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Surprise: Tyler Hansbrough is as big as Griffin
according to DraftExpress numbers, Hansbrough is 1/4 inch shorter than Griffin and has a slightly longer wingspan and slightly higher standing reach. They are not the same player of course, but the knock on Hansbrough as undersized seems to leak water. Would that tend to move him up in the draft?
Thoughts
- Hopefully this puts to rest any notion that James Harden is somehow undersized for a 2. Between his natural height and wingspan, length will not be an issue for him.
- This also confirms the fact that Curry kept growing in college, now standing a legit 6"3 in shoes. He could definitely play off the ball a little bit, especially against NBA backup 2’s. And he has plenty of size to play the PG. I still love the idea of Curry playing PG defensively, then on offense being able to play off the ball with a bigger guard orchestrating the offense. Curry should have plenty of open looks with shorter PG’s chasing him all over the court off of multiple screens.
- DeRozan’s wingspan is a bit disappointing considering his natural height. I think this douses a little cold water on the idea of him being a 3. Size-wise, I’d love to see him at the 2 where he can use his height to get good sight-lines to the hoop playing against shorter 2-guards defending him. He should be able to rise up from anywhere on the floor to take that mid-range jumper.
- Flynn is as short as Lawson, yet has passed him up on a lot of mocks. Lawson had one of the best years EVER for a D-1 PG last season. I thought height was the only thing holding him back, yet a guy like Flynn overtakes him. I don’t get it….
- This is really going to help Hansborough’s stock. He is has legit 4 size and defensively can probably stay with a lot of the face-up 4’s in the NBA. He could end up being a rich man’s Brian Cardinal.
- Griffin is taller than I thought, but his height is sort of mitigated by a pretty short wingspan (as referenced above by timmugs). Still, his hops should give him plenty of verticality.
- Daye is a long glass of water for a 3. He has to be in play at #18 for us.
- I love Mullens’ overall length. 9"3 is very long. The issue with him is his instincts and effort defensively. I don’t know if he’ll ever be able to put his physical gifts to good use on this end of the floor.
The problem with Daye
- Is that he wighed in at 192 lbs for a guy who’s 6’11", that is is one skinny young man.
- Flynn had an inch longer standing reach than Lawson, is more athletic in that he can stand flat footed under the rim and dunk, but I agree with your assessment that Lawson had a historically ridiculous season last year. Ultimately, if we go SG with #6, Lawson at #18 would be a heckuva pick IMO. His injury concerns though are relevant, have to get a doctor to evaluate those feet.
- Ty Lawson participated in last year’s combine and according to the numbers, grew an Inch last year. I would think that would help him.
- Blair will have to thank the genetic gods for his wingspan, because he measured short.
Here is an interesting Nugget from DX Blog
Check out all of our measurements and see how prospects in this class stack up with players in our database from the last 10+ years. Keep in mind that you can sort them by position and by where they were drafted with the help of the drop-down menus on top.
Opinions on how important measurements really are vary greatly, but they are still widely anticipated both by NBA draft fans and talent evaluators, as they present a completely objective way of comparing prospects against each other. Here is a quick look at some of the interesting facets of this year’s measurements.
First, and perhaps most importantly, this year’s measurements were taken early in the morning. As the day wears on, the back compresses making a person slightly shorter in the evening than in the morning. When looking at the three North Carolina players and how they measured out last year without shoes compared to this year, we see some serious growth.
Ty Lawson 08 Ht: 5’10.75 09 Ht: 5’11.25 08 Reach: 7’9.5 09 Reach: 7’10.5
Danny Green 08 Ht: 6’4.5 6*09 Ht*: ‘5.25 08 Reach: 8’4.5 09 Reach: 8’7
Wayne Ellington 08 Ht: 6’3.75 09 Ht: 6’4.25 08 Reach: 8’5.5 09 Reach: 8’4
As you can see, all three players measured out a half-inch taller this year than last year. While we’re not going to change the numbers, it may be best to view this class as a half inch shorter than their listed measurement compared to last year’s class. We’ve seen some fluctuation happen in the past too, but not quite as pronounced as this year. For the purpose of the discussion below, we’re considering the numbers to be legitimate.
If this is the case, Griffin’s measurements become more glaring at it explains Flynn being over 6 feet, Lawson seeming taller, and Hansbrough looking like a legit Power Forward. Take an inch away from Blake Griffin’s standing reach and he measures out similar to Shane Battier and Al Thornton and would have the shortest standing reach of any PF prospect since they began taking measurements.
- Hopefully this puts to rest any notion that James Harden is somehow undersized for a 2. Between his natural height and wingspan, length will not be an issue for him.
Yeah. We’ve all been talking about how the Wolves could really use Evans’ length in the backcourt. Well, according to this, Evans and Harden are the same height, and Evans only has 1/2" longer arms.
I’ve thought for a while Harden could be a worthy target. Out of all the wing prospects, his game is maybe the most NBA-ready already at 19 years old, he’s the most inside-out wing in the draft, he’s got solid character, and his size seems fine (he actually looks like he has plenty enough size when you watch him play, too). I MIGHT actually consider offering the Kings the #6 and #18 to move up for him, if necessary. The Kings could then select Jennings and pick up a mid-round scratch ticket for their trouble. And for the Wolves, the NBA draft is all about quality over quantity, anyway. I just don’t have a good feeling about Derozan or Evans. Curry could maybe be a nice second option, but as his role in the NBA is probably TBD, I’m a little leery of him.
Then I work the phones about the available Tyrus Thomas to be the athletic backup big… I’d prefer him over Mullens, anyway.
I completely agree...
… I would trade the 6 and the 18 for a chance at Harden at the 4. I have the same reservations about DeRozen and Evans and share your optimism about Harden. I think he’s the guy to target.
I don't know
- is looking better and better all the time. I’m convinced our #18 pick has nearly as good of a chance of panning out into a great player in this draft as #6. Teague, Lawson, Daye….They may all be there at #18 and you can’t say with a straight face that Harden is clearly going to be a stud. Keep in mind these measurements do nothing to erase the fact that Harden still has a pretty slow first step and struggles with his mid-range game – something all high scoring 2-guards need in their arsenal. Don’t get me wrong, I like James Harden as a prospect, just not enough to give up another draft dart that may hit bullseye.
by Rascal Flatts on May 30, 2009 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Meant to say #18 is looking better and better all the time....
by Rascal Flatts on May 30, 2009 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Well, a lot depends on how the Wolves evaluate these guys. I would do it, because I’m just not that crazy about the depth in this draft at all. But that’s me. Any prospect that lasts until pick #18 is going to have some serious question marks, but if they’re happy with the depth up top (e.g., they don’t see much drop off from a guy like Harden to a guy like Tyreke Evans), then they can probably stay at #6 and #18, and hope to land 2 quality young players.
My own personal belief is the NBA draft is wholly unique from, say, the NFL draft. The talent pool is just so much deeper in the NFL than it is in the NBA, and things are so “schemy” in that game, that its now proper strategy to trade down given the chance.
In the NBA, conversely, with talent so scarce, I think it’s sound to try and target 1 or 2 (realistic) guys, and go full throttle to go get them. And with the Wolves roster chock full of role players, anyway, I don’t know if a #18 prospect is going to separate himself from all the other players.
I once looked back at the last several drafts, and found that each typically yields about 20 20-mpg players. (2006 yielded 12 I think, 2 of whom on the Wolves in Foye and Smith…that was indeed a bad draft). 20 mpg isn’t exactly a stellar threshold, to boot.
All that is to say I wouldn’t mind if the Wolves used their #18 or #28 as sweetener to move up, even a couple spots, if they were convinced they were getting a guy that can play. But again, it all depends on their evaluations.
I look at it a little differently
I think the NBA draft is a pretty massive crapshoot and the more darts you throw, the better chance you have of getting lucky and hitting a bullseye. Although the average result suggests mediocrity in the middle of the draft, there are plenty of examples of wildly successful picks at #18 and beyond. At the time they were picked, of course no one thought they would turn into studs. Based on all of the data us novices have seen and heard from non-novices, it appears that there is no clear cut talent after Blake Griffin. Therefore, I really hesitate to combine #18 with #6 to move up to a non-Blake Griffin slot….Rubio perhaps, but that’s about it. Now if we use #18 + another asset to get up to #5, that’s a different story since it still gives us a couple of high lotto darts to throw.
by Rascal Flatts on May 30, 2009 9:20 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree
That giving up another dart becausde you think you have a bullseye may not be wise. I will am going to be cautious to judge Harden’s first step and perceived athleticism problem since he got into the paint, shot 9.2 free throws per 40 minutes pace adjusted, and finished in transition better than any wing not named Danny Green. Let’s see how his agility tests go at the combine, I think he is going to surprise some people.
I hope they keep #18...
Unless they flip it for an earlier pick while keeping #6 or trade it for a starter. It’s possible that Teague, Maynor, James Johnson, or Earl Clark falls to them. While scary at #6, they’d be almost steals at 18. Although this draft isn’t deep #1-10, I think it’s deep in 10-20 because a couple of guys out of the consensus top 20 will get picked before 18 and at least one guy slated for the top 10 might be there at 18.
by pagingstanleyroberts on May 30, 2009 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions
#18 is a sweet pick
Whether you package it with 28 because you really like someone that fell to 12 or so (Curry?) or you’re taking BPA – all the players you mentioned plus Mullens and a number of other PG’s that might fall to 18 make this a great a pick. And all for the privilege of not paying Mark Blount and Ricky Davis! Best trade ever.
Why measure with shoes on?
I really find this information interesting, but can someone explain to me why we should care about a player’s height with shoes on?
It seems like we should be interested in Mullens with our second pick. Why would we not want a legimate back-up center?
I would think
A player’s height with shoes is more important. Although I don’t quite understand why some players shoes create more height than others. Why wouldn’t everyone wear a shoe that has the biggest height additive.
Last year, Kevin Love gained something like 1.5" in shoes, which I think he chalked up to orthopedic insoles. Now, I actually wear insoles myself (for flat feet) and they probably give me an extra half an inch, so it is valid if that’s the case, but I wouldn’t put it past some of the agents out there to give their players a little extra lift just to boost their height. Either way, a half inch here or there is fairly minimal. Wingspan and standing reach are the measurements that really should be looked at.
I still think height, regardless of wingspan,
has value since on offense being able to see over the defense or get a clear sight line to the hoop when rising up for a shot can make a big difference. Defensively is where wingspan and standing reach seem to have a lot more relevancy than pure height since shots and passing lanes are contested with an outstretched arm.
by Rascal Flatts on May 29, 2009 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Just did a quick Wingspan - Height No Shoes to get at relative wingspan
Dejuan Blair 0.73
Tyreke Evans 0.60
Jeff Teague 0.60
James Harden 0.56
Gerald Henderson 0.52
Earl Clark 0.50
James Johnson 0.48
DaJuan Summers 0.46
Sam Young 0.46
Jermaine Taylor 0.44
Austin Daye 0.42
Hasheem Thabeet 0.42
Jonny Flynn 0.40
Jordan Hill 0.35
Gani Lawal 0.35
Terrence Williams 0.33
Jrue Holiday 0.31
Demar Derozan 0.29
Tyler Hansbrough 0.27
Darren Collison 0.23
Blake Griffin 0.23
Patrick Mills 0.23
Wayne Ellington 0.19
Marcus Thornton 0.19
B.J. Mullens 0.15
Omri Casspi 0.13
Stephen Curry 0.13
Ty Lawson 0.13
Chase Budinger 0.06
Eric Maynor 0.02
www.canishoopus.com
2nd round name...
Rodrigue Beaubois, PG. 6’2 with a 6’10 wingspan.
by pagingstanleyroberts on May 30, 2009 11:10 AM CDT reply actions
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