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Game Thread

Minnesota Timberwolves vs. Dallas Mavericks

Monday, July 14th, 2008 - 9:00 pm CST

This is the third game for Dallas's Summer League Team (0-2), a mix of rookie free agents, veteran NBAers and unsigned draft picks. James Singleton, Gerald Green, Richie Frahm, Keith McLeod, Yaroslav Korolev, Pops Mensah-Bonsu, and Pape Sow all have NBA experience.

It's also our first shot to see Kevin Love and Rodney Carney in Wolves jerseys. Chris Richard and Corey Brewer are the returners, and particular attention will be paid to point guards Blake Ahearn, Drew Neitzel and Pooh Jeter given the team's need at that position.

Just as a I mentioned with watching Mayo in Memphis's games, let's not get too riled up, one way or another, about how Summer League pans out. I can't remember where, but I recently read something to this effect: Summer League doesn't show you who can play, but it shows you who can't. True enough.

Having said that, it's impossible not to have expectations. What are yours?

POST GAME UPDATE

 

  • Thread over at Mavs Moneyball here
  • Box score here
  • Game recap here (supposedly, at some point)

I didn't get to watch the game, but just looking at the box score, two things stand out:

  • Corey Brewer: 5-18 FG... ... ......
  • Kevin Love: 18pts/13reb. A couple of accounts said that Love had a mediocre game, but a double-double ain't a no show.
  • Neitzel + Jeter + Ahearn: 5 assists/7 turnovers. While the trio of potential point guards scored efficiently, they didn't cut it as floor generals in the box score.

0 recs  |  Comment 32 comments

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Game Thread

Jul 2008 by wyn - 7 comments

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Brewer's Jumper

Wittman said on the radio yesterday that it has looked good in practice. I’d say that’s Step 1. Step 2 would be looking good in the summer league. Step 3 is the real games. Anyway, it’s one of the handful of huge question marks coming into this season. I’m anxious to see improvement.

by Andy G on Jul 14, 2008 10:29 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Point guards

I caught a portion of that interview. But, it was in the background and I was having trouble hearing it through the distractions of a home environment. I thought I heard him addressing the situation at PG next year and indicating that the roster would carry three PG by opening day. Did I hear right? can you elaborate on this if I did?

by Andy B on Jul 14, 2008 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah....

Witt sounded pretty interested in the PG-situation, but also stressed that they want Telfair back. That was good to hear. He said nothing about Longar, or other unknown bigs.

by Andy G on Jul 14, 2008 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

do you have a link...

...to the wittman interview? i was down south all week and i would like to listen to it if it’s podcasted.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 14, 2008 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

this should be it..

http://www.wccoradio.com/pages/3648.php

I think there’s a link there for The Sports Huddle with Sid & Dave

by Andy G on Jul 14, 2008 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

got it...

...thanks. although i will have to suffer through sid.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 14, 2008 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I second...

...Brewer’s jumper, as well as his upper body strength. He needs to be able to guard 3s better this year. I also want to see how well they run the floor with Love, Carney, and Brewer. If Love is making interior passes and throwing outlet passes to Carney and Brewer in stride, those are the types of skills that you can start to pencil in for the regular season when the games start to matter. I’m also interested to see how much Love’s athleticism has improved.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 14, 2008 10:33 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Also very interested in Brewer and am also going to watch his confidence. I felt like that was his biggest problem last year (even also in Summer League) because he also missed some baskets that really were lay-ups and stuff like that.

I’m pretty sure one of these PG’s is gonna be signed to minimum and will only be used whenever Foye or some other PG gets injured. Unless both Telfair and Livingston sign with us, that would also make 3.

Looking forward to tomorrow (time difference is a pain in the ass).

by Wim (Belgium) on Jul 14, 2008 11:49 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Zgoda today

Although the injury to Carney is minor, it’s disappointing to see he may miss today.

http://ww3.startribune.com/blogs/wolves/2008/07/14/summer-league-injuries-impressions/

There’s also the article about Foye chatting with Love about strategy. I know what Love’s question marks are, but I love reading about his strengths.

http://www.startribune.com/sports/wolves/25121744.html?location_refer=Timberwolves:highlightModules:1

by wyn on Jul 14, 2008 11:53 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

It will also be interesting...

...to see how Cupcake plays and how Dwayne Casey coaches. It will be nice to see him at the head of a bench again.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 14, 2008 5:09 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

anyone else...

...trying to watch this game and not finding a link? Should have started 20 minutes ago…maybe it will start late? hope so, if so apologies for the irrelevance of this post.

by plinytheelder on Jul 14, 2008 9:17 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

...now it's telling me...

...I can watch every game except this one? wtf… just watched portland’s scrubs but can’t watch the wolves…

by plinytheelder on Jul 14, 2008 9:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Is the NBA TV replay usually better quality?

I’m watching the feed right now. (Props to Justin Morneau on the home-run derby) I’m wondering if the NBA TV replay at midnight is going to be a higher quality feed. Not a ton of thoughts so far, just trying to take it in. I think Love, even though he’s leading the Wolves in scoring for the half, needs to get a little more aggressive and Brewer needs to settle down a bit. I haven’t watch the entire half real closely due to the home-run derby.

by DrakeSax82 on Jul 14, 2008 10:08 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

can you tell me where

you’re getting the feed? Do I have to be a subscriber to NBA tv to watch? As I said above, it allows me to watch every game except the Wolves.

by plinytheelder on Jul 14, 2008 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You have to...

...sign up for the free access pass.

http://www.nba.com/summerleague2008/scoreboard.jsp?date=07/14/2008

I’m running it on Firefox.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 14, 2008 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

damn...

...that’s exactly what I’m doing. Just tells me the game (only the Wolves game) isn’t available in my area. Hmmmm…maybe they don’t like my neighbourhood.

by plinytheelder on Jul 14, 2008 11:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Wolves...

...are going to be screwed at the point if they have to rely on one of the Pooh Jeter, Neitzel, Ahern crew. Love is having a decent game. A few too many fouls but he clearly can operate athletically at this level. Wow…that was quite the small sample size statement.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 14, 2008 10:42 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

BTW:

I shouldn’t get too far ahead of myself on the Love athleticism thing…he has done a terrible job of moving his feet and that has been the main cause of his fouling.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 14, 2008 10:44 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Love

looked pretty good in one-on-one defensive situations. He doesn’t fall for headfakes and moved his feet pretty well in the 2nd Half. He doesn’t look like a center, though. Fun to overanalyze. I thought the PG’s looked pretty atrocious, especially the turnovers. None should make the team if they play like that this summer.

by Andy G on Jul 14, 2008 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I thought...

...he was especially decent on help defense. Every time someone went into the lane, he would pop out at them. I don’t think I saw Big Al do that all year last season ;)

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 15, 2008 6:59 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The PG?

I didn’t really like any of them on either team. Dallas just seemed to be a summer team that was playing its third game and the Wolves were a summer team on their first. You give them a rematch tomorrow even and I think its a better and closer game. It’d be too bad if anyone got an NBA contract based on that game. It wasn’t total garbage but it didn’t glitter at least not in my eyes.

We need a PG or maybe we just need to let Love outlet the ball after every make. That seemed to at least be interesting.

Brewer still looks out of control a lot. He’s clearly got some skills and I love the heart especially on defense. The offensive game just isn’t there. I just wonder if he’s got it in his head too much that he needs to be better on offense?

On a whole I thought it was fun to watch Love play. I dug watching Richards but he didn’t seem to be confident in my opinion. Watching Brewer I think he’s more and more of a guy who comes off the bench for 15-20 a night to shut down someone on the other team. Right now he just doesn’t look like starting five material to me.

by DrakeSax82 on Jul 14, 2008 11:34 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

My Thoughts while watching the replay..

Kamla called us the “Timbies”, that sounded funny :).

Also didn’t know that Casey was going to coach the Mavs team. They surely were better organised but as already has been said, Mavs are already on their 3rd game. They also shot extremely well. I’m not really sure it was bad defense on our side or just high confidence on theirs.

Jeter also looks TINY compared to Keith McCloud, I knew he was small but …

Overall I liked how Love played. He got some fouls early on and I got the feeling the defensive understanding between him and Richard wasn’t all that good but overall his game was solid, I think he’ll be OK. He’s only 19 and he’s a rookie, given those 2 variables, his game was excellent.
Especially down low though he showed he can get shots from all over.
He also showed he can put it on the floor (twice, though he got called for travelling once, I think he shouldn’t have been whistled on that one) and that he can make others better.
Also got to see one long range pass to Brewer.

I didn’t like how Richard looked. We know his offense isn’t that special (how’s that for an euphemism) but in my opinion his defense should be way way better against this type of competition than what he showed. He should have either gotten more minutes last year or he should have had a longer stint in the D-League. If he doesn’t get enough minutes coming year, he won’t develop and he’ll be out by next year.

Early on, Jeter’s handle looked very shaky, it looks like he’s bouncing the ball almost over his head and seems to fumble even when not really under stress. He improved through the course of the game but I’m not sold on him. We’ll see how it progresses.
The box scores shows 5 assists but that kinda surprised me. I didn’t really feel he set up the offense a lot.

Neitzel, in my opinion, had a much more solid handle. On the other hand, he had no assists and I’m not really sure he was that much of a floor general either. As a 3rd/4th point I like him better than Jeter. He felt like a lesser liability. If either of those 2 makes it on our squad I think it’s gonna be as an emergency sub. No way we’re not getting any other PG. So in an emergency backup role we don’t need someone that can get points (though he did score 4 consecutive baskets on nice Nash-ish jumpers in the second half after attempting about no shots in the first half), we need someone that can damage controle. Don’t lose the ball, bring it up and don’t force it, get the other players the ball. I feel Neitzel, as he played now, fit that picture better.
Neitzel also looked more able to hold his own on defense, but that was just an impression, not sure at all about it.

Both Neitzel and Jeter threw away some balls that really weren’t necessary. Lateral passes and that kind of thing are always dangerous. It might have been the stress of playing on a bigger stage. I haven’t written them off just yet but those kind of throwaways are awfull. We combined for 23 turnoves btw.

There also seems to be some need for working on a system or something. The chemistry isn’t really working. It’s especially clear because the Mavs are clicking on all cylinders. Especially on defense, the rotation is awfull.

Ahearn seems to be a guy with the best chances of earning a spot on some NBA bench. I’m not convinced he’s a point though. If we get someone to play point from this group, I’d like it to be someone with a decent handle, court vision and all those typical PG qualities, not someone who’s main strength is (long range) shooting.
Right after I typed “Ahern can shoot, no doubt” Kamla said “Ahern can shoot the ball, no doubt about that”. So um, he can shoot, better than the box score showed.

Overall, he really looked the best out of the undrafted/D-league pool but it’s kinda sad that he is at the position we have the least need. It’s not that I don’t like a “score-first” PG opposed to a “pass-first” PG. I just don’t think Ahern has the qualities to be either. He’s a SG.

Brewer was the guy I was most curious of watching since I was really high on him in last years draft.
He didn’t look good.
He started out nicely, hit his first jumper from long range, right in the face of his defender and it was really a confidence shot like “oh, you’re gonna give me some space? WAM, in your face”.
Right on the next play he forced a turnover by forcing someone out of bounds and then he hit another nice jumper.
But then he started to get overenergetic. He did get a lot of things by being energetic and active, he got a few times into the paint for layups BUT he got stripped quite a few times and more than not seemed totally out of control.
I wrote down about 4 missed layups but I’m sure there were more. He shot the ball well but I was thinking like .. damn, he would be very nice if he made all of those layups. Maybe he needs to watch some tape on Iverson. Iverson is in my view the master of seemingly flying out of control and laying that ball on the board from all kinds of angles. Brewer also had layups from all sorts of angles but he threw them all over the ring instead of in. Good thing Love was sometimes there to pick it up and get some free throws out of it.

I don’t know where it’s coming from. My first thought would be confidence but seeing him shoot so nicely at the start I’m thinking the problem is that the dosage of his energy is wrong.
In the second half I saw his “leaning forward/sticking ass backward” on his jumper coming back. I think that has something to do with him becoming tired. I think he needs to find a speed at which he is comfortable instead of being in Turbo all the time. He’s like the Tazmanian Devil sometimes…

Longar and the other guys really didn’t show up. It’s not that they weren’t give a chance, everyone got some minutes.

So I’m glad to see Love will turn out nicely but I’m getting more and more scared about Brewer. This guy was the 7th pick last year and he’s missing layups and getting tangled up inside. I’m hoping for some kind of miracle turnaround.
As we expected, the point guard situation just cannot be resolved by undraftees and D-leaguers.

If the guard play stays how it is, I’m hoping we sign both Telfair and Livingston, that would be my best case scenario right now.

Onward to the next game (woah what a long text)

by Wim (Belgium) on Jul 15, 2008 5:08 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

You're right...

...about the guard play…it was atrocious. Brewer also looked like he was determined to take the path of most resistance to the rim.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 15, 2008 7:01 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Brewer is Dennis Rodman

When ROdman was young, he kept trying to develop an offensive game. Unfortunately, even if he could hit a turnaround jump shot early in a game, or hit 20 FTs in a row during practice, once the game got going he was so amped up that the ball would go everywhere.
I would love to see Telfair and Livingston, but do you thing management is willing to turn Randy Foye into a full time SG?

by midlife crisis on Jul 15, 2008 7:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think...

...they’ll turn him this year, but I do think that next year’s draft will depend completely on Foye’s ability to play the point or not play the point. Either they use their 4 1st rounders and other assets to move up and get a point (Rubio, Lawson, Calathes) or scorer (Evans, Derozan).

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 15, 2008 7:55 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Signing both Telfair and Livingston doesn’t mean you have to move Foye over fulltime to the SG. Livingston is probably not ready for a lot of minutes and he could play some other positions too according to need…

We’ll see

by Wim (Belgium) on Jul 15, 2008 8:30 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm really hoping for Livingston...

...I really don’t think the plan is for them to do all that well this year (i.e. lose the Clipper pick) and I don’t think they’re too worried about the backup point spot as we fans are. I’d love to see them pick up Livingston on a 2 year deal and get by on the cheap with someone like Neitzel for this year. If Livingston can work his way up to 15-20 per game by the end of the year, I think it’s worth it…especially if he shows flashes of being able to play again.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 15, 2008 9:09 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's only a practice game, guys.

There is plenty of time for everyone to get their act together.

Any word on our free agent situation?

by Auswolf on Jul 15, 2008 5:34 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

None.

There have been a few notes here and there about Gomes being close, but nothing about the biggest need: PG.

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 15, 2008 7:02 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Watching the NBAtv replay as well

Started watching partway through the 2nd quarter as Dallas was making their huge run. Didn’t catch the Love’s four fouls or Brewer missing seven straight shots though the announcers mentioned it.

Can’t read too much into the blowout. Dallas was just hitting everything, especially from outside, sometimes in the defender’s face. When Love came back in the game, they basically used him to set high screens at the top of the key, and the no-name players decided that they would rather take bad shots than let him touch the ball.

Out of the three point guards, Neitzel looks the most confident handling the rock and running some sort of offense. Ahearn looks terrible, making a lot of bad decisions, especially with shot and drive selection.

Love is extremely strong down low, getting position and snatching boards with authority,. But he seems to be rushing the lay-ins when he could have gotten some and-1’s. His man defense is decent at this point, in the post and guarding drives. Brewer comes back into the game and throws up some garbage shot attempts. It’s as if he decided that he’d be satisfied with just making a move without thinking at all about how to get off a good shot.

3rd quarter now. Love is very active moving without the ball, setting screens. Teammates aren’t using him as much as they should. Throws the famous long outlet pass to Brewer, who draws the foul. Later throws a bad outlet pass behind a guard. Brewer seems to have a problem hitting layups- his passing is ok though. Love throws another nice long outlet off the inbounds, which Brewer finally lays in.

4th quarter. Love has four turnovers that I’ve seen. Two traveling calls, which were borderline. Offensive foul off a drive from the top of the key, and the bad outlet I mentioned. No cause for concern. Nietzel throws a bad pass that leads to a dunk, but then catches fire from the outside. Love is fouled on a three pointer but no call. Announcers like Ahearn for his aggressiveness, but I still think his decision making is questionable and somewhat selfish. Jeter throws away an easy routine pass. The dude guarding him looks like a WNBA player with that ponytail. Love steps out to drain a long jumper. Bricks the next one.

Game over.
Summary:

Kevin Love- skilled, fundamental, team player, tough rebounder.  Surprisingly, was quite quick for a big man.   Should be a good fit for the team.  Only concern is that he seems to have to wind up to get any sort of height on his lift.  I can picture Rasheed Wallace nailing fadeaway jumpers over him all night.

Corey Brewer- Ugly game. Looked like a rookie out of high school.

PG’s- Neitzel seems like he can come into a game without hurting the team. I wouldn’t let the other two anywhere near the roster.

by SidelineTriangle on Jul 15, 2008 6:00 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Nice run down...thanks for the commentary

The World's Leading Exporter of Small Area Quickness
www.canishoopus.com

by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 15, 2008 7:03 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

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