I've got to know
by Mplax on Feb 7, 2010 3:36 PM CST
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PrintSo as the title may suggest, I want to know what the new popular opinion is. Two months ago, I think I was the only person that actually still believed Corey could put it together. So rougly 5% of the Wolves fan base believed in him. I really want to see what the new perspective is on Corey now.
I've noticed that the calluses on my typing fingers have gone down considerably over the past month so I'm guessing there is a new popular opinion on Brewer. I'm guessing it's gone from "Why'd we pick up the option?" to "Corey Brewer? Oh, him! Yeah, I've got my fingers crossed that he'll keep this up."
*My own opinion is still roughly the same, too cautiously optimistic and hoping he can be AK47 at his best Trevor Ariza for the Lakers. I still think he could be a shutdown good defender if he is not surrounded by garbage an island out there.
On to the poll question, I will put cautiously optimistic as an option, but if you would be so kind, please avoid it if you can. I know most everyone is cautiously optimistic right now and I'd really prefer to get a better understanding of exactly where the optimism lies on the spectrum of how likely we think he will keep this up. Thanks a lot and I'd love to hear some comments justifying your responses.
Some talking points of the past I would like to hear updated thoughts on include, but are not limited to: His defensive ratings/metrics and their reliability, offensive production, upside/downside, energy, dribbling, shooting, passing, rebounding, transition play on both ends, attitude, effort, Derek Fisher's ego, and badass dunks.
*These comments are solely the straight up truth opinion of Mplax and in no way reflect the general standing of SBNation, Canis Hoopus, or its affiliates.
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I think he can start on a contender..
But I still think it’s a good idea to have a good scoring wing next to him so he doesn’t have to carry an offensive load. He brings enough energy and disruptiveness that he’s worth having on the floor now that he appears to be a viable offensive player. I don’t think this red-hot gunner of the last month is here to stay, but I do think it’s indicative that he is progressing significantly as a scorer.
I could see him settling into a “Play defense, create transition opportunities, and knock down open looks” type of player who averages 12-15 points per game, but occasionally explodes for 20+. And that’s a good starter, if you’ve got a go-to scorer on the perimeter.
Agree
He may be able to start for a contender, but it won’t be as one of the “stars”. I highly doubt he will ever be more than a 3rd or 4th option at best while on the floor. His handles are still atrocious and he isn’t a lights-out shooter. And defensively, he will always struggle against big athletic 2’s/3’s that can score in the paint.
We still need elite talent on the wing. Brewer’s play of late is so startling because of the low bar his early career set. This should really be what we expected all along from a mid to high lotto pick like himself. But he’s not even close to being a star.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 7, 2010 4:37 PM CST up reply actions
Agreed...
Definitely not the focus of the offense, but he gets his points by hustling on defense which translates into easy dunks/layups and also by moving around/slashing on offense and just generally being open from a double team. Kind of like Love with less refinement in that he plays in the cracks of the offense.
To Rascal Flatts, what/who do you think is the perfect compliment to him? Obviously Lebron… but realistically, Iguodala has been thrown around a lot as well as Gay. Do you think it’s one of these two guys or do you think it’s someone in the draft (Turner, Johnson, etc) or someone else completely (Childress or the Brewer Bros)?
Not sure really
Gay and Iggy would be massive upgrades to what we’ve got, but I question their value in a half-court slugfest in the Conference or NBA finals, since that’s hopefully what we’re aiming for. We can say that we want to run and I’m on board with it, but you have to be able to create efficient offense in half-court sets to win the NBA Finals. These guys seem to regress into 2-point contested jump shooters in the half-court and I’m not ready to pay either one of them $12+ million per year for that, no matter how many highlight reels they fill during the regular season.
I’ll cry with joy if we land Evan Turner. He is a playmaker and shows capability of being an elite scorer, while also playing stellar defense. I think he may struggle guarding some of the bigger 3’s like ‘Mello and LeBron, but who doesn’t? Overall he and Brewer on the wings would be damn near perfect.
by Rascal Flatts on Feb 7, 2010 5:51 PM CST up reply actions
Can someone other than RF answer??
I think it depends on what they do with their big guys. If they keep Jefferson, then he controls the post, thus a sharpshooting wing is a great complement to AL and CB. If Jefferson is gone, and a deeper shooter like Love is the PF, then a slasher fills the bill because they will need someone who can get to the hoop. This is one of the things I like about Brewer, his skill set (especially defense) will work with either group.
I think if the wing is Turner
we will be just fine (or wes for that matter). Wes is already a good shooter and Turner will learn to be. The man is that dedicated.
As far as FA goes, I think you are looking for a moderate mix. If both he to be named later and Brewer can slash and shoot, it is much harder to defend.
by TheEvilProfessor on Feb 7, 2010 7:38 PM CST up reply actions
Absolutely not
I will just pretend you didn’t answer! ;-)
No I was just trying to shift from responding to LoveTo to responding to RF and I didn’t want to overflow my own post with my own comments.
Definitely depends who is around him, but good point that his skillset really does fit with most types of players. Especially if his shot stays the way it has been in 2010.
Compare him to Trenton Hassel
He was a starter on our contending team in 03-04. Brewer is already a more competent offensive player than Hassel was (wouldn’t take much). And if we had the 03-04 version of KG helping out in the paint, I suspect we’d find Brewer’s defense much more impressive than we do now. He’s clearly not a star, nor a star in the making, and won’t ever make an all-star team, but I could see him doing a fair Tayshaun Prince impression for the next 5 to 7.
I seem to remember Bill Simmons comparing Brewer to Pippen leading up to the draft (he really wanted the C’s to take Brewer at 5, before they made the Ray Allen trade). Obviously that is not in the cards, but as Rascal says, you’d like to set the bar high for a top-6 or 7 pick. Of course, in hindsight, given that Brewer had been giving us nothing, I’ll take a poor-man’s Tayshaun.
I like the Tayshaun comp
and I would even go so far as to say he could be slightly better than Tayshaun. I acutally just made the comparison of Brewer/Ebanks/Turner as a combination with similar skillsets to Prince/Hamilton in a different thread.
Can you imagine how much space
Flynn/Session is going to have in the paint to slash when defenders have to honor Brewer’s range? So many of his shots are just wide open. It’s like people don’t actually watch game film of him. Man, I wonder how severe of a hack job Wittman and McHale did on their own draft picks.
by TheEvilProfessor on Feb 7, 2010 5:08 PM CST up reply actions
You lead me to the question I've been thinking of lately
Is it more important to get lucky in the lottery, or is what really counts having good coaching and a team that pushes a young player? Obviously some really high picks produce regardless of their surroundings, but I often wonder if the difference between the lottery picks who produce or not really has as much to do with the team as the player. If Wittman were still coaching this team Brewer would be on his way out of the league, or at best hoping to latch on with the right team!
Short answer
There is no cap on coaching and front office expenses. Name me the team that has won a championship while skimping on those two.
by TheEvilProfessor on Feb 7, 2010 7:39 PM CST up reply actions
Good question, can't think of one
Switching to a different sport, one of the reasons I think Tom Kelly should be in the Hall of Fame is that he brought the most out of players, no matter their raw talent. If he had “players”, he won. Unfortunately, the mid-late 90’s were short on “players”.
Herb Brooks did the same at the U of M and the Olympics (even his 2nd team that won the silver).
Brewer's ceiling
I don’t think its easy to define. Obviously, if he can make the jump from barely competent to solid starting SG in three months, I have no doubt that if he kept working hard he could make an all-star team. There aren’t a lot of 6’9" guys with his athleticism. Add in consistent shooting, and a little more strength and this guy could be a beast when he enters his prime. Maybe not a consistent all-star, but a solid player who makes an all-star team in the right year.
Perhaps the toughest part of a draft
is figuring out which players have already peaked in terms of their potential, and which players are raw and able to make drastic improvement.
Well, I still think he's a bench guy on a contender
FIrst, I’m not sold that the last month is a new level for him, as opposed to a hot streak. I think there is real improvement, but…maybe not this much. Plus, he still doesn’t handle well enough.
Anyway, I’m trying not to get carried away based on a 4 game winning streak.
Yeah
I think most of the argument against him at this point is that he still has a lot to prove. Personally, I still think he has to put together his defensive prowess from his first couple years with his newfound offensive aptitude and when he does, he will be a good guy to have on our team.
bench energy
I think he would be pretty hard tp stop coming off the bench. He would certainly bring a helleva lot of energy and would easily be able to shut down the other team’s sixth man, probably regardless of position (well maybe not center). Then again, how many teams have a center for a sixth man?
by scottysnowski on Feb 8, 2010 10:51 PM CST up reply actions
I think the Timberwolves have by far
the best bench in the league… too bad they’re all starting…
I was cautiously optimistic about Brewer before the season
but I really saw his potential as a 6th man on a contender. He could play 20 MPG, focusing on defense and getting 8 PPG in transition or occasionally driving and dunking.
Now I think he can start for a contender, although he needs a very strong wing next to him. Also, Brewer will be the 5th starter on a contender (maybe the 4th if the C is a defensive specialist and they have a couple great scorers). His hustle and competitiveness will go a long way on a contending team, especially those nights where other guys are low on energy.
If he is a 6th man, the team is going to be very good on the wings, so that is not necessarily a bad thing. That said, Kahn should now be focusing on getting ONE very dynamic wing player (that #1 player he talks about) and be content with Brewer.
Yeah, my Timberwolves shopping list before the season was:
1.) Starting-caliber wing player
2.) Another starting-caliber wing player
3.) Athletic true center.
Now 2 and 3 have flipped around. Which is good.
Few Points
1. Shouts to Rev over at Real GM and Andy G for being fellow Brewer believers when things looked bleak.
2. I think his long-term upside is that of a Plus Starter (Elite Defender) who holds his on own Offense.
He's a good 6th man
He’s a good 6th man or a decent starter on a winning team. Ideally, he comes off the bench IMO.
Revisionism
Brewer is really only in his sophmore season, in effect, due to his injury. I agree with the poster that how well a particular draft pick performs is in now way predictable by their draft position. Many factors enter into it, not the least of which is the player’s attitude and the coach’s disposition. Brewer might very well be out of the league with Wittman still here. Love might be riding the bench and never shooting threes to seal up games. Confidence in yourself is important. On the other hand, McCants could have become a potential all-star had he been a bit more focused and willing to be a team player. He was overconfident. Any way, kudos to Brewer. He seems to be a good kid and fans love his energy and enthusiasm.
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