Centrisity
To borrow a term from local blogger Flash, let's take a look at a few numbers of players that Al Jefferson is often cited as having trouble with at the defensive end of the court. The reason for doing this is to build on my post from earlier in the week that talked about playing Al at the 5.
| Off eff | Def eff | Net 48 eff | min | PER diff | iFG | efg | net FTA | |
| Jefferson 4 | 88.0 | 97.2 | -9.2 | 3% | +9.8 | even | 47 | +2.1 |
| Jefferson 5 | 95.6 | 104.6 | -9.0 | 69% | +4.8 | -8% | 50 | +1.1 |
| Howard 4 | ||||||||
| Howard 5 | 107.4 | 100 | +7.4 | 78% | +11.2 | +37% | 48 | +9.1 |
| Amare 4 | 112.5 | 104.5 | +8.0 | 15% | +8.7 | +5% | 56 | +8.4 |
| Amare 5 | 113.6 | 106.1 | +7.5 | 52% | +9.7 | -6% | 60 | +6.7 |
| Chandler 4 | 99.4 | 87.9 | +11.4 | 4% | +7 | +46% | 49 | +2.3 |
| Chandler 5 | 102.5 | 95.4 | +7.1 | 66% | +1 | +34% | 54 | +1.4 |
Before I continue, let me just point out the absurdity of arguing that Jefferson is more suited for the 4 because of his PER positional court time numbers. By the same logic exhibited in the post at the above link, New Orleans fans should be clammoring for Tyson Chandler to play the 4. His sample size is essentially the same as Big Al's and he has about the same differential between PER as does everybody's favorite T-Wolf. Somehow, the Hornets survive with Chandler playing at his "unnatural" position.
Let's continue to take a look at the numbers of these players:
| % of iFG | % of assisted iFG | |
| Jefferson | 47 | 51 |
| Howard | 84 | 68 |
| Amare | 47 | 74 |
| Chandler | 84 | 63 |
One of the things that jumps out with these numbers is the off/def +/- numbers of Jefferson compared to the other players. He carries large negative numbers that would make him seem like an inferior player. However, when you take into account that the Wolves carry a -8.5 stat as a team (compared to +6.6, +6.5, and +6.5 of the other teams), he perfoms about as well as can be expected on a 22 win team with the 27th worst offense and defense in the league.
What you will also notice about these numbers is that Jefferson is able to get his own on a level unmatched by the other players. Part of this has to do with the fact that 2 of these players (Amare and Chandler) play with top flight point guards who can get them the ball in a position to score inside. What the numbers also say is that Jefferson is a more effective offensive player at the 5. The reason for this is that when Jefferson plays at the 5, he takes more shots inside the paint: 55% of his shots are iFGs. When he plays at the 4, only 43% of his shots are iFGs. This is an important stat because when Jefferson shoots from the inside, he carries a 64% eFG. When he shoots jumpers, he only nets a 37% eFG. In other words, the man needs to be kept as close to the low block as possible. By playing the 4 (and granted, this is with a very small sample size), Jefferson may make some defensive gains, but he does so at the expense of his greatest asset: his inside scoring ability. I'll ask it again: How can a 22 win team ask its best player to abandon his best position?
Hitting on this point a little more, Jefferson carried a slightly better net efficiency gain at the 5 compared to the 4. He maintained the same point differential at the 5 as he did at the 4 but he lost a bit with rebounding and FTAs. What does this suggest? If you look at his overall efficiency marks, as well as the team's, it suggests that Al plays better man on man defense at the 5 but it may come at the expense of team d. Where this gets tricky is that his offense is so much more efficient at the 5, that he makes up for any loss in team d by an overall net gain in efficiency. Ultimately, much of his lack of success is tied direcly to the general lack of success of his team. Quite simply, the Wolves sucked.
Moving forward, the best parts of Jefferson's game are geared to the offensive end of the 5: he's a dominant low post scorer who isn't that great of a jump shooter. When he plays the 4, his game is significantly altered to the point that he takes more jumpers and less shots inside the lane. While he gives up a lot more points/100 possessions at the 5, he also scores a lot more and he does so in a more efficient fashion. It is unlikely that he will develop into a dominant man-on-man defender like Howard, or a dominant help defender like Chandler, but it is equally unlikely that either of these players will develop into a dominant low post scorer like Jefferson. Should Jefferson ever be blessed with a lead guard who can get him the ball to the tune of 70-80% of what Steve Nash and Chris Paul do for Amare and Chandler, or should he ever be blessed with a second low post option that would allow him to focus on the low block, his numbers (as well as the team's) should dramatically increase. Here's hoping that Mr. Love can give Big Al what he needs with regards to the latter.
UPDATE: I want to highlight something I said to Wim in the comments. Here's what I think the Jefferson 4/5 debate boils down to:
Do you try to maximize his offensive efficiency or do you try to minimize his defensive inefficiency?
That's pretty much it. I admit there is a certain amount of semantics involved in deciding if he's better off at the 4 or the 5, but this question gets to the heart of the matter. Do you surround him with a defensive-minded frontcourt player or with one that can insure he stays in the low block and does what he does best?
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The only reason we’re talking about this is because the FO decided buying out Ratliff was better than seeing how Jefferson played at the 4. Not that I want to reopen this discussion but it came to mind…
Anyway. I understand where you’re going with the PER stats in saying that Jefferson is a good center. As you saw I agree with that since I put Jefferson at Center for 20minutes and only 18 of his minutes were at PF.
I think it’s kinda getting a matter of semantics here. I think we all agree that Jefferson’s best spot on offense is the low block. No question about that. So he should play best with someone who can play the high post and shoot at least a little. Exactly what Love brings.
The question remains where we want him to play at the other end. It’s possible he’s better suited to defend the other team’s biggest player. They mostly stay a bit more on the low block as well, this might indeed help him in several ways. It might conserve some of his energy (since centers dont move around as much as a PF) and because of his lack of speed he might be better suited not guarding some of the PF’s that have a bit of a longer range shot. I vote for reopening this discussion next year when we hopefully have a little more data on this.
One way or another I stick with my point that the best thing would still be to add a “enforcer” type long center. At least on defense, on offense I would welcome a 7footer that has a bit of a shot too (which I think Peko lacks)? This is because a coach has to have the tools to match up to the other team. While Jefferson might indeed be fine against even those bigger centers, it might be nice to have someone who’s even better at defending centers whenever we need to…
by Wim (Belgium) on Jul 6, 2008 10:29 AM CDT 0 recs
Wim sounds like you need to give Rik Smits a call over there and get him to come out of retirement!
by plinytheelder on
Jul 6, 2008 5:12 PM CDT
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haha lol. Didn’t even know the guy so I had to wiki him. I’m only 21 so when he quit I was only 13 ^^. BTW, The Netherlands, where he’s from, is actually a whole different country than the one I’m living in (Belgium). But you probably knew that right.
by Wim (Belgium) on
Jul 7, 2008 1:49 AM CDT
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yeah but I know you are next door and speak the same language, quite procrastinating and give him a call
by plinytheelder on
Jul 7, 2008 9:55 AM CDT
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I think...
...the question with the Wolves will be what type of system do they want to have going forward? Does the type of offense that they are gearing to play allow for a defensive center? What types of players will get the most out of Jefferson? I think he’s the type of player you can build around and they’ve obviously went all in on this assumption. Do you try to maximize his offensive efficiency or do you try to minimize his defensive inefficiency? I think that’s what this debate boils down to. I’m guessing the Wolves have decided to go with option 1.
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by Stop-n-Pop on Jul 6, 2008 10:51 AM CDT 0 recs
Yea, good assessment. Ideally tough, I think you want to choose between the options, no? For now they indeed picked someon who’s mostly gonna optimize his offense and not really do THAT much of helping his bad defense (although Love is certainly gonna be an upgrade over Gomes on that end). Though I don’t think they went all out on option 1.
Peko ormaybe someone else in the future will be that nr2, which will allow them to choose to either optimize Al’s offense or minimize his bad defense whenever the situation calls for it (like if the opponent has offensive minded bigs with not much defense, we try to minimize his def. ineff. because his offense is gonna be alright on itself .. and vice versa). At least I hope that this is the plan :)
by Wim (Belgium) on Jul 6, 2008 11:04 AM CDT 0 recs
You'll have to give us...
...the low down on EuroLeague action this year. I’m going to see if I can get the on-line pass but with the time difference, the games will be in the middle of my work day. It will be interesting to track players like Pekovic and Rubio.
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by Stop-n-Pop on
Jul 6, 2008 11:12 AM CDT
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I think if you get a league pass
it will allow you to watch the games whenever you want to – at least I know this is how some of the soccer league passes work. Would be pretty cool to come home from work and watch a euro league game while waiting for the wolves game to start!
by plinytheelder on
Jul 6, 2008 5:11 PM CDT
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Yes it would...
...but getting my wife to agree to that would be another story all together :)
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by Stop-n-Pop on
Jul 6, 2008 10:25 PM CDT
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Oh so League Pass not only allows to watch NBA games. It also broadcasts Euroleague? Seriously? Nice..
by Wim (Belgium) on
Jul 7, 2008 1:45 AM CDT
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hate to disappoint you
but coverage of basketball is so bad here in Western Europe. It’s all soccer soccer soccer. The best I get is when the 2 top Belgian teams play against either. We get a 3 minute summary in the middle of sunday afternoon…
Anyway, if you can get that pass or give me a nudge in the right direction I’ll defenitly try to watch all I can and maybe even record it. Shouldn’t be a problem.
And to be completely off topic … this guy has got at least 2 errors in his tatto, no?
by Wim (Belgium) on Jul 6, 2008 12:38 PM CDT 0 recs
that's some serious ink
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by Stop-n-Pop on
Jul 6, 2008 10:11 PM CDT
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Everything that I know about basketball...
says that Al is a prototypical power forward.
by roundhouse on Jul 6, 2008 6:27 PM CDT 0 recs
In size yes...
...but with today’s flavor of combo forward a’la Bosh and Stoudemire, he has a more traditional back-to-the-basket game reminiscent of the 5. KG changed that position (the 4) and I think you’ll see more and more guys like Beasley and Anthony Randolph than you will like Jefferson. It will be interesting to see how much of a mid-range game Al is able to develop. Even guys like West have a much more highly developed middle game than Big Al. West takes over 60% of his shots on jumpers and he hits around 44% of them. Jefferson takes 53% of his shots on jumpers while hitting around 37%. That’s not a ratio geared towards the modern 4. He’s a 10-foot-and-in sort of guy. I suspect that he’ll dip below 50% of his shots off of jumpers this year with Love and Miller on the squad. There’s simply no need for him to take those jumpers if he learns how to pass out of a double team. Everything about Jefferson’s game screams positioning, angles, and good hands, not the overpowering athleticism and length that has overtaken the 4 since KG came into the league.
Look at players like Boozer (54% jumpers with 44% FG), Aldrich (65/41), or uber-outsiders like Lewis (79/54) and Jefferson just doesn’t have the kind of game that can be all that efficient out to mid range like the other modern 4s in the league. I know it sounds counter-intuitive to call him a center, but he’s a back to the basket post player that doesn’t shoot that well from mid range. He’s closer to Chris Kaman and Andrew Bogut than he is Amare and West.
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by Stop-n-Pop on
Jul 6, 2008 10:24 PM CDT
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Small lineup to blame?
How much is the lower team defense (when Al was at center) a function of having to play Gomes at PF at the same time? I noticed on 82games that Gomes’ opponent PER was +5 higher when he was at PF rather than SF.
http://www.82games.com/0708/07MIN9C.HTM
by SidelineTriangle on Jul 7, 2008 3:26 AM CDT 0 recs
That is definitely...
...something to take into account when talking about Love on the roster next year. If Love is an average frontcourt player, Jefferson + Love (should) > Jefferson + Gomes with 4/5 defense.
PER is not the best way to judge positional effectiveness. It’s geared towards offense and it leaves many things on the table as far as team play is concerned. Check out Gomes’ off/def efficiency rates. At the 4 he was -5.2 pts/100 possessions while being -4.9 pts/100 possessions at the 3. He had a pretty even sample size compared to a guy like Jefferson.
What did Gomes in at the 4 was his opponents’ eFG, and rebounding. He got outrebounded by 2 and outshot by 6% at the 4. He just wasn’t a banger and his opponents shot 20% more of their shots from inside than did he.
The Wolves sucked last year and their defensive troubles probably had more to do with the fact they had 1 legit NBA starter (Foye may become one but he wasn’t last year) in their lineup. Gomes is a nice role player/6th man kind of guy, but he’s an average player. If things go as planned this year, the Wolves should have 4 legit NBA starters: Jefferson, Love, Miller, and Foye. I know these guys are either untested or viewed as poor defenders, but as far as play on both sides of the ball goes, they should be able to at least match last year’s defensive efficiency numbers while increasing the offensive ones. Ultimately, the goal for the Wolves should be to have an even in/even out efficiency total next year. Something around 108-109 pts given and taken per 100 possessions would be an improvement on both ends of the ball and it would make them competitive almost every night they took the court.
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by Stop-n-Pop on
Jul 7, 2008 7:43 AM CDT
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...
Fiddlesticks!!!
If Al isn’t a “4”, then I’m a flying monkey. A talented flying monkey, but a flying monkey nonetheless.
P.S. Kevin Love is not a great, or even very good defender. I don’t know where you guys are getting this from… Also, to ask him to guard big PF’s or “small” Centers is going to be a bloodbath on defense, along with Jefferson.
Is it too early to start the Ricky Rubio countdown?
by College Wolf on Jul 7, 2008 4:54 PM CDT 0 recs
Ow yea it’s way too early for that.
Let’s just see how this plays out. For once we might be pleasantly surprised! I’m getting my view of Kevin Love from watching him in college. As I said, he’s not a flashy defender and also not really a specially good help defender but he does not give up post position. That does not show up in any stats and it doesn’t stand out but it does help a lot. Especially when playing bigs that don’t really have a mid range shot. I feel he’s the kind of guy that does the little things on defense that can have an impact.
Sure, he’s not Ratliff or whatever but Love is gonna be such an improvement on offense that any improvement on defense is a very nice extra. By 2010 we’ll probably know if we need another big that plays a little more defense so relax and enjoy this one.
by Wim (Belgium) on
Jul 8, 2008 1:24 AM CDT
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