New CBA proposal reinforces -- the argument to get Rubio here next season! the new CBA proposes to reduce rookie salaries by 1/3 and only guarantees half of that. .
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 9, 2010 3:16 PM CST
34 comments
As things stand now, in theory Rubio joins us in the summer of 2011, when the new CBA will come into effect or there will be a strike.
How is the new CBA likely to affect rookies?
The goal of the NBA is to reduce the percentage of revenues going to the players from 57% to about 45%..
The NBA also wants to reduce financial risk for teams.
So contracts for veterans are worth less -- only $60 million max.
Its also bad for rookies:
* First round draft picks salaries cut by 1/3
* all contracts in the new proposal would be guaranteed for only half of their value, and in some instances players would receive less than 50 percent.
[The first two bullet points effectively mean that a first round pick would only be guaranteed 1/3 of the money compared to the current CBA since he gets 2/3 of previous and only half of that is guaranteed. ]
Who will the union work hardest to protect? its first priority is to protect CURRENT UNION MEMBERS. Thats players who NOW play for teams. Until players are actually in the NBA they are not union members. So the union has less incentive to protect rookie salaries, contract length, guaranteed payouts etc. etc.
Kahn should make the case with Rubio that he should come over this coming summer before the new CBA adversely affects his salary etc.
European contracts are more flexible than ours. So he Rubio should be able to get out of his contract if he really wants to. All its takes is some goodwill and compensation. If my argument is sound Rubio could "reduce" his financial risk by coming over sooner.
What do you think?
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Additional info. New CBA Proposal:
* proposal effectively seeks a "hard" salary cap, eliminating tools such as the Bird and midlevel exceptions that allow teams over the cap to sign free agents.
* Commissioner David Stern has said the central issue will be the division of revenues, with players currently collecting 57 percent of the basketball-related income. The person said that would decrease to less than 45 percent using the current BRI formula
see the full new CBA proposal - here: http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=Ag1I7UgKRwSflaewwtbkGTW8vLYF?slug=ap-all-star-labor&prov=ap&type=lgns
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Here's the question I wish someone would have asked Kahn yesterday...
David, do you think Rubio has improved as much this year as he would have being on the Wolves?
If he is progressing well, might as well stay in Spain and progress another year at no cost to the Wolves, then Flynn can get max playing time. However, if he isn’t progressing as well as he should be, then the Wolves should try to get him here next season. I don’t think it makes the Wolves any better next season, although it would sell tickets!
by Rumblebee on Feb 9, 2010 4:36 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
If Flynn was here he'd be progressing more. Why?
1) competition is tougher in NBA, the sooner Rubio sees it the better.
2) He’d be playing more A) we play 82 games, they play something closer to a college schedule. B) He’d be playing 30 minutes per game not 20.
3) He’d be learning the wolves offense, which isn’t easy to learn
4) He’d also develop chemistry with players
5) Familiarity with coaches
6) Get used to the travel schedule, which our college players find so difficult….
and there are more which I’ve missed, I’m sure.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 9, 2010 4:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
idk
I do remember reading that he said he would like to win a euroleague cup before coming to the NBA so lets see who wins; this would probably determine his desicion idk
by anen87 on Feb 9, 2010 7:54 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
There's no way he comes over during this off-season.
…Think about it. Barcelona coughed up 5-6million and would only get him for one year?? No way. He would have an even higher price than last summer, and the Wolves would be in the same situation. The reason he did it was because he’s making much better money (I think it was around a million euros/season) and his buy-out was still reduced to nothing after two years. He will be over in 2011 – not sooner. I see your point, but Rubio’s destiny is locked.
by Boss10 on Feb 9, 2010 10:12 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I think its $5.3 million. Think of it like a "bonus" divided over two seasons he is expected to play there. Half used this season... so Rubio would "owe" the other half.
He’s have to borrow $3 million from the wolves to be repaid with his contract
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 9, 2010 10:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I scolded you for this in a different FanPost
but I’m going to do it again. You can’t just pull this kind of stuff out of your ass.
“European contracts are more flexible than ours.” What are you implying by this? Yes, they’re more likely to include buyout clauses to allow for their promising young players to leave for the NBA. However, we know that Rubio’s includes no buyout for 2010. Even if Barca were totally willing to try to get out of it, which they won’t be, it wouldn’t matter. Both parties are bound to its terms.
I also think you’re reaching in your interpretation of the upcoming CBA changes. The rookie pay scale is one of the things that actually works about the current CBA. None of the owners complain about it, nor do the rookies. Rookies are generally underpaid, if anything. I seriously doubt the new CBA will introduce any significant changes to the current system of rookie salaries.
by John Doe on Feb 9, 2010 10:35 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I've decided this post was too harsh.
Sorry. But I do think you’re really grasping at straws here.
by John Doe on Feb 10, 2010 1:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree that KLJ is grasping at straws and that Rubio will not be coming over next season
however, one thing you said isn’t really true:
“Even if Barca were totally willing to try to get out of it, which they won’t be, it wouldn’t matter. Both parties are bound to its terms.”
Everything is negotiable. Contracts can and often are renegotiated. However, as you say, the important thing is that Barca will have no interest in doing so.
by Eric in Madison on Feb 10, 2010 7:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What I'm saying about Rookies making less money is just logical deduction. [By the way I do like straws with my soft drinks]
The league wants to reduce total percentage of revenues for players from 58% to less than 50%. If the league succeeds in reducing percentage of revenues for players, rookie revenues as a percentage of total player revenues will have to be lowered proportionally or their share of total player revenues will increase.
That means veteran players take twice the hit. Once by taking a lesser share of NBA revenues. A second time if rookie revenues are not reduced proportionally to total player reductions.
Since college players [pre-rookies] are not represented by the union, I think its unlikely that veterans take a double financial hit because rookie salaries are sacred.
Its just common sense, IF THE NBA SUCCEEDS IN LOWERING PERCENTAGE OF NBA REVENUES GOING TO PLAYERS.
Again, I’m not saying Rubio will be playing next season. Just that its not outside the range of possibility.
The Wolves won’t acknowledge this type of thinking because fans would be disappointed if they thought Rubio could come over and didn’t. They want to manage expectations.
But if you see Rubio in the fall, don’t be totally surprised.
[I’m not just a naive fan. I have business experience. I’m not some college kid sitting in the dorm.]
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 10, 2010 3:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
didn't say it would happen just that it could. Just need good will or "compensation". I have an MBA from a top 5 business school. See this type of thing all time.
I’m not a lawyer, but have read many many contracts and have ended up modifying many of them at my company’s or the “other firms” request.
Simply scenario. Rubio’s team wins a Spanish league or Euro league championship or both this season. Rubio is a hero in Barcelona. He is the local hometown hero. If he asked his team to allow him to get out of the contract early and promised to compensate for a “suitable” portion of their expenses for his buyout, I think it is possible.
The hometown hero wants to do something that is fair for all parties. It could be pubic relations disaster if Barcelona refused.
But I am an optimist admittedly.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 10, 2010 2:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I can appreciate self honesty
I mean seriously, if someone will lie to themselfs, I guarantee you they would lie to someone else. :)
by TheEvilProfessor on Feb 10, 2010 7:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
themselves...not themselfs
didn’t catch that the first time around.
by TheEvilProfessor on Feb 10, 2010 7:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
whats that supposed to mean... I'll deluding myself? again, I'm not saying it will happen only that it could.....
I’m being entirely realistic….
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 10, 2010 8:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You think it would be a P.R. disaster for Barca to hold on to Ricky for another year?
Not likely. In my experience, European fans tend to be more understanding when players want to move on, especially when they’re trying to take the “next step.” But they’re not going to freak out on the team for keeping him an extra year, even if they do have sympathy for him. In this situation, especially given the many years remaining in his career he can use to play in the NBA, they’d probably be quite happy to have him another year. So I don’t think much could happen to make Barca feel like they’re backed into a corner. Short of Ricky throwing a huge public fit, urinating in public on the Catalan flag or something along those lines.
by museum on Feb 11, 2010 5:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Though I agree with you that anything is possible
Just extremely, extremely unlikely in this case.
by museum on Feb 11, 2010 5:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You could be right. Maybe fans have sympathy for home town hero but want him to stay for another year.
I do hope Ricki wants to join us early – to be part of “our bright future” and to get ahead of projected salary reduction and I hope Kahn facilitates.
I at least want to hope that this type of financial scenario has been presented to Ricki as a possibility. Get him thinking along these lines.
The sooner he comes over the better for his development and for the team’s ability to integrate him.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 11, 2010 9:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Rubio does not have any buyout option until after next season.
by Ming on Feb 9, 2010 11:24 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
With the new CBA...
(assuming it will cut into player salaries)…isn’t it more likely that Rubio (and a lot of other Euro players as well) are just going to stay in Europe for the bigger bucks?
Why bother to come over here at all if you could make more money playing in front of your friends and family?
(As a side note, I might have to be some what skeptical of player compensation going down on the grounds of what I said above. The NBA, if it continues insisting on player salary reduction, might just find itself losing talent to Europe…we’re there stories circulating last year about Kobe or Lebron going to Europe? This is probably just non-sense, but its something I think the league may need to seriously consider before its gets to “hard” on player salaries and such.)
by pablo85 on Feb 10, 2010 5:13 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Hey, that would be cool! Kobe & LBJ going to Urop!
It would open up the league. I assume it would not happen next season, too early. But if it happened 2-3-4 seasons from now, It would be in our favor to get those 2 horses into a different stable.
by timmuggs on Feb 10, 2010 5:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That was also before the stories about a couple of teams
being delinquent with player salaries. 100% of 17M is much more than 50% of 25M.
by TheEvilProfessor on Feb 10, 2010 7:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes.
I’m already sick of waiting. I don’t think I can take another season.
by John Wall on Feb 11, 2010 5:34 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
On the one hand
it might be advantageous for him to come over before the CBA reduces salaries but on the other hand it would be incredibly disadvantageous to come over one year before a potential lockout. If there’s a lockout in his 2nd year then he won’t be getting paid at all.
by Bethke on Feb 11, 2010 9:14 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
thats a valid argument. Do you think there will be a lockout? In this financial environment and I'm not sure it will be a whole lot better in 18 months, a lockout or strike further reduces fan interest, which is already waning.
With so many teams having financial problems, players and the union know they have to compromise on salary.
The question becomes how to do it fairly. One way would be tie percentage of revenues paid in salary to the players to total level of NBA revenues. Some type of sliding scale. The healthier the league is financially, the higher the percentage players get.
These things can be worked out if there is good will on both sides. Neither side wants to further hurt the fan base.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 11, 2010 12:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
further .... CBA proposal - Rubio should know about...
contracts in the new proposal would be guaranteed for only half of their value, and in some instances players would receive less than 50 percent.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 11, 2010 10:42 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
This is a little detail of the new proposal -
Proposed by NBA:
- First round draft picks salaries cut by 1/3
- contracts in the new proposal would be guaranteed for only half of their value, and in some instances players would receive less than 50 percent.
- the max for any contract – a veteran – would be $60 million.
- proposal effectively seeks a “hard” salary cap, eliminating tools such as the Bird and midlevel exceptions that allow teams over the cap to sign free agents.
- Commissioner David Stern has said the central issue will be the division of revenues, with players currently collecting 57 percent of the basketball-related income. The person said that would decrease to less than 45 percent using the current BRI formula
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 11, 2010 10:46 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I think
those cuts on first round pick salaries are just rookie contracts, and Rubio can get out of signing a rookie scale deal if he stays in Spain for two more years after this year. Might make even more sense for him to stay over there than it did before.
by museum on Feb 11, 2010 11:04 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Taylor leads the committee working that issue... Do rookie contracts EXPIRE after a certain period of time... I'd bet big money thats not in the new CBA.
Think about it. The NBA is doing everything it can to bring salaries down.
They will require all first round picks to go through the rookie contract in the new CBA, to keep team costs down!
If they lower rookie salaries as much as they are proposing every good young player would go to Europe for 3 years and then start as a veteran…. AINT GOING TO HAPPEN!
Thats totally contradicts what the NBA is trying to accomplish with the new CBA
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 11, 2010 11:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Possibly
But I think the NBA hasn’t gotten to the point of seriously worrying about losing “every good young player” to Europe, and I don’t know that that should be a major concern at this point, with American players at least. And allowing a way out of the rookie scale could be an incentive for older, established players to come play in the NBA, which the league most definitely wants. Force a guy like Manu Ginobili (a second round pick, but you get the point) to play at the rookie scale, maybe he doesn’t come. Especially with European teams willing to pay more.
by museum on Feb 11, 2010 11:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
currently no 2nd round pick has guaranteed money. Thats how we got pekovic.
I’ve read a lot about the “Rubio loophole”, waiting for 3 years. Every knowledgeable analyst has said Kahn leads that committee and that loophole will be closed in the new CBA.
Since Rubio will only have waited 2 years before the new CBA in the summer of 2011, the old CBA allowing him to be treated as a veteran is null and void and the new CBA disallowing that process takes effect.
by Kevin Love Jefferson on Feb 11, 2010 11:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
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