GameThread #50: @ Mavericks
by wyn on Feb 5, 2010 7:30 PM CST
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PrintMinnesota Timberwolves at Dallas Mavericks, Feb 5, 2010 7:30 PM CST
With 4 days of rest following their first back-to-back wins of the season, the Wolves head down to Dallas tonight for a roust-about with Dirk and Co. It never ceases to amaze me how willing Mark Cuban is willing to spend to win. It hasn't brought a championship to Big D yet, that Jason Kidd deal doesn't look as bad in retrospect with Devin Harris thus far failing to become the cornerstone New Jersey had hoped he'd be. Moreover, the Mavs appear to be on the hunt for yet another impact player, along the lines of Caron Butler Kevin Martin.
Dallas has lost 3 of their last 4 and will no doubt see the Wolves as an opportunity to get back on track.
The Wolves, for their part, appear at full strength for tonight as of 5:30, and no word yet on starters.
Mavs Moneyball will let you know how much they miss the Dirky, Finley and Nashty days.
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I do feel sorry for every player on the Mavericks..
Having to play for that Scumbag of an owner Mark Cuban…
Immature loudmouth?
Yes, at times. He’d get on my nerves too. But he’s also a phenomenal owner that provides all that his players need to be successful, and he actually says some really well-reasoned NBA comments as often as he gets fined. Basically for every douchey thing he does, he does something impressive.
He needs to get all the way out to the acr on Marion though
Matriz will shoot that three all night if you give him the space
Stream?
Checked atdhe.net and their stream is not working.
Hollins disruptive early, Brewer sinks a couple of 3's
Nice to see. I suspect we’ll see Dirk here pretty soon.
Good Start for the boys
I’m searching for a stream guys..hang tight.
It's tough
not to bite after Al just hit two jumpers over him.
No streams
I’ve searched all my places…nothing yet.
http://www.atdhe.net/12841/watch-minnesota-timberwolves-vs-dallas-mavericks
it’s up
'It's just noise coming out of an ugly scientist.' Michael Scott
Jim Peterson talking about that pesky stop the ball thing we don't do
Good point on Jason Kidd. Lots of teams are having the same problem with Rondo too
Another...
…ugly-ass heave toward the rim. What’s that three?
Thanks for the stream.. this is great.
You know they don’t seem to be playing that bad of defense tonight
I like the fluid rotations..
I know you gotta leave players in the game to let them get in rhythm, but it seems like our team could take advantage of constantly adjusting rotations to keep other teams off guard.. we don’t have much of a chance anyway.
Nice give and go...
…from Sessions to Love. Jonny, make a note.
Well..
..douches are refreshing. Or so I’ve heard.
'It's just noise coming out of an ugly scientist.' Michael Scott
I get the whole "take a charge" thing Rambis is pushing, but...
….Ryan Hollins should really be looking for shot blocks. Leave the charges to the non shotblockers
But
Didn’t they say Hollins only had like three blocked shots or something like that the whole month of Dec? That is why they are pushing to take charges instead.
Rambis has been pushing the whole team to take charges
….because we have no shot blockers. Except we DO have a shot blocker in Hollins. He just doesn’t block many shots because he keeps trying to take charges like everyone else
Less Fouls
Since he has switched from blocking shots to taking charges his fouls have gone down dramatically.
Right, he's nowhere near in Rondo's class.
But Rondo was a raw, athletic mutant early in his career, before developing polish while playing with KG, Pierce and Allen. Wouldn’t surprise me at all to see Beaubois follow a similar career trajectory.
Of all the players...
..in the NBA that Rubio gets compared to, I’m surprised there aren’t more Rondo comparisons. I think he’s as close to what Rubio is right now as anyone else.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
I'd love it if Rubio's scoring game could match Rondo's...
….but right now I don’t think it compares
I don't know that there is a "good" comparision
… to Rubio in the NBA right now… Possibly a bit of a cross between Rondo and Nash?
I view it as..
…he’s a long point guard who can’t shoot well and is opportunistic off the ball on defense and who can rebound and run an offense. Rondo is all of those things.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
So is Rubio...
…so I see your point. But athletically they are very different.
Yeah but there's no point in blocking a shot if the dude aint gonna shoot..
He telegraphed that pass from the start of the drive. Ha, hopefully Hollins saw that or maybe he just got locky. Either way, I love seeing players attempt to draw charges.. it shows that they care more about a positive defensive possesion than garnering stats that show up in their next contract negotiation—like a block
Well no we know where all that cap space is going
Can the Wolves even afford to sell Suites at half price and give people $250 food and drink credits with the attendance they get? heh
Why are Brewer's rebounds so low this year?
Is it because he’s stuck out on the perimeter playing the 2?
Hollins flailing all over the place
I think the biggest thing Hollins needs to work on this offseason is balance. He gets knocked out of plays so easily.
It's not just strength though
Look at Camby. He is just as skinny if not skinnier than Hollins.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 8:26 PM CST up reply actions
He needs to strengthen his core and lower body
his upper body is fine.
by TheEvilProfessor on Feb 5, 2010 11:36 PM CST up reply actions
Where was Love going with that pass?
Back to back threes for the Mavs too…..our transition defense is non-existent
It just seemed like he saw something that wasn't there...
I mean, he had Jonny Flynn 5 feet in front of him, but he chose to heave it into double coverage 20 feet down the court….I just didn’t see anyone open there
I should have...
….kept a file on all of the things opposing announcing teams say about ricky rubio.
Forever splitting the Cheechakos from the Sourdoughs
www.canishoopus.com
“They’re so young they have young guys who aren’t even playing for them yet!
by princelyfrank on Feb 5, 2010 8:40 PM CST up reply actions
Pretty much anything opponent annoucers say about the Wolves is amusing..
..cuz you know all of the anecdotal tidbits were fed to them by their counterparts. How many times have we heard about Jawai being Aborigine, Hollins being a former high jumper, Brewer winning a national championship with Florida, Rambis running the hybrid Triangle, Sessions signing a cap-friendly below-market deal, etc, etc.
Every time you pass to him...
…. the other 4 guys on the court should shout a countdown like we all did in the driveway as kids (Jordan vs Bird, baby!) .. “DAMIEN, 3…. 2….. 1…..” regardless of what it says on the clock.
Wow, watching Flynn makes me very thankful that we have Rubio waiting in the wings
Flynn can be a nice spark off the bench though
I was a big fan of Jennings too
But I think Curry would be the perfect fit in our offense
Most of us wanted Curry....
.. or trade down for DeRozan (which, so far, hasn’t proven to be a smart move)
And some of us were incredibly relieved Thabeet was gone.
I, for one, was soooo happy. That guy has “bust” written all over…
Sure he could still develop into something good..
..but I couldn’t stand watching him at UConn. I saw 5-6 of their games on tv and, as much as I liked his blocks and (some) of his defense, I felt he had a poor center of gravity/balance, was muscled around far too much, which caused him to spend a lot of time on his backside. To me, it didn’t translate well to the NBA where bodies are bigger, stronger and longer.
I celebrated after the first four picks
because I assumed we would take Rubio and Curry and I was pumped. I was pretty shocked we took Flynn since I felt it was obvious that Curry was better, and was several inches taller. All the stuff about Flynn’s upside I felt like I’d never heard until after we drafted him.
by princelyfrank on Feb 5, 2010 8:48 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah... actually I wanted the Wolves to take DeRozan
Which means I was extremely wrong. So I won’t complain about Flynn since I’d rather have Flynn than DeRozan.. Ha, I actually thought DeRozan had a little baby-Kobe in him
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 8:52 PM CST up reply actions
I don't think he's a total bust...
Check here. Not sure how to pull per-36 or utilization stats, but 8+ points in 21mpg on 46% shooting (sub-30% from 3) isn’t bad, and rebounds well for a G/SG.
Plus, remember, in terms of value, we would have traded down 2-4 spots probably, and we should have traded down 1-2 spots if Jonny was “our guy”. That’s why I think we should have gone with Curry at 6 – value dictated it.
You could have given him the keys, like Skiles did
And paired him with the two great bigs you have. And I don’t think he’s that bad of a shooter, actually.
True
But it sure didn’t matter as he carved us up to pieces when we last played Milwaukee. He can really break down a defense.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 8:53 PM CST up reply actions
That may prove to be the case.
Curry’s outside shooting would sure help us out now, though.
by princelyfrank on Feb 5, 2010 8:51 PM CST up reply actions
Agreed...
After it became clear that Ricky wasn’t coming over, I was much more upset with taking Jonny over Curry.
but...
Didn’t Curry give every impression that he would not play in Minnesota if drafted. He didn’t come for workouts, right? How much of an F up would that have been to draft two guys of which neither come?
I seem to remember most Wolves fans being very anti Jennings.
Don't really think he would've made a huge deal
You could tell he wasn’t thrilled to be drafted by GSW instead of NY but the kid is a professional. I’m pretty sure he was in that huge PG workout we held so it would seem that he would’ve come here.
Most fans were anti-Jennings, I was definitely not one of them.
Hollins has the most minutes tonight...
And we have 29 points from the front court. I like watching them a lot better when Rambis uses the 9 man rotation
Hollins
has the perfect physical profile to guard Nowitzki. Let’s hope his overall instincts keep improving, because he has the potential to be real problematic for opposing teams.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 8:49 PM CST up reply actions
He does
but he’s also, what, 25? He spent 4 years at UCLA and now a few years in the NBA. I guess he could be a late bloomer, but I’d feel a lot better about his upside if he was a 20-year old rookie.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 8:52 PM CST up reply actions
Is there a story about why he's so developmentally disabled?
Does a guy ever suddenly “get it” at such an advanced age?
by princelyfrank on Feb 5, 2010 8:53 PM CST up reply actions
I don't know
He was a big-time track and field guy I know. Perhaps he didn’t focus much on basketball until much later in life so he’s still climbing the learning curve. I’ll tell you what though, he’s developed a respectable offensive game. It’s all the other stuff – rebounding, hanging onto the freakin’ ball, defensive awareness, – that seems to be behind the curve for him.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 8:55 PM CST up reply actions
Whether these 3 games are just an aberation...
It gives me more hope that Love/Al can coexist with an athletic big as the third guy. Now whether Hollins ends up being that guy or not is yet to be seen.
absolutely…I hope Rambis settles into this 9 man rotation the rest of the season. No reason to play Pavs, Pech, or Cardinal. Give Tucker and Jawai a little burn in blow-outs. I’d like to see Big Nate get a ton of burn in summer league.
by TWolvesFanInLA on Feb 5, 2010 8:57 PM CST up reply actions
Read this article on HOOPSWORLD: http://www.hoopsworld.com/Blogs/CourtsideBlog.asp?GAME_ID=36830&LEAGUE_CODE=NBA
It sounds like Khan aint so sure either… which is nice to know that he isn’t going to just stick with a guy to try and salvage his rep. Successful leaders need to be humble about their mistakes.
Nice job by Corey chasing Terry off that screen
He got caught hard, but managed to stay in arm’s length and get at the ball
He could have drawn an offensive foul on that play
Dirk hit in in the face with an elbow on the double team
Bad pass Jonny.
If you passed more often, maybe you’d realize it.
Wolves have 10 3-pointers??
Talk about playing out of character! Not to mention their defense…
Length as an advantage for the Wolves
That hasn’t been the case for a few years….
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 9:16 PM CST up reply actions
Bring on the Boos!!!
Did the Mavs announcers really just drop a Wu Tang Clan reference?
Another opposing announcer data drop.
Describing Damien’s family tree.
For once we don't fold to the pressure
Mavs having a hard time from in close though. That’s pretty uncharacteristic
In the first half?
I thought the offense looked much smoother with Ramon in the first half.
I'm not one to count chickens before they hatch
Especially as a Wolves fan. But this seems to be our night.
Gotta tip your cap
He’s the guy we want to be taking these crunch time shots, not Dirk. He’s just knockin’ them down.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 9:39 PM CST up reply actions
How can the Mavs play a three point guard set and not get taken advantage of?
We need to start getting after it in the paint
Great D by KLove!!!!
I wonder if the Mavs announcers think that should be an “NBA no-call” too
But of course we react defensively
and bring in Ellington
Al should be demanding the ball
And wow Hollins be a man dammit!!!
I love Hollins' tough guy attitude.
Can you imagine if Jawai played like that?
Did they turn the temperature up 20 degrees in that arena?
Why are we playing like assholes all of a sudden?
It will be telling...
…If he brings in Wilkins or Gomes
Yeah
He sort of met his quota of good plays for the night.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 9:49 PM CST up reply actions
Exactly
He looked great for the first 42 minutes of the game but Rambis should’ve quit while he was ahead.
Flynn and Brewer
absolutely crumbling under the pressure
Might want to get Sessions out there with Flynn
Brewer’s handle isn’t good enough to break the full court pressure
Its pretty incredible. Do they not teach guards how to pass out of a trap in high school anymore? We should be getting elbow jumpers for our big men every time they do that.
Flynn
Thinks he can dribble his way out of anything, yet usually he dribbles his way into a whole heap of trouble.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 9:52 PM CST up reply actions
I don't like this...
Al needs to be on the floor. I mean, if we can’t trust Love to guard Dirk for two minutes….
Yes but...
If Al and Love where in then Al would take Damp and Love would take Dirk
I don't see the problem with that
If Love is as solid a defender as people claim, then he should be able to handle Dirk for a couple of minutes
Agreed....
For 2 minutes we should be able to survive
Sorry I didn't catch your meaning
Didn’t see that you said “IF we can’t trust Love”
Apparently I can only type names
and exclamations!
Hanny: If your just joining us..welcome...
If your just tuning into the game..Why are you a wolves fan..
Wow
Is Brew getting respect from outside the arc or what!? Fouled by Dirk!
Clutch!!!
The Mav’s announcers are so confused that he didn’t miss
We’ll trade you Gomes for an expiring contract and a lottery protected 1st rounder in 2011.
by TWolvesFanInLA on Feb 5, 2010 10:05 PM CST up reply actions
It's the one play I've seen him consistently make this year
He was killin it in summer league with that kickout, but we don’t have the shooters to make it work all the time in the regular season
Awesome
The Clips and New York at home are one thing. Winning at Dallas is the real deal.
Our 9 man rotation is looking awesome
6 guys in double digits… the other 3 all with at least 8 points
Absolutely
This should be the rotation for the rest of the season.
by TWolvesFanInLA on Feb 5, 2010 10:10 PM CST up reply actions
Now if we can just get the wolves to play like this every game...
I mean really, obviously they can play this well against arguably the 3rd best team in the west. There’s potential here.
Haha. So true. BUT IT FEELS SO GOOD TO WIN!
But really… I did keep thinking, “well, if we lose, at least we…”
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 10:05 PM CST up reply actions
nothing guaranteed, even with the worst record.
We all know that art is not the truth, art is a lie that makes us realize the truth.--Picasso
Combination of both?
It seems like everyone played well tonight. Except for Love having a bad TO night
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 10:06 PM CST up reply actions
Love's TOs
are becoming an issue. Seems like his famed outlet passing abilities have gone to his head a bit. Throws some really dumb passes.
We've played much better defense with Hollins starting
And part of that is probably just better communication, but I think we shouldn’t dismiss the effect having a guy who’s 7 feet with long arms and quick legs can have, even one as unskilled as Hollins
Congrats
T-Wolves really surprised me. Hopefully this loss will force the Cuban to fix what’s wrong with the team, so thanks again.
What's wrong with the Mav's? I think they're really just lacking a solid big, no?
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 10:08 PM CST up reply actions
As cordial as you are, I would love for Kahn to steal Iguodala and Dalembert or Martin right out from under Cuban’s nose. Iggy would be a great addition to the starting lineup.
I didn't see Al Jefferson on the bench during the last 2 minutes
Did anyone else? I wonder if he’s injured and/or pouting.
More of a matchup thing..... I guess
Although I think he should’ve been out there I’m not gonna argue with a W
No not that I didn't see him playing...
I didn’t even see him on the bench cheering on the guys that were out there. I wonder what was up
Gotchya
Didn’t catch that….it will be interesting to see why
3 winnable games going into the break...
Home against Memphis, @ Philly, Home against Charlotte. We could do real damage to our draft stock
Oh definitely not but...
if we keep playing with confidence they should at least be good games
I'm fine with our draft stock taking a hit
if it’s guys like Flynn, Hollins, Ellington, Brewer, and Love leading us to victories. Lottery picks get tiresome if the one’s you’ve got aren’t improving. If more wins is due to these guys playing better ball, I’m all for it.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 10:19 PM CST up reply actions
Agreed...
It’s amazing the amount of confidence they’re playing with right now…
And I honestly think that this is really a deep draft
in terms of what the Wolves really need. You’ve got guys like Aldrich, W. Johnson, Aminu, Favors, Cousins, and Whiteside that will all still be available after the first three picks (at least some of them..)
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 10:23 PM CST up reply actions
I really hope Whiteside comes out this year
DX has him staying but I honestly think he will come out
I don't see the big deal about Whiteside....
….if you didn’t like Thabeet, you won’t like him either. And he’s not as good as his number suggest even.
If we want to take a gamble on a big man with a defensive edge, then we should be looking at Solomon Alibi
I've only seen him play once....
so I’m definitely no expert. If he comes out though, it makes the draft pool better which will help us whether we take him or not.
True. It's just that this is Whiteside's freshman season and he's blocking 5.5
(though he is already 20) I understand his competition is weak, and he’s a less developed Thabeet. What I do like about Alabi is his free throw shooting. I don’t know but it says something to me
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 10:30 PM CST up reply actions
Eh, I dunno...
….I just feel like Jerome Jordan is going to be better than them both anyway, and we won’t have to maneuver our draft position for him
Yeah
Aside from being tall, long shot-blockers, Whiteside and Thabeet are pretty different in terms of their games. Whiteside has ( though inconsistently) shown greater offensive ability and athleticism than Hasheem. I really see him and Alabi both as potentially major defensive upgrades, so if it comes down to those two it’s up to who has higher upside.
Udoh is another guy that could be rising up draft boards
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 10:26 PM CST up reply actions
Yep. He'd be great.
Can block shots, play the face-up game, and is a decent rebounder
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 10:27 PM CST up reply actions
He's looking better every week...
I hope Baylor can make some noise in the tourney so I can see him play more
Aldrich/Pekovic
I haven’t seen Pekovic play, but I haven’t been blown away by Aldrich. Anyone think Pekovic may be just as good. Two years ago, I remember the ESPN crew saying that Pekovic would have been a lottery pick if he wasn’t locked into expensive Euro contract.
Assuming we don’t win lottery and get Wall, we’ll have a shot at Turner, Wes Johnson, or Aminu (and maybe we can sneak back into top 10 by packaging Charlotte pick and get Xavier Henry).
I also wouldn’t mind seeing us trade the Utah pick to 2011 since we’ll likely lose that pick to Clippers.
by TWolvesFanInLA on Feb 5, 2010 10:36 PM CST up reply actions
Wow. If you look at the Box Score,
The only real negatives are Flynn’s FG% and Love’s TOs. And really, Flynn more than made up for a poor FG% with his 3P shooting tonight and Love brings so much to the table that its not the end of the world (though he does need to shore that up).
Also we gave up a ton of ORebs...
and got out-rebounded. I think Hollins has something to do with that but with the way he’s playing I can live with it.
Second unit is getting it?
Really enjoyed this game – especially Corey, Johnny and Wayne’s daggers at the end when it looked like we were going to capitulate.
I wonder how our 2nd unit will do from here on in – seems to be the difference for us.
Ditto with Rascal – there’s no guarantees if we have a lot of ping pong balls anyway… But force feeding some guys like Wayne and Jawai (i am aware of the double entendre – not deliberate i assure you) might not be a bad idea…
Ping Pong ball order....
Team wins
1) Nets 4
2) Wolves 12
3) warriors 13
4) Pistons 16
5) Kings 16
6) Wizards 17
7) Pacers 18
8) 76eres 18
9) Knicks 19
10) Clippers 21
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 5, 2010 10:23 PM CST reply actions
looks like we are passing the warriors soon......
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 5, 2010 10:23 PM CST up reply actions
The trade deadline will have a huge impact
If Philly or Washington make big trades and start to rebuild now I guarantee we pass them. And who knows with the Warriors and Pistons… they both look awful right now.
We've held opponents to just 41% shooting in the last three games
And tonight we beat a team with no excuses. Play defense, win games. The end
To be fair though, they still gave up a 108 points (14 Dallas offensive rebounds and 35 FTA for D didn’t help). It was the offense that won the game for them tonight, not least those big shots down the stretch. They shot 53% from the field and made a season high 12 threes (on only 22 attempts).
Good
looks like we are passing the warriors soon……
Pass the Warriors. Finish last in the ping pong race. Play an actual Center at the Center position, and KEEP WINNING GAMES!
by Son of Gerald Green on Feb 5, 2010 10:26 PM CST reply actions
What a frustrating game!
I wanted to post, but I was too nervous the whole time. I can’t remember ever seeing a team struggle so much just to get the ball within the 3 point arc the way the Wolves were that 4th quarter. I feel like we got lucky, but I’ll take it.
We played a team
that threw a lot at us late in the game and we withstood it. I’m extremely proud of our guys. We were also smart to let Michael Buble (much easier than looking up his real name) try to beat us instead of Dirk. I thought for a second there he’d pull it off, but he had a couple of costly offensive fouls to go along with his 3-pointers.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 5, 2010 10:29 PM CST up reply actions
We did fall behind...
…and fought back to take the lead. Twice. Except for Marion, the Mavs played a really good game. We were just better. I don’t think luck had anything to do with it tonight
since Nov 30 --- 11 wins and 23 losses -- 32% pace --- equivalent to 27 wins in an 82 game schedule. If we continued at that pace we end up with 22 wins.
If we won at a 50% pace the rest of the way, we end up with 28 wins.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 5, 2010 10:29 PM CST reply actions
Think Rubio has been paying attention much?
Loves outside/inside game, the shooting form of our young wings (both of whom could be tidy slashers given the right service – Brewer and Ellington), and Flynn’s slashing combo-type game must have him thinking…
I think he's more concerned with the EL tourney but...
this has to make him feel a lot better about coming here
Ok - but when he does (and i am sure he will)...
it might put to bed some (if he has any) misgivings (no matter how slight) he might have about our personnel (esp. Flynn)….
Flynn is still over dribbling.......rather than going one on one, we need to set high pick and rolls and Flynn needs to learn to turn the corner
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 5, 2010 10:34 PM CST up reply actions
True...
He was doing it nicely in Nov-Dec, but now seems to just barrel straight into the basket… his lack of fear and on/off court character is good to see however.
Huge difference. But there's no way we shoot as well as we did tonight.
Not to be negative, but forget about going 16-16 from here on out. We’ll be a top 5 lotto team
Honestly, I don't think Rubio even knows our record..
He’s got so much going with his Euro club there’s no way he could pay attention to this. But he does have a lot here (potentially).
I think by the time he's ready to come,
this team will be respectable enough (8-10 seed team in 2011-12)
Lottery Position?
Sorry, just find the subject a bit tiresome. We’ve got 3 wins in a row here. We’ve never been lucky with the ping pong balls anyways. We just beat a team decisively that we had lost 13 in a row to – that should take precedence over lottery talk at least for tonight
by Son of Gerald Green on Feb 5, 2010 10:37 PM CST reply actions
Ehh.. maybe I guess.
But that kid seriously has a lot going on… it’s like being deployed to Iraq and checking the latest news in Afghanistan. It’s a lot to follow. (No, I’m not comparing combat to basketball)
draft is a big part of our future.....especially this year with 3 first round picks... and our lottery pick potentially being another allstar..
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 5, 2010 10:41 PM CST reply actions
It's just annoying when you're all happy about finally getting a win
and you look on here and people are mad because of draft position. That sucks.
I don't think people where mad....
just curious and being typical Wolves fans.
Yeah.. I mean, c'mon. We're all happy they won and are geling..
but we need more help if we wanna be that championship contender. We’re forced to be very forward-thinking here
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 10:52 PM CST up reply actions
My stance is...
That there’s a lottery for a reason. I’m tired of us taking for more ping-pong balls. It has never worked. The actual draft order never turns out the way the theoretical standings say it should. So there’s no reason to try and move up in the standings order. Doesn’t help.
Let’s keep on winning and progressing with the talent we have, and we’ll either get lucky and get a top-2 pick or we won’t. Our “projected” draft position is only a projection.
By the way we have been discussing how Hollins defense has been helping.....in the last 3 games... good defensive efforts.... hollins 4 blocks and Jefferson 5 blocks.....
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 5, 2010 10:45 PM CST reply actions
I'd rather we played well and lost 4 out of 5 games by 1 point.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 5, 2010 10:56 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah... I mean.. I agree, we NEED our Brandon Roy/Dwayne Wade
type talent, but bothe of those dudes were drafted by teams that were picking after 5. What that tells me is that smart management gets you farther than smart losses.
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 11:03 PM CST up reply actions
I think the idea has slipped into peoples minds this year....
with the huge losing streak right away and Kahn flat out saying that we would be bad this year. I agree that I would be happier seeing progress but can definitely see why some fans are ok with the losing this year.
Which KLJ definitely is
I think part of the reason he pushes this draft position thing so much is he was convinced we were tanking three weeks ago and started liking the idea
and I think we will be tanking again before too long.... I'm still not sure we were tanking last night....Jefferson who was playing good defense and one of the only steady offensive players during the dallas run, pulled from the game with 2 minutes left?
The more logical choice when Hollins fouls out is to play jefferson and love. I suspect, Rambis was trying to tank last night and it didn’t work.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 6, 2010 6:30 AM CST up reply actions
Right...
The Timberwolves attempted to lose to the current 3rd seed in the West… but won. I think you’re really on to something here.
when hollins fouls out, you think the logical choice if you are trying to win, is to sit jefferson with 2 minutes to go?
and you think that strategy results in a win most of the time…….lol
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 6, 2010 3:47 PM CST up reply actions
Not necessarily..
but when you’re playing against a feared clutch-scoring big man who likes to hang out on the perimeter and hit jump shots, going small and making sure one of your big men is mobile enough to stay with him is not tanking. It’s matchup-based personnel decisions.
When Love and Jefferson were on the floor together they played WELL!!
They guy who had been playing best on both ends of the floor for minutes 42 to 46 was Jefferson. So you sit the guy playing best?
it resulted in a win. It looks like genius (if you wanted to win) from that standpoint.
But logically, was it smart to sit the player playing best?
Rambis hardly plays Jefferson and Love together any more. Was it because they played so badly together. If you look at 5 man unit plus minus, the top ones all have jefferson and Love on them TOGETHER.
Now Rambis won’t even put them on the floor together down the stretch in most games. Not all teams have a Dirk. But either Love or jefferson sits at the end of most games now.
What is the logic, if not tanking.
I say again. Look at 5 man unit plus minus. Jefferson and Love are on the top ones together, but they don’t play together down the stretch of games.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 6, 2010 4:33 PM CST up reply actions
You didn't acknowledge the argument
that neither Al or Love are mobile enough to guard Nowitzki on the perimeter. Hollins was. So when Hollins fouled out, Rambis wanted to still have someone mobile enough to cover him. I’m not sure it’s what I would have done. I probably would have gone with the “best players on the floor” theory.
But there is easily explained logic behind Rambis’ decision. And it’s not “TANKING!!!!!!” It is a huge, huge leap of faith to claim that an 11-win team was TRYING to lose to a 31-win team, but beat them. You talk about logic, where is the logic in that?
On another note, Brewer hit 3 more threes...
That’s 14 straight games with at least one.
Rambis will start playing more of his bench again, when he "wants to evaluate those players" ---- read TANK!
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 6, 2010 6:32 AM CST up reply actions
wants to see what he really has....he now knows he has some talent.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 6, 2010 3:48 PM CST up reply actions
What do smart coaches who are trying to develop young talent do when they want to tank but still develop as a team and develop their individual players?
They employ different strategies depending on the quality of the opponent.
1) against the best teams you go all out to win to show players what it takes to win, and give them confidence against good teams.
2) against mediocre teams they hold back their best player – to evaluate others off the bench.
3) against weak teams who they are competing against for ping pong balls… they completely tank. The best players get “fluke” injuries and have to sit. Evaluating bench players and all the rest.
I think we will see more and more of this type of strategy as time goes on.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 6, 2010 3:53 PM CST up reply actions
What's the read on Pavs/Wilkins getting PT?
Is this a till the trade deadline only thing – or what? Personally i am torn on Wilkins (i really like him) – but feel Ellington should start eating into those minutes more… Pavs can join Stewie in street clothes for all i care… but Wilkins is a quandry…
Wanye is making the most of his minutes...
I would love to see him play more too but I think that Rambis is developing a role for him as an off the bench contributor. He will never be a starter for us so I’m fine having with bringing him off the bench and getting him comfortable in that situation.
I used to think that (because I have to watch the Wolves from the box scores--being outta state)
But after watching tonight, it seems as though Wilkins is good for this team. We need a veteran who can actually play ball (yes, I’m talking about you, Brian Cardinal). You can’t just have 5 kids out there all the time. You gotta give them some veteran help. It’s important to Al and Love’s development to play along-side players like Wilkens
by SF on Feb 5, 2010 11:09 PM CST up reply actions
I dont know about you guys but...
Wayne kind of reminds me of Penny Hardaway with his “co-ordinated ungainliness”… and he seems to have pretty decent handles. There’s more potential there than i initially thought…
Honestly I don't think we need to tank at this point.
Getting collectively better as a team and creating that “synergy” is much more important. Lets be honest: John Wall may be the next Derrick Rose, which is great and all, but we’ve got a Rose-type talent in Rubio. Turner may prove to be more Jamario Moon than Brandon Roy. Derrick Favors may be just as impacting in the NBA as he is in the ACC. Bottom line is we need to get better. I trust Khan will make the right decision in June (tonight certainly made him look smart with Ellington shooting, Flynn playing well in the fourth when it matters, and Hollins pitching in as the athletic 5)
Most telling stat line for Flynn
7 Asts, 1 TO, +14
I don’t care who you are, a 7:1 ratio is nice. From what I watched he played pretty well. Had a couple of ugh moments but seems to be getting it in longer stretches.
by TheEvilProfessor on Feb 6, 2010 12:10 AM CST reply actions
April 12, 2006, I believe.
@ Houston.
You were a daydreamer, a sass-mouth, and, not infrequently, a bit of a gigglepuss. Somehow I doubt twenty years of amphetamines and failure have done anything to improve that.
by Kevin Loves McHale's Navy on Feb 6, 2010 12:24 AM CST up reply actions
Solid Win
Flynn, Love, Brewer, Ellington all made huge plays down the stretch.
Hollins and Jefferson played solid and Wilkins seems to make big shots.
Who cares about the lottery, it’s out of their hands but they’ll be in it regardless.
Wolves won the coinflip vs Portland in 07 and the Trailblazers won the lottery.
I will say this ( and shoot me down if you will) I am glad the Wolves have Brewer over Oden right now. Guy is a major player right now.
It is nice seeing the wolves improve. But if we go from #2 in ping pong balls to say, #5 or #6 our potential draft position goes from at worst #5 [if we are #2 pre-ping pong balls] to as low as 9 [if we are #6 pre-ping pong balls]
we can move down 3 slots max with the ping pong balls.
So we go from being guaranteed to get a very good wing – Turner or Johnson – missing out on talent.
This team desperately needs more talent.
Ideally for me…. the team and individual players improve every game…. but Rambis takes actions to help us lose the game……. like not playing jefferson in the last 2 minutes…. ohhh … we tried that and it didn’t work… next time we can sit both Jefferson and Love to see how Pech and Hollins play together down the stretch…lol…
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 6, 2010 6:40 AM CST reply actions
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