Rubio winning basket in Euroleague and some thoughts
by yarrgh on Dec 24, 2010 6:06 PM CST
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PrintRicky finished with 8 points 3 dimes and 3 boards in 20 minutes of action, 2-4 from the field, 4-6 FT, 4 TO, 1 steal; and so so defense on Bo Mccaleb of Siena. He has two cool passes in the highlights and the basket not a masterpiece of offensive skill but at least he knows how to finish games!
Barcelona and Rubio advance to the round of 16
Ricky's stats after 10 games:
7.4 pts on 46% TS, 3.7 ast, 2.4 Rbd, 1.9 St, 2.1 TO - playing 21:30 minutes per game.
Not too shabby...
Are those stats saying he'll be a bust or that he's "overhyped"? lets see
First of all regarding this game, I think that since the game meant little for final standings in the group, I think the coach spared him for league play.
Now, obviously these are mediocore numbers compared to the NBA numbers you expect from starting guards. but consider Brandon Jennings euroleague averages:
In 16 Euroleague games, Jennings averaged 7.6 points, 1.6 rebounds, 1.6 assists, and 1.2 steals in 19.6 minutes per game,
I'm saying that the Euroleague stats are way lower than NBA stats for same player when he comes over. slower pace, different assist count, more discipline of young talent and a "grinding' offensive game that favors forwards and centers.
Ricky is a young player on a short leash. that's the way it is in Europe. but even established Euroleagues stars show mediocore stat lines compared to NBA star stat lines:
Example: Anthony Parker, Euroleague Final four MVP in 2004 and league MVP in 2005 and 2006, averaged 15.8 points per game, 5.7 rebounds per game and 1.6 steals per game in the Euroleague.
One more example of the "low" stat lines for the best players in Europe: Šarūnas Jasikevičius, all-euroleague 2003 and 2004 and starting PG for the euroleague champion averaged 13.4 points and 3.2 assists (the same guy single-handedly destroyed the US olympic team in 2004)
So have hope. He has a lot of elements to his game that needs work, but I think that even if you discount his experience, winner attitude and leadership will be invaluable by themselves, his play, stat wise, will be way better in the National Basketball Association.
If you look at BJ stat jump (Rookie year: 15 pts, 5.7 ast, 3.6 boards at a slow pace team), I project Ricky to have a stat line of 14 pts, 8-10 ast, 5-7 boards, 2 steals per game.
Not too bad, right?
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So-so defense on Bo McCalebb
is pretty kind to Rubio—he was getting torched. Of course, not a lot of guys can stay in front of McCalebb. Plus, he wasn’t getting saved minute wise, he was in foul trouble. I liked that when he got back into the game, he made things happen. There’s no doubt he has talent. This wasn’t one of his finest efforts, but he had a sweet pass to Grimau late in the game, and got the winner. He’s also now leading the ACB in assists, I believe, so that’s good.
I still really like him, but as I’ve said before, I’m a little disappointed in his season, to the extent that I don’t think he’s shown much growth. He had a few good games when both Navarro and Mickeal were out, showing more agression, but overall, it’s been a very inconsistent year for him. I was hoping to see a real step-up in his game, but we really haven’t gotten it.
Will be interesting to see if Barca can find their form from last year in the next round of EL. Of course, last year was one for the history books for them.
I say SHONDA you say WOLVES" SHONDA! WOLVES!
by Eric in Madison on Dec 24, 2010 6:20 PM CST reply actions
Horrid defense on McCalebb
Ricky got beat off the dribble several times throughout the game. Ricky’s position defense is quite good. Very much the ball-line defender in the mold of Tubby Smith. In fairness to Ricky, when he was beat there was no weak side help defender to step up.
Ricky will have trouble guarding guys with an explosive first step in the NBA. He often tries to make up for his poor lateral movement speed by cheating on one side or the other against his ball-carrying opponent. That will not work in the NBA.
It’s interesting how opponents space themselves when Ricky has the ball, they actually defend against his passes whereas most defend against the shot.
Credit where due, Ricky did win the game for his team when a victory was largely in doubt throughout the game.
Breaking down cognitive dissonance and group think since gasoline was cheap.
Yeah, he got beat like a rented mule
On the other hand, I’ll make a point I’ve made before—I don’t like the way we talk about perimeter defense generally. The truth is, nobody can consistently stay in front of the quick point guards in the NBA. It just doesn’t happen. Those guys beat everyone, because they have a huge advantage both in the rules of the game and the rules of physics.
The best you can hope to do is force a couple extra dribbles and/or force them to where the help is going to be. But if those guys want to go by you, they are going to go by you.
Now, Rubio was being beaten too easily on Thursday, but you can’t expect your point guard to stay in front of the other guy if he has any quicks at all and is determined to drive it.
I say SHONDA you say WOLVES" SHONDA! WOLVES!
by Eric in Madison on Dec 24, 2010 9:16 PM CST up reply actions
It's relative
Anyone of equal or greater first step speed has the upper (ahem) foot on the defender. But good on-ball defenders are able to quickly turn and run parallel with the ball handler, stay in the play. You see that with Rondo, CP-3, D-Will, etc.
When Ricky got beat off the dribble he was completely out of the play. That is inadequate lateral speed. As I mentioned, it could be that he was looking for weak side help and didn’t try to catch up but what I saw was unfavorable.
Breaking down cognitive dissonance and group think since gasoline was cheap.
Yep
But good on-ball defenders are able to quickly turn and run parallel with the ball handler, stay in the play. You see that with Rondo, CP-3, D-Will, etc. When Ricky got beat off the dribble he was completely out of the play. That is inadequate lateral speed
Spot on. Rocky is a great help defender, below average on the play defender. A little too tall/gangly to handle the quick pg.
Concerned me.
He didn’t seem that athletic when guarding. He could get eaten alive in the NBA.
I think his assists and steals
will translate fine in the NBA, with him likely being near the top of the League in both categories if given the minutes. It’s the shooting and scoring that I worry about. The fact that this kid is still struggling to crack 40% from the field and his 3-point shot has regressed significantly is not a good sign. That is something that is not going to magically get better coming over from Europe, and could even get worse….I mean Corey Brewer bad. Perhaps there is less hand checking than in Europe, but that hardly explains his terrible outside shooting accuracy.
Way more hand checking in Europe
the game is so much physical and you can’t take 4 steps like the NBA.
yeah his 3 is ugly, but his role on that team is wierd, offense wise and his 2 is at 52%.
I’m not sure why he does not progress… it seem that Yugoslavs/Greek develop way more PGs, while Spanish develop bigs very good. so maybe that’s a Spanish thing.
I know I’m really putting a l lot of emphasis on the comparison to BJ but I think that those that drafted him, drafted him based on his high school play and potential. Rubio should get at least the same credit WRT his potential.
But....
Rubio has been playing in the EL and ACB for a lot of years now. He’s actually not that much better than he was a couple of years ago. Isn’t the age of about 18-20 prime years for growth as a player? Jennings came into the EL right out of High School. There is no comparison between the two. Rubio is practically a grizzled veteran by now.
I’m starting to question what his ceiling is at this point. If he’s already flat-lined his development trajectory in Europe, perhaps there just isn’t that much better he’s going to get. I guess what we don’t know is his offseason regimen and what kind of expert coaching he gets in terms of his own individual skill building. But it’s pretty disappointing to see him actually take a step backward in his numbers this season compared to last year.
by Rascal Flatts on Dec 24, 2010 10:17 PM CST up reply actions
PG Development in Spain
is not that good, historically.
Brandon Jennings
Was an athletic freak. Athleticism is what rules in the nba. This is because of the players and the rule changes. Brandon Jennings did not do so well because he did not have the freedom to play his game like he does with the bucks.
I'm not sure what to think
He shoots a decent percentage from inside of 3 and when you combine that with all the breakaway plays that most guys take for easy layups that he passes to a teammate for a big dunk that percentage is pretty good(I mean how many highlights have you seen of Ricky when he steals the ball and has a guy right behind him and he dishes off to that teammate instead of taking the easy layup). Also he gets to the line at a pretty high rate and he makes a good chuck of those free throws. His shooting sucks, lets just accept it. He’s probably never going to be a good shooter, it’s not the end of the world. Jason Kidd couldn’t shoot, Rondo can’t shoot, both are good open court point guards who can’t/couldn’t until they were way out of there prime and they both have had plenty of success.
I don’t think the problem is if he can score I think it’s more why he doesn’t score. He’s shown that he’s capable of scoring especially at the end of games. Maybe it’s just me but he seems to look for his shot a lot more when it’s a close game in the 4th quarter. So my question is why doesn’t he look for his shot more throughout the game. Is it because of his coach and the system or is it that he passes to much? From what I’ve heard about his coach he wants Rubio to pass and get everyone else set up but when you watch Rubio he passes up a lot of layups and passes when he should just take a shot. That is what he needs to work on the most. He needs to have a better idea of when to shoot and when to pass.
by Bad News Wolves on Dec 25, 2010 3:40 AM CST up reply actions
Predicting his growth based on Brandon Jennings...
makes sense to me.
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Dec 25, 2010 12:59 AM CST reply actions
Stats?
8pts and 12ast. per game, probably. With less than 3 rebounds given that we have Love. Also, 5 shots a night should be just right because he definitely looks to pass more and shoot less, which isn’t a problem since we don’t need our PG’s to score. We have Beasley, Wes and Webster for that, plus Love off the rebounds. And his court vision is like magic. I’m actually hoping he feeds Beasley enough to make him average 25-30PPG and hopefully make him an All-Star next season. I have a feeling that having Rubio around will elevate the whole team’s performance.
OH! Those are really cool! (OH! Those are really cool!)
I can't to see what kind of shoes Michael Beasley wears! (I can't to see what kind of shoes Michael Beasley wears!)
OH! I love Michael Beasley's hair! (I can't wait to see Michael Beasley play defense!)
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