win games this year. Given the pressure McHale is under to win or get bounced is he going to let Taylor trade Miller for anything other than a player than can contribute right away? And since most agree that McHale still has the loudest voice in Taylor’s ear, I’m worried that one of our few assets (Collins’ expiring contract and future picks being the others) won’t get moved b/c it will further hurt McHale’s ability to get wins out of this team.
Great Post
… thanks for the honest perspective on the trade. I respect people who can admit they’re wrong. God knows many of my opinions/reactions have ended up being laughably incorrect.
That said, I want to push you a bit further, because you danced around the elephant in the room (and it’s a big one, so that means it was quite a dance): knowing what you know now, do you still make the deal? And even though you still “like” the deal and admit that it wasn’t “highway robbery,” do you think it can be considered an “even” trade, or did the Wolves get fleeced?
You know where I stand, and I’m not going to reiterate my opinion in any depth. I will say that there’s a lot to like about Love, but I just don’t think it’s ever right to give up a guy with such a high ceiling and so many positive intangibles (you mentioned some of the negative raps on Mayo’s college game but ignored all the rave reviews he was drawing for his determination, drive, and desire for greatness, which are special qualities that not many NBA talents have) for a guy with a lower ceiling, no matter what the spare parts involved in the trade are. Time and time again, NBA trades are “won” by the team that gets the best individual player. In this case, it’s fairly clear that Memphis got the best player.
I’m not trying to kick mud in your face, but just to get a sense of whether you think the deal was a strategic mistake for the Wolves. It obviously wouldn’t be their first.
Wolves Mistakes
Shogun,
Would OJ help this team? Probably not much, the trade allowed the wolves to clear out some more bad contracts, while acquiring valuable assets in addition to Love – Mike Miller. Even if Miller isn’t playing his best, the wolves can trade him and probably should. If they really want to blow this thing up before the trading deadline, they’ve got options to get more picks and expiring contracts.
Breaking down the trade...
You’re right that questioning the deal requires assuming Mayo would be a good player in Minnesota. I accept that assumption.
If you question the deal, you’re also assuming that keeping him is worth the cost of Jaric and ’Toine’s contracts. I do. I do because I’d accept a couple of bad contracts in exchange for a potential superstar at a position we’re thin at. I think most teams would.
If you’d ask around the NBA, I suspect about 90% of the people you’d talk to would say that Memphis got the better end of the deal. I could see the logic of the deal at the time it happened, and I didn’t begrudge the opinion of the people who supported it, even though I didn’t. They could’ve been right , after all. It was difficult to know at the time. But now a bigger sample is accumulating, and the trade looks worse and worse. Mayo is starring. Memphis is starting to win. And Love looks like a great rebounder but little else. I think College Wolf has a reasonable take on Love’s ability in his comment above.
All I was asking was if SnP still would do the deal. If he would, he has more faith in Love than I do. And it might turn out that he’d be right. I was honestly just looking for a more specific statement of his opinion on the deal now that we have more information to work with.
Good question...
…I guess I would have to answer yes. My view of this team this year was that they had to bottom out in terms of getting rid of dead weight, front office blubber, and head coaching. I think Glen Taylor really did put McHale on the track out of the front office and I don’t think he’ll be an influence there anymore. Witt is gone and I suspect they’ll have a new guy in there next year. With Mayo, Toine, Marko, Buckner, and the rest of the roster, I think they win a few more games this year and prolong the mediocrity. They might even win enough to allow Witt to keep his job for another year and McHale is still in charge on draft day 09. Of course, this is wild speculation but I’d still have to say that the trade allowed them to do things they otherwise could not. If they can put Miller and Collins’ expiring deal to good use, I think that becomes even more true. Of course they would have had Toine’s expiring deal but not a whole lot to pair him with if they didn’t make the trade. I think Love is going to work out. If they land a guard who can play and score (say Harden really works out and they are lucky enough to land him) and they can get a 4/5 or 5 to pair with Jefferson and Love, I think we’re looking at a very young and exciting ball club. I know Mayo is off to a tremendous start but if there’s one position that comes up in the draft more than others, it’s a shooting guard. Ultimately, I think this trade gets judged by this year’s draft, how they use Miller and Collins to acquire additional assets, and how they deal with the front office/coaching fall out. It certainly wasn’t planned that way but it brought about some things that needed to happen sooner rather than later. If Love can get a double/double with an above average PER for the year, I think they have to be ecstatic about the type of player they received. He’d be the first successful first year 1st rounder in a long time for the squad.
I think the best point you make is that a potential superstar is worth the bad contracts. Even with a guy like Gerald Wallace, you probably have to take something like Mohammed in return. Looking back at the deal, that’s the part I wouldn’t argue again. The contracts are pretty meaningless in the long run if you simply have to trade assets down the line to get the player you want. You end up taking on that salary anyway. Toine’s contract was probably just as easy to move as Collins’ is/was.
Bottom line: I would still do it but if they don’t make good use of Miller and Collins, and if they don’t take advantage of the necessary coaching/front office moves, then it wasn’t worth it at all. It’s almost like a junkie breaking the habit. They needed to make a tough decision and they had to go the safe route to get what needed to be done, done…if that makes sense. If they take Mayo, I think we’re still talking about a team with the same internal issues we’ve complained about for a long time on draft day 09. With the trade, they have greater flexibility and no McHale (in the FO) or Witt (on the bench).
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Utterly random Kevin Love note
Playing around with the Full Court engine on Basketball Reference, I checked for all players that had 8-10 pts/g and 8-10 rb/g their rookie season. There are exactly two: Kevin Love and Charles Oakley. I think I’ll refine my parameters a little…
I think I’d still do the deal (or something similar; e.g., swap with the Clippers—who were rumored to like Mayo a lot—and get back the owed Jaric pick for their trouble). I’m just not much of a Mayo guy. He’s been a tad better than I expected, but his upside still just screams psuedostar to me, meaning he’s not likely to lead a legitimate team and he’s a strong candidate for a franchise-crippling extension down the line. (I think Al’s a bit of a pseudostar, as well, but at least he plays a scarcer position and didn’t sign a max deal.)
As for Love, I like him a lot as a player, and I think he’ll be fine. You got to like a guy who—even when his shot isn’t falling—is still giving you meaningful contributions in important (4 factor) areas. Love leads the league in offensive boards rate and he draws a ton of fouls. And he’s decent on the turnovers, as well.
The problem, as I see it, is the alchemy of Jefferson and Love. I had doubts about this leading up to the draft, but talked myself into it. Now? Early returns don’t seem promising, and we probably have another death match (except with better players) on our hands. Both are 4’s, through and through. Both could benefit from a 7-foot defensive dynamo. Both like to start from the mid post. It just seems like, if it’s going to work, they’ve got a ways to go. Right now I think the sum is less than the parts.
Moreover, I suspect they’d benefit from different personnel. Al’s a straight-up feed-the-post-and-space-the-floor type; I see Love thriving more as a point forward in a driving backcourt-oriented offense. So that’s a problem, too. Eventually you need to choose a direction and have it show on the court (i.e., no more "blueprint").
In the end, though, I think the Wolves definitely picked up an asset with Love. Short of having a franchise cornerstone land in your lap, that’s what you need to do in the draft. How they choose to move forward is anybody’s guess. (My guess, as someone mentioned elsewhere, is they’ll take far too long to make a decison, but that’s the Wolves for you.)
I suspect the current front office is still with McHale in that they want to build around Jefferson. So given that, since this is mega-deal Monday, how bout something like Love for Noah? Love could go to a team in the Bulls and realize his destiny as a dirtywork/do-it-all 4 surrounded by playmakers in the backcourt/wings; Noah offers some similar skills to Love (good passer for size; rebounding) and maybe his superior size/athleticim/defense compensates for Love’s offense/efficiency potential. I think Love’s a more promising player, so maybe you’d need to massage the deal somehow, pick considerations and/or expand the deal or something. But who knows? Not even advocating nor denigrating the idea. Just throwing that out there as I don’t care to discuss losing by 20 to an awful Kings team.
I don't know who said it...
…but you sort of get the feeling that Al and Love are like Harry and Voldemort. Only one can live. I know….lame analogy.
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sssh, don’t say that name out loud!
Beater of the early Thabeet drum
by Wim (Belgium) on Dec 16, 2008 5:12 AM CST up reply actions
I disagree
I think trading Mayo was a tactical setback that resulted in a strategic advantage. First, Mayo would have been up against a huge logjam in the back-court. We’d probably be getting 10-2-1 per game with Mayo, since he’d probably be getting 20 minutes a game, not the 40 he’s getting now. Second, he’s I personally think that he’s pretty much reached his ceiling. He looks like he’s going to be a middle-class Tracy McGrady: you’ll get the same points, rebounds, and turnover %, but none of the assists or ability to play two positions. Third, I have absolutely no doubt that Mayo would have taken off at the end of his contract. Even if the Wolves were using Mayo as well as Memphis is, do you think that the Wolves would have been even a late round playoff team in the next three years? Even if they bottom out, they have tons of flexibility for this offseason. If the Wolves are smart about things, they could have a really nice youth movement and a lot of cap space for the future.
That's a very sensible argument...
… and there’s a lot with which I agree. I’ve always (i.e., since draft day) come down against the trade, but since it’s been made, you’re right that it could still turn out better (or worse) that it looks right now, depending on what we do with our assets. This fact makes it even more important that we find the right decision-maker to translate them into pieces. Thanks for the response, and enjoy the game tonight. It’d be good to see the guys get a win.
My problem with trading Al is twofold
First, there is no way the Wolves are going to get value for him. Sure, Boston could do us a solid and trade Garnett and Pierce for Jefferson, Miller, Collins, Cardinal, and Madsen, but I doubt it’ll happen. The Wolves would probably get a top-level prospect and cap space for him. In a year or two, when Love is on the upswing and we’re sure Pekovic is what we thought he was (and is on his way over), trading Jefferson might not be a bad call. But right now I don’t think there’s any downside to playing out the string for a while longer.
Mayo/Love trade thoughts
One aspect of that trade that I don’t think gets talked about enough is the whole star power aspect. I felt like OJ Mayo could be the guy to bring in more fans, sell seats, and move some serious merch. You may very well be right about Love, but I think that no matter how good he gets, he (or Jefferson) will simply never be a household name or sell tix on their own. After trading Garnett, the Wolves really needed a player like that, and I think OJ could have been that guy. Oh well, what’s passed is past.
From a marketing perspective...
….I think they blew it big time. Mayo was hyped beyond belief and even though it sounds silly, Mayo Clinic could have been put to good use.
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Agreed, that was one reason I thought they would keep Mayo...
… he would’ve put butts in the seats, which I thought would be priority number one for Taylor. The fact that we traded him shows how much power the Hibbing doofus had (has?).

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