Talent
One of the developing media themes surrounding this club in the young season is that the Triangle Offense is mismatched to the squad's personnel. Without getting too deep into the matter let me just say this: One of my longtime complaints about the TO is that it achieved fame simply by way of its use on teams that were able to trot out either MJ and Pippen or Prime Shaq and Kobe. These teams could have run the Princeton Motion or Dribble Weave offenses and had success. Ultimately, the big secret about the TO is that it's more about on-court ego management than anything else. When you have guys on the wing like MJ, Pippen, and Kobe, it helps to have a system that puts the ball in their hands quite a bit and with a lot of decision making abilities and positional interchangability along the perimeter. When MJ wants to bring the ball up the court and initiate the offense, you damn better well come up with a catchy name for the system that allows him to do so.
On the flip side of this equation is the Wolves. They are so untalented that it really doesn't matter what they choose to run, it will look like poo. I know that the Laker folks like to talk about the TO like it's some sort of magical voodoo but it's really just a triple post motion based offense that you could use in a high school program. The reason why the Wolves look like they do on offense is because they suck. With Al Jefferson at somewhere in the neighborhood of 75% and Kevin Love on the bench, this team has zero stand-alone starting-quality rotation players. Corey Brewer and Ryan Gomes are nice pieces and both could start with the right sort of talent around them but they are not able to carry an offense for more than a lucky quarter or two at a time.
This team was dismantled with a hacksaw over the summer and it's going to take some time to get a decent level of talent on the roster so that the games are consistently competitive. Yes, there are some issues with player development and chemistry but the bottom line here is talent. When you start Ryan Hollins, Corey Brewer, Ryan Gomes, Jonny Flynn, and Nathan Jawai, your problems are not Triangle-based. When your first three guys off the bench are Oleksiy Pecherov, Sasha Pavlovic, and Brian Cardinal, losing is not just a matter of a lack of effort.
I have been a big fan of a large chunk of David Kahn's moves during his short tenure. What I am not a fan of is his quick trigger in regards to playing the lack-of-effort card. Sorry Dave, you put together a thin team with very little talent that has been knee-capped by an injury to its best all-around player and a continuing rehab with its leading scorer. Effort is nice but this team is overmatched by a mile and they could give the cliched 110% until the cows come home and there would still be nights where they get taken out by 25-30.
Last year I wrote that this season was going to be rock bottom. It had to be. Either they would have kept Mike Miller and Randy Foye and paid them too much in order to be a perennial 7th seed in the WC or they would have traded them and cashed out. They cashed out (a little more than I expected) and now they are left with a roster with 2 bonafide NBA starters...both of whom are out of action right now.
Getting around to last night's game, it was unavailable on TV because FSN was broadcasting Friday Night Fights from Grand Casino. That's right Wolves fans, you are now a notch below boxing. Luckily (or unluckily, depending on how you look at it) for me, League Pass came through with the Mavs' broadcast team's coverage of the tilt. Here is what you missed:
- The Mavs have the best alternate uniforms in the league. They didn't wear them last night but they did show a few shots of a jersey they are giving away in a contest.
- The Mavs' sideline reporter went into the audience and asked the following question of a fan: "Which city is worse: Minnesota or Milwaukee?" Thankfully the fan looked at him like the idiot he was and replied "Minnesota isn't a city." Perhaps George W. Bush's reference to the country of Africa wasn't as isolated of a Texas event as we first thought.
- One more Mavs TV nugget: Dirk and Jason Terry had one of the goofiest promo commercials I have ever seen. Google around for "Dirk" and "road trip" and maybe you will find it.
- The Wolves have a solid chance at setting some club records for futility this season. They have already tied the record for worst loss and most points given up; they have twice come close to setting the record for the fanchise low in field goal percentage (.296). Last night they flirted with this number until midway through the 4th quarter. They also had an eFG of .343. That's awful. With a few more 3 attempts (and misses) they could have probably staked claim to the worst shooting night in franchise history. The lowly game against the Mavs on 2.2.07 (the .296 night) saw an eFG of .327. I remain confident that the Wolves can have a game with a sub-.300 eFG. Since 86/87 there have been 121 games with a fg% below .300. There have been only 95 with a FG% and 3P% below .300. Go Wolves go!!!
The game flow for last night's tilt can be found here. Four Factors are here:
| Pace | Eff | eFG | FT/FG | OREB% | TOr | |
| Dallas | 98.0 | 90.8 | 42.4% | 20.0 | 22.0 | 17.3 |
| Minnesota | 78.6 | 34.3% | 18.0 | 20.7 | 12.2 |
Mavs perspective: Mavs Moneyball
College ball is now in full swing and we will soon roll out our first college draft boards. One of these years I hope to hold off on talking about the draft until...oh, say, March or April. A man can dream, can't he?
That about does it for last night's game. Next up: Memphis, where we could see another Golden State style beat down with Rudy Gay and OJ Mayo leading the way out on the wing.
Until later.
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69 comments
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Comments
that video clip was so goofy it just has to be goofy on purpose … Be as it may, that was a big laugh (opposed to all the car-insurance and the lady who tells you they cut her hours in half … in HALF .. OMG .. ahum).
Overmatched overmatched overmatched … starting Hollins and Jawai says it all. Not even that but if those two are starting … who are your bench players .. awtch.
Also thought (and I thought this last game as well) the refs don’t respect our players. On one particular stretch Sessions gets rammed in mid-air and flings away (no call) that triggers a fast break run to the other end where one of the Mavs gets a whistle with very slight contact.
I have to say I’m not a real expert on the fine details of bball rules (as I have almost exclusively played bball on the playerground) BUT I did find a lot of wacking happend on the offensive side of the court without getting any calls…
Official Kahn/Rambis band-wagon rider since 2009
by Wim (Belgium) on Nov 14, 2009 9:49 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Sadly, if you are a bad team, you will get zero respect from the refs. That’s the way it’s been since the rebuild, and the way it will stay until we get some star power.
When I get sad, I stop being sad and be awesome instead. True story.
by Xand1 on Nov 14, 2009 10:17 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
the guy in the stands
was legit funny but the game announcers were massive lamers.
by TMiss on Nov 14, 2009 7:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Talent and Other Factors v. Plays
I am in the camp that is skeptical that the plays and sets are a huge factor at the NBA level. Obviously players can’t just be standing around, but it’s a lesser factor.
Talent is the greatest determining factor for who wins, but coaching and roster-building play a factor as well. Players’ games should mesh together (roster-building). And players need to be focused, motivated, and put in positions to succeed. I’ll probably get slammed for this, but I think McHale showed every sign in a short period of time that he had aptitude in these areas. Too early to evaluate Rambis with the injuries and supporting roster Kahn has handed him (Jawai, Wilkins, Hollins, etc.) – but he has to prove he can do it.
by Punisher#8 on Nov 14, 2009 9:54 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
You're right about McHale
But I think McHale emphasize to a fault player matchups and player strengths. What I mean by this is that he let his guys do what they do and rode that to as many victories as possible (and if McHale was coaching this squad right now we’d have more victories as a result). What he wasn’t good at was when there were no favorable matchups. He lived and lost on whether Craig Smith was a mismatch (good or bad), whether Foye was a mismatch (good or bad). That was it. Rambis, I believe, is not coaching to that quite yet because he’s trying to establish a baseline system that guys can fall back on when nothing’s working. It’s brutal and ugly right now, but I think there’s something to be said for establishing a systematic foundation for playing together and playing well whether or not your two best players are available, and whether or not your shot is falling. That is how good teams continue to win (because even talented players have off nights), and part of the reason why bad and mediocre teams can never seem to quite get over the hump (Golden State has talent but no system, per se, whereas the Rockets and Jazz have a strong system that helps bail them out when they’re on the wrong side of the talent equation).
"Come on Eddie, let's get serious."
by biggity2bit on Nov 14, 2009 3:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I hear you. I'm just in "Jury's Out" mode on Rambis right now.
It has worked for the Rockets and Jazz. But guys like Adelman and Sloan are hard to come by. I am (obviously) rooting for him to pull it off.
by Punisher#8 on Nov 14, 2009 3:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Good update
Thank you. In the process of pointing out that the Wolves would have been unlikely to get the 7th seed even with Foye and Miller, I discovered that the current 7th seed in the West is none other than the Sacramento Kings, at 5-4, on a 4 game winning streak, and doing it all without their 30 points per game from the injured Kevin Martin. So if you needed another reason to resent the current state of the Wolves, well, you’re welcome.
In another vein, with Love still out and Al Jeff coming back slowly, any room on the roster for the rebounding madness of Pops Mensah-Bonsu, recently released by the Rockets?
Finally, no talk of the draft and the Wolves will be complete without noting their odds of choosing point guard John Wall with their lotto pick, thereby ‘sploding the heads of every doosh who complained about "KAHN’S DRAFTING ALL POINT GARDS
by PoorDick on Nov 14, 2009 10:13 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Sac's been doing it on offense
and especially on the offensive glass. They are getting outshot, but are getting 2nd chance points and getting to the line better than their opponents. Jason Thompson seems to be emerging.
Tyreke Evans has been doing well; hasn’t shot well, but gets to the line and has a pretty good A/TO ratio for a rookie.
by Eric in Madison on Nov 14, 2009 10:55 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It sounds like
somebody (Evans?) lit a fire under former Timberwolf great Beno Udrih, as well. I wonder if their success without Martin continues, will they be tempted to move Martin? And what would the guy’s value be?
by PoorDick on Nov 14, 2009 11:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He's still the guy I want
though the injuries are starting to wear on me.
by Eric in Madison on Nov 14, 2009 11:15 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The reason the Kings are taking off is becuase they moved Tryeke to shooting guard
It’s his natural position, and with both him and Udrih on the floor, the ball movement is 10x better than before.
The problem with using Evans as a point guard is he’s not a natural facilitator, and neither is Martin. Kevin is talented enough to get his shots off against anyone, but where does that leave the rest of the team? All their other players need their plays created for them.
If you look at the boxscores from before Martin went down to after he went down, the difference is night and day. When KMart was healthy, only he and Evans were scoring. After he got hurt, everyone started getting involved, and the Kings started winning.
by Oceanary on Nov 14, 2009 11:59 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You know Kahn's draft plan was
to pick Evans and Flynn. Oh, what could have been. The rebuilding process would have been accelerated by at least one year!
by Rumblebee on Nov 14, 2009 3:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
"Triangle"
A triangle has three points. A basketball team has five players.
Maybe Rambis should make some adjustments and call his creation “The Pentagon Offense.”
by medicineball on Nov 14, 2009 10:45 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
how about..
…the pentagram?
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 11:05 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
triangle offense is easy. honestly I coach aspects of it with a jr high team. (pinch post) our issue is clearly talent.
we need evan turner. trust me here snp.
by revprodeji on Nov 14, 2009 11:05 AM CST via mobile reply actions 0 recs
i've been saying...
..turner + aldrich for over a year now….i completely agree. i still want rudy gay or thad young (now that josh smith and trevor ariza are taken). you can’t have enough athletic swing men.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 11:07 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i think a lot..
….of the bs surrounding phil jackson and his “zenness” is hilarious. he strikes me as a guy who isn’t nearly as smart as he thinks he is.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 11:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
that being said..
….he’s still a fantastic coach and the winning speaks for itself….i just think the zen stuff and the deference to the triangle is nonsense.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 11:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I see the point of his zenness.
And of the triangle. If the team gets used to making the right pass and playing the right way all the time, with a coach who pretty much always treats them the same, they’ll get very practiced at playing a certain way. Do anything a million times and you get very good at it.
Then, when it’s crunch time, the players aren’t going to panic, and they’re going to know what to do, because this time is just like every other moment of their basketball season.
The players don’t panic in a normal time out situation when the coach doesn’t call timeout, cause Phil will often not call time out in those situations. The players know that they have to be aware of stuff for themselves, and they’ve had practice doing it.
by Princely Frank on Nov 14, 2009 11:24 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Also, I liked his book.
The first one, I haven’t read his book about the final Lakers season.
by Princely Frank on Nov 14, 2009 11:25 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Like Joe Torre
I think what Phil is best at is what Joe Torre is best at, and that is managing and motivating big ego’s. All the ‘zen-ness’ and what not is just media filler, to me. It’s something that’s important to Phil personally and therefore influences how he behaves, but anything I read about his actual coaching always comes down to how he understands his players and their personalities so well that he knows exactly the right button push at the right time. Even guys like MJ have to respect someone who knows how to get the most out of their alread All-World talents where other coaches might be helpless.
"Come on Eddie, let's get serious."
by biggity2bit on Nov 14, 2009 3:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure he
even thinks he’s that brilliant (he is from North Dakota, after all). But it’s not really in his interest to tell people they’ve got it all wrong, and anybody could have won with the rosters of the Bulls, Lakers, or the Isabella Fighting Cocks.
by PoorDick on Nov 14, 2009 11:22 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
my view of him...
…is that if he were 5’7" he would be the guy in tie dye working in an old used book store in Minot telling everyone about the unpublished novel rattling around in his head.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 11:31 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
In this scenario
would he still be dating Jeannie Buss?
by PoorDick on Nov 14, 2009 12:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
he'd...
Be shacked up with some gal who got booted from the air force base for smoking dope.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 12:53 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Yes and...
He would indeed have been that guy which is part of what makes him so enjoyable, I think. That guy is an NBA coach and winner of 10 championships. It’s pretty hysterical. :)
But it’s also important to recognize how rare his talent with high level egos is. Shaq has crashed and burned so many other places. Kobe had been a royal pain in the tuckus. Jordan struggled playing with his team. Not to mention Pippen and Rodman being difficult for other coaches to handle.
Or to put it differently: imagine Phil coaching T-Mac, AI or Marbury. I don’t know if he would have won a championship with any of them, but I bet he would have gotten them to be a part of winning more games.
I think his strength is more his basic personality than zen or the TO. He genuinely isn’t that rattled by things, he’s pretty intelligent (by coach standards), he doesn’t take basketball too seriously and yet he’s also very competitive. It’s been a good mix for a coach in the modern era dealing with players who earn 100s of millions of dollars and are high level celebrities.
by Django Z on Nov 14, 2009 12:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Evan Turner
looks like the next Dwayne Wade. He and Gay on the wing would look great. And have Brewer and Gomes coming off the bench
by PoohRichardson on Nov 14, 2009 11:10 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The next Scottie Pippen is more like it
He doesn’t have the ups or volume scoring talent Wade does. But he’s 6’7", still pretty athletic, and can score, rebound, facilitate and defend all at high levels.
Seems like a perfect fit for the triangle, yes?
by Oceanary on Nov 14, 2009 12:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Flynn not an NBA starter?
Maybe we should have traded down for Eric Maynor.
by PoohRubio on Nov 14, 2009 11:18 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Oh, Surrrrrrrre
I think after ten games, with a new coach, new GM, new offense, injured best all-around player, hobbled leading scorer, a roster designed more for flexibility than to win games, we can safely and most-assuredly say that we should not have drafted 20 year old Jonny Flynn and his 15 pts 3 Ass 3 Reb average, and should have indeed traded down in a very weak draft and picked up 22 year old Eric Maynor, who has mostly been DNP’d this season, and when he does play, has at least five teammates who are healthier and better than the best teammate of Jonny Flynn, and is coached by the man who could leave the game with the most wins in NBA history.
Seriously?
by PoorDick on Nov 14, 2009 12:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
One of our sarcasm meter's is off
I think PoohRubio was questioning SnP’s remark about the lack of starters.
Actually, he’s right. It’s still way to early to decide what Flynn is—whether he’s a capable NBA starter or not. I have hopes.
by Eric in Madison on Nov 14, 2009 12:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, I'll take the blame
and go lie down for awhile.
by PoorDick on Nov 14, 2009 12:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
not right now hes not
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 12:55 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
I'm worried about his turnovers
He’s currently sitting on a negative asst/to ratio….
by Oceanary on Nov 14, 2009 1:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He's showing solid potential though
His jumper is better than I thought it would be and he’s shown he can get to the rim. I also see the defensive potential Kahn gushed about in the offseason. He gets in a great position defensively and can really get up in his man’s grill. His biggest problem is defensive awareness; he loses his man way too often. I attribute this to playing the Syracuse zone for two years. But this is all part of the learning curve and I’m sure he’ll improve. The lack of assists seems like a combination of the offense they’re running, the lack of teammates that can actually convert his passes, and his own average floor vision. I don’t think he’ll ever be a league leading assist-man, but I would hope to see them trend up over time.
by Rascal Flatts on Nov 14, 2009 2:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think
A snapshot scouting write-up of Flynn right now would be really helpful because I think how he’s playing in the final 10 games of the season will be quite different. We can bemoan the A/TO ratio, lack of assists, defensive lapses and what have you, or we could look at him and ask the question, “How would any of the other rookie PGs be handling Flynn’s situation right now? And would you be as confident in their ability to handle the confidence and mental part of it?”
Flynn is kind of in a no win situation right now: he’s not being allowed to play to his strengths, he’s being asked to learn a completely new offense AND defense, he’s trying to figure out where he stands in the NBA pecking order on his own team, his coach is experimenting daily with the starting five and bench rotation, and he’s on a team that has no high performing established star and no other starting caliber veterans to help bail him out. I think Flynn we must recognize and commend Flynn for taking this all on and not failing miserably, for performing at a promising level with effort, and for performing quite consistently at whatever level that may be.
Would Flynn look (and perform) much better in McHale’s system or another team’s system? Probably in the short term, but I think his long term prospects also look very very good. You put a guy like him on a team like Portland, Denver, the Lakers, or Rockets and he would make them clearly better. Is he a CP3 type? Perhaps not, but let’s remember that CP3 is a once in every 10-15 years type player. I think Flynn certainly could be the starting PG on a championship caliber roster, tho. He’d look quite good playing for Orlando, Cleveland, LA, or Denver.
"Come on Eddie, let's get serious."
by biggity2bit on Nov 14, 2009 3:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He will be at least an average PG in a few years...
..Acceptable for the #5 pick in a supposedly weak draft. He is already good at many things that can’t be taught like driving to the basket. He appears to have the personality type where he wants to and will go out of his way to master the cerebral parts of being a PG. From all accounts he will also be a leader.
by Rumblebee on Nov 14, 2009 3:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Really, the triangle just needs to be adjusted
It can work with any roster (well, any talented roster…)
I mean, the original triangle was set up as a guard’s system….Pippen, Jordan, and guys like Shaw and Kerr….ball swung around the perimeter, big men played in the high post.
Then was massively adjusted for the Lakers because of Shaq, and now Bynum and Gasol. So now it’s become a big man system. Ball entered into the high or low post first, swung through the box area, the kicked out to shooters.
So what Rambis needs to do is adjust it again to make it a point guard system. Question is, can he do it without Tex Winters?
There’s really no magical formula to it, and it’s not particularly hard to understand. It’s just hard to execute because it’s a very heady brand of basketball that forces players to read defenses and make dynamic decisions, and with a team as young as ours, they just aren’t at the level of intuitively finding gaps in the defense.
Right now we’re running the triangle as a teaching tool, because it forces teamwork, communication, and builds basketball IQ. It’s a long term approach….if we just wanted to put points up, we’d let Jonny run pick-and-roll every play like Chris Paul does, but that wouldn’t teach the team any teamwork or discipline….it’d just box them up into limited roles, and as we can see from the Hornets this year, when players are traded or stop playing their roles, that whole system breaks down. The triangle, on the other hand, it completely sustainable.
by Oceanary on Nov 14, 2009 11:42 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Agree
The main thing that Jackson’s teams have usually done is combine the offense with guys who could play D the most effectively and make teams pay no matter what defense was being played. They needed the upper level talent but also needed the role players to make good plays on both ends. What Jackson’s said repeatedly is that the mentality of the players is the biggest adjustment that needs to be made when shifting to such an offense.
by pagingstanleyroberts on Nov 15, 2009 2:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Triangle makes sense for Flynn
I don’t see any way J-Fly can be a starting PG in this league in a conventional offense, but he could be very good in the triangle. So long as our cart is hitched to him, I think the triangle is the way to go.
by Django Z on Nov 14, 2009 12:16 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
?? I see plenty of reasons Flynn would be a starter for any team
All that’s holding him back is limited minutes and an offense with a high learning curve. His scoring ability is off the charts….it rivals guys like Tony Parker and Chris Paul.
by Oceanary on Nov 14, 2009 12:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, he is a very good scorer.
But he’s 5’ 11 1/4" tall (w/o shoes at the draft combine).
He is not a great passer and turns the ball over at a high rate.
I would be GIDDY if he were 6’4" or taller. But he isn’t.
I can’t think of many NBA stars who are that height and have his strengths and weaknesses. That’s my concern. Still a decent pick at his draft position, but not a stud.
by Django Z on Nov 14, 2009 5:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but Chris Paul and Tony Parker also both weigh in at 180lbs
Jonny weight in at nearly 200.
And scoring wise, Jonny’s almost equivalent to Paul. 20ppg to Paul’s 22ppg, both on slightly less than 50% shooting.
If the size worries you, then I’d say look at the success players like Aaron Brooks, Jameer Nelson or Juan Barea enjoy.
Or Chris Paul. Because really, a half an inch taller and 15 lbs lighter basically makes him the same size.
by Oceanary on Nov 14, 2009 6:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Doc Rivers
Can’t find the link anymore, but Doc Rivers recently told some reporter that he kids Rondo about how Rondo wouldn’t have been able to hack it back when Doc played. That was the golden age of the large PG, but since hand checking was forbidden on the perimeter the trend has shifted back to small, quick guards.
Flynn will be fine. He’s very quick, has great strength and explosiveness, and I think his turnovers and passing will both improve. It’s been 10 games in a new system, blah blah blah. If anyone can tell a guy’s future career off that, they need to be running a team.
"Come on Eddie, let's get serious."
by biggity2bit on Nov 14, 2009 7:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Different issues
I’m not saying Paul and Flynn have different body sizes, I think Flynn is certainly a bigger build and will probably weather the physical aspects of the NBA fine.
But Paul and Flynn aren’t in the same universe of PG skills.
You can be 6 ft tall and be a superstar…if you can pass AND score like CP3. But you can’t do just one of those at that height and be a star. I suppose Iverson is one of the few modern exceptions and he was a better passer than Flynn and also my least favorite “star” in the last 20 years. I’d never want him on a team I was rooting for.
by Django Z on Nov 15, 2009 3:34 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think Parker and Paul are good comparisons to make the point.
Both were better PGs in their rookie year:
Paul – 7.8 APG / 2.2 TO
Parker – 4.3 APG / 1.9 TO
Flynn – 3.3 APG / 3.4 TO
Plus Parker has two inches on Flynn and even lil’ CP3 has a half inch.
by Django Z on Nov 14, 2009 5:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Are you really happy with the sample size?
And Parker was dishing off to future HOFers Duncan and Robinson.
by nextmove on Nov 14, 2009 5:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
10 games says something
I’m surprised a negative Ast/TO ratio isn’t causing much of a blip on anyone else’s radar.
We’re not pretending Tyreke Evans is a PG, right? Why should we pretend Flynn is.
The problem is that Tyreke can probably play SG just fine and Flynn’s position if it isn’t PG is pretty troubling.
by Django Z on Nov 15, 2009 3:42 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think that’s a little quick to make that statement. I’m surprised people on here aren’t a little more jacked about Flynn. The fact that he can really score so early is one of the few bright spots we’ve got.
by LoveTo on Nov 14, 2009 12:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i like him more than i thought i would...
…But who else is going to score some of these points?
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 12:57 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
…(crickets)…
"Come on Eddie, let's get serious."
by biggity2bit on Nov 14, 2009 3:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Can't wait for the draft
Good post about the TO and our team.
This year is going to be painful. It makes me somewhat upset that i got the NBA All-Access package. That said, it will be good to KLove and Flynn grow and get better. But June can’t come soon enough
by pescatello on Nov 14, 2009 12:29 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I disagree with your opening paragraph
While I agree that the triangle isn’t some sort of magic solution (and to their credit, I’ve not heard Kahn or Rambis describe it as such), I think you’re underselling the wing issue. The triangle is built around wing play, and even if you disagree, you have to admit that Rambis has built the team around it. Jefferson and Pechovic, the two PF/Cs that have the most shots, are taking theirs during with 16-20 seconds burnt of the shot clock; i.e. they’re not the first options. Flynn and Sessions are taking over 50% of their shots in the first 10 seconds, meaning they’re scoring on fast breaks and mis-set defenses. Now compare that to the burn that Brewer’s gotten (first in minutes, and will be first in field goal attempts after tonight), despite being an awful offensive player. Currently we have two players (Pecherov and Flynn) shooting above the Efg% average; neither of them is a wing. Our best shooting wing is Ryan Gomes, currently hitting 40% of his shots (though 50% on a small sample of threes).
The reason I’m harping on offense is simple, this team has a better Defensive Rating than last year’s team (109.4 vs 111.4), but has fallen off a cliff Offensively (94.5 vs vs 106.1). For those keeping track at home, that’s a 9.6 difference in Rating Difference, which is entirely due to the offensive falloff. It’ll get better when Kevin Love returns (though I have nightmares about him returning next week; what a horrible, horrible idea), but as of right now the only reason the Wolves aren’t in last on offense is because of the New Jersey M*A*S*H and because someone thought letting Larry Brown build his dream roster would be a good idea.
Now, is talent lacking on the team? Yes, yes, yes. Do they need an upgrade everywhere except for point guard and perhaps PF? Yes, yes, yes. But that doesn’t mean they’re not using a system that highlights their weaknesses.
by McCleak on Nov 14, 2009 12:40 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Question
Where are you getting those shot clock shot stats from? I’d love to see them.
"Come on Eddie, let's get serious."
by biggity2bit on Nov 14, 2009 3:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Offense...
…is definitely the big problem right now (aside from the talent thing).
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 6:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Quick question
SnP (or others)-is there anything that we should be looking for that will portend better things in the future? What I mean is, what are the signs we should be looking for that will tell us the offense is starting to come around? Better ball movement (assists?), better looks, etc? Or do we simply need to start making the shots we’re already taking at something better than a historically bad rate?
"Come on Eddie, let's get serious."
by biggity2bit on Nov 14, 2009 7:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
trades....
…and lots of them ;)
in all seriousness, the only way they’ll do better is by getting to the line more. bad shooting teams who don’t pass well need to be able to score from the line and this team just isn’t getting to the line like it was during the preseason.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 7:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Coaching styles
The jury is, of course, out on what kind of coach Rambis will become. I tend to think that teams will be successful if they have enough talent and if they respect the coach and buy into whatever plan he has. I do think McHale did have talent in those areas. Players seemed to enjoy playing for him (& I don’t think of it in a ‘taking advantage of the situation’ sense). There are many possible ways for the Wolves to be successful. What is so frustrating is having the team dismantled so completely, where the possibility of any true success is far, far away. When we are 10 games into a season and posters are commenting that June can’t come soon enough, or that they are glad they don’t have the league pass so that they can watch their team, it is a truly depressing state of affairs. I believe that we will pull out of this only through a great draft, and the Wolves have zero history of being able to do that.
by ogishkemuncie on Nov 14, 2009 1:30 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
So what was the follow-up question
after the reporter was informed that Minnesota isn’t a city?
by museum on Nov 14, 2009 1:36 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
there wasn't one
he had the good sense to stop
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
by Stop-n-Pop on Nov 14, 2009 6:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The best thing Kahn could do to lift our spirits is make a major trade...
…that helps us significantly without costing us anything important.
But the chances of doing that in a way that doesn’t end up being detrimental to us in the long run is slim, which is why the smart thing right now is to wait until the deadline when teams start getting desperate to add a final piece or burn off cap space.
by Oceanary on Nov 14, 2009 1:38 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Although the Grizzlies, as always, seem ripe to be suckered
Rudy Gay? Hasheem Thabeet? Darrell Arthur? Sam Young? That team is stacked with talent (God knows they don’t have any idea how to use it though…)
Hell, I’d take Iverson’s contract off their hands if it meant getting Gay and either Thabeet or Arthur.
by Oceanary on Nov 14, 2009 1:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That wouldn't be a bad deal
but I think those types of players will be available at most junctures. I don’t think POBO will burn any assets on a slightly-above replacement value player until at least after 2010’s festivities have concluded—unless he sees that player as being one step closer to getting Mr. Max.
by PoorDick on Nov 14, 2009 1:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I totally agree with the comment about Kahn and effort
Just read his open letter on Zgoda’s blog. I have appreciated Kahn’s previous openness and letters, but this one was too soon and at the wrong time with the players current sidelined. The letter is also hollow unless it is followed by a personnel move that shows he irritation should the current below expectations performance continue. I’m sure he is trying to placate the season ticket holders and those who don’t believe in “The Plan” but he needs to be careful.
I liked the Bush/Texas reference.
Let the draft talk begin, at least until Love is restored!
by Rumblebee on Nov 14, 2009 3:31 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

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