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The Minnesota Timberwolves will trade Al Jefferson to the....

Who? That's the question. We know for pretty close to certain that it will happen....we just don't know when or to where.

Al_jefferson_celebrating-5095_medium

All season, Big Al's name has come up in trade rumors. Al Jefferson for Amare Stoudemire (bet a lot of us wish we could revisit that one...) Al Jefferson for Danny Granger. Al Jefferson for Luol Deng. For Tayshaun Prince. For Troy Murphy. For Zach Randolph.

Lately, Wolves fans....and Canis Hoopsters in particular....have been very down on Al's trade value. He's not a good fit, we have plenty of other big men, the team has publicly declared it intends to trade him and then he declared himself that he wants out.

Well Hoopusters, take a deep breath. Al Jefferson isn't a salary dump, and the last two weeks have proven it.

Star-divide

One thing has become very obvious lately: the number of teams looking for a quality big man far exceed the number of quality big men available in free agency.

And further, several teams we weren't expecting to look for big men....well, are.

Free agency has already been helter skelter, as most of you know, but if you add up the little things, it starts to equal one really big thing for us....Al is going to be in demand by the summer's end. Every time a team overpays to retain its own players, every time a Carlos Boozer to Orlando trade comes up, every time two or more of the big name free agents visit the same team, Al's value goes up. Teams overpaying their own players takes those players off the market and away from other teams looking to address needs....teams that can't afford Bosh, but need something. Rumors like Boozer to the Magic (potentially) send free agent big men to teams that didn't save up for this summer....and takes one more quality big man away from a team that did. Two big name free agents on one team means one less free agent for a different team....a team that starts seeing itself getting shut out.

Suddenly Al's public availability stops being a liability and becomes an asset.

I've divided the list of possible Al Jefferson destinations into three categories: teams that are interested, teams that are likely to be interested, and teams that could become interested.

  • Teams that are interested:

Dallas Mavericks:

Did anyone see this coming? I mean, Mark Cuban has a reputation for making bold, spur of the moment choices, but this was completely unexpected.

Mark-cuban-2_medium

The Mavs were a little spooked when Dirk opted out of his contract. Not scared, and not really even worried that they wouldn't resign him. But they got the message: get help.

Well, they don't exactly have cap space to burn, so the next best thing is a trade.

As good a big man as Nowitzki is, he's also unconventional. He's a shooter. A really really really damn good shooter, but a shooter nonetheless. His post game is limited in the way Kevin Garnett's is. You'll get a solid turn-around jumper and maybe a few baby hooks, and that's it.

The plan of getting defenders to equal out difference didn't work. Brendan Haywood turned out to be a less-than-spectacular post defender. Tim Duncan annihilated the Mavs in the playoffs. So apparently Cuban (in classic Cuban fashion) has decided to swing the pendulum the other way and trade "defense" for offense.

It's not precise what the initial offer was from the Mavs, but comments for the team and just common sense give us a pretty good guess: Erick Dampier. Start the negotiations strong, right? I'm not sure what else the Mavs could include....or what we'd even want from them....but they are definitely interested and I'd expect them to come calling again this summer.

And yes. I intentionally posted a picture of Mark Cuban for this section because I know how much Canis Hoopus loves Mark Cuban. Right??? You love him.

Denver Nuggets:

Another team I wasn't expecting, but hey, who's complaining? The Nuggets have a ton of desirable assets for us: Nene, JR Smith, Chauncey Billups, Ty Lawson, and of course, Melo.

And I have noticed a massive increase in enthusiasm over Melo.

Nba_u_melo11_576_medium

Granted, the Nuggets are unlikely to trade their franchise player for Al, but there is a lot of fuel on the fire and stranger things have happened.

The Nuggets, of course, are offering the same thing as the Mavs, just in the form of Kenyon Martin: cap space. A big expiring contract. Again, I don't see us biting on that. But I've read in several articles and have been told by several Nuggets fans that the team would seriously consider making Nene or JR Smith a part of the deal if we sweetened our end a bit.

Trading Jefferson for Nene? I can get behind that.

Of course, I'd love Melo the most. I think everyone would. I mean, who could forget this masterpiece?

Any chance that would get Melo to do that for us rather than against us is worth taking.

And since we are talking Melo and the Nuggets, here's something I posted earlier that bears repeating:

Melo has a 3 year, $65 mil extention on the table right now

Keep an eye on it. How he reacts will say a lot about what he thinks Denver’s future is. He wasn’t very optimistic on it following the Jazz series

Denver is documented as interested in Jefferson and are putting a lot out there right now. I’ve read articles and talked to various fans who bring up Kenyon Martin, JR Smith, Nene, and Billups all as players Denver would trade for Al. But not Melo

BUT if he decides he doesn’t want to be in Denver, they might be forced to trade him anyway

by Oceanary on Jul 1, 2010 9:24 PM PDT reply actions  

The relationship there is tenuous. Melo was very unhappy....and very critical....after the team's loss to the Jazz in the playoffs. Factor in that he doesn't mind going to a rebuilding team and loves playing in an open court system, and the idea of Melo to the Timberwolves seems like something really worth pursuing, doesn't it?

Indiana Pacers:

They were linked to us in a rumored Al Jefferson/Danny Granger deal (which it's still unclear how that started....) and have since been on the phones shopping Troy Murphy.

They also have something of a problem at shooting guard, and are in bad bad need of a point guard.

I'm not sure who the Pacers could offer. I know Canis Hoops is still really interested in a Danny Granger deal, but I just don't see that happening. Outside of that, there's pretty much just Paul George and Roy Hibbert, and it seems that the Wolves could and should be able to find something better elsewhere.

But Indiana is definitely on the "interested" list.

Detroit Pistons:

Even though they drafted Greg Monroe, the Pistons are still looking for big man help. We offered Al for Tayshaun Prince right before the draft, and I think that deal would still have merit for both sides.

Nba_g_prince1_580_medium

Prince would be a great one-year rental and/or trading piece for the deadline. Teams that have established themselves as playoff-bound would highly covet Prince. Detroit also has promising forwards Austin Daye and Jonas Jerebko that could be bargained for. It's likely we'll be in contact with Detroit again this summer, as they're one of the teams desperate for immediate help, but without the money to spend in free agency.

Golden State Warriors:

I'm not sure what to say about this other than we know the Warriors are interested. I can't really explain that interest....but it's there.

We discussed before the draft a possible Jefferson for Anthony Randolph deal with the Warriors. Those talks are dead. But our interest in Randolph is still alive and so is their interest in Al. So this could start going somewhere again.

Certainly any trade with the Warriors would have to be for Randolph. No other player makes sense except for Steph Curry, and they won't be giving him up.

Still, Randolph would be a fantastic pickup for us. He's long, athletic, can really run the floor, defends the rim, and has a multi-dimensional skillset that still has a lot of potential for growth. A perfect fit next to Darko in our frontcourt.

Personally I feel this is a real missed opportunity, because we could have had Randolph for fairly cheap at the beginning of last season, if the team hadn't been so hellbent on proving to itself Al and Love couldn't play together successfully.

Memphis Grizzlies:

Another trade discussion that died. Jefferson for Zach Randolph would be a salary dump, and if we were content with that, we might as well trade Al for Dampier or Murphy or KMart. It's not what we're looking for, and we'll be able to negotiate for much more later this summer.

In the meantime, the Grizzlies have a perplexing situation they've gotten themselves into that could make on player in particular up fro grabs: OJ Mayo. Think about this.....the Grizzlies traded Pau Gasol because they weren't winning and he was too expensive. Then last year, they started winning, so it's spend spend spend again.

Their interest in Jefferson is because they've flown into win-now territory again. Al does the same thing as ZBo, but is under contract for longer, so they'd be able to keep him for longer without having to do free agent negotiations.  But at the same time, they're still a cost-conscious team, with a looming decision to make about OJ Mayo, and a glaring need at point guard.

If we were to up the ante on both sides....say Jefferson, Ramon Sessions and Corey Brewer for ZBo and OJ Mayo, I think we'd have their attention.

  • Teams that are likely interested

Chicago Bulls and New Jersey Nets:

This category is a little...I don't know. Unique.

The reality is both team are definitely interested. Both teams have been in contact with us about Jefferson already. Both have a need for a player of his type and quality (I'm still not convinced Al and Brook Lopez are that compatible, but for the sake of this write up, I'll roll with it)

The condition, of course (and why I categorize them as likely), is unlike the teams above, these two teams have money to spend on free agents. Lots and lots and lots of money. Meaning Al isn't their first choice....Chris Bosh is, then Carlos Boozer, then David Lee. Then Al Jefferson.

There's a couple kickers, here of course. One is Amare Stoudemire is off the market now, so that option is already gone. Two, Carlos Boozer is drawing strong interested from the Magic (I told you drafting Daniel Orton would be big for them). Three, David Lee is drawing strong interest from....well, us (and several other teams not looking to land one of the big three). And four, there's a chance either team could land both Wade and LeBron, which would leave them no money to spend on any free agent big man.

Nba_bosh_james_wade_576_medium

I post this picture to ridicule it. That is some terrible composition work. If you're not going to have LeBron overlap the other two, at least have frames around them or something. The little white gaps that cut off half their arms look ridiculous. C'mon ESPN...don't let junior interns do your front page graphic design.

Anyway, of the two, the Nets are the more desirable trading partner, because they have Derrick Favors. I know there's a good number of Hoopsters interested in Luol Deng, but Favors is really the better option for both now and in the future.

But basically the deal is this: if either team strikes out on Bosh, Boozer and/or Lee, they will come calling about Al.

  • Teams that could become interested

Orlando Magic:

It's pretty simple. They want Boozer. If they don't get Boozer, who else can they target? It'd be either Lee or Jefferson, and since I'm guessing the point is to add legitimate post scoring, it'd most likely be Jefferson.

Phoenix Suns:

They wanted Al before, and now with Stoudemire officially out the door, they could want him again. Of course, they have a lot less to bargain with now, but there's still players worth talking about here. Jason Richardson. Robin Lopez. Leandro Barbosa, Earl Clark, Channing Frye.

Like how the opening commentary on that was Jim Pete? Ya, that was our third game of the season when Channing Frye BURIED US from three. I know Frye got a deal that's more than he's really worth, but still....he'd be a solid rotation player who fits our system.

I have a feeling the Suns will come calling at some point this summer. They can't just blow it all up....as long as Nash is on the roster, they have to try and win now.

Boston Celtics:

I've had a lot of Celtics fans tell me that the C's are contemplating how they can put together an offer for Jefferson using Big Baby and the contract of Rasheed Wallace. Make what you want of it.

San Antonio Spurs:

The franchise caught a huge break when Richard Jefferson chose to opt out of his deal. Granted it was a solid decision for him too....he just did not fit in with the Spurs, and now he can pick where he goes next....but that's $15 million the Spurs suddenly aren't spending.

What they do have is a big need in the frontcourt to get Duncan help. Blair is a monster on the glass, but he's not much for carrying a scoring load and is on the short side. Given the style the Spurs play, Jefferson would be a pretty good fit for them and would fill a need.

The Spurs have an army of possible trade options. Tony Parker is arguably expendable with George Hill performing so well, and they have tons of possible sign-and-trade options with all the players who hit free agency from their roster this year.

It's more speculation than anything here, but this is the "could become" category, so...

Utah Jazz:

They're most likely losing Carlos Boozer, and are still looking for takers on Andre Kirilenko's deal.

Portland Trailblazers:

Superstitions aside, this is a team that has a couple players out-of-water, so to speak, and are in need of bodies in the frontcourt. In that Jefferson is a skilled, scoring body that would fit their roster and system, I could see interest developing here. Jefferson would do better with them, and LaMarcus Aldridge would do better with us.

Miami Heat:

Well, if they can't keep Wade, they won't get LeBron or Bosh. And they'll need something, right?

Toronto Raptors:

Ok. This is another unique situation, which is basically that the Raptors could make a call about Al in connection to Chris Bosh, or completely separate from him.

Bosh-chris-get-080801-584_medium

I know the team has basically given up on Bosh, but I think that's a mistake. Especially if Wade and LeBron end up on the same team, we can sell Bosh on the same thing as anyone else really: we have a roster that compliments him at every position, and he can be the undisputed #1 guy with us. If he can't team with Wade of James, that's the same offer everyone else will be making him. Bosh to the Wolves would necessitate a sign and trade that would send Al (and someone else....my suggestion would be Webster) back to the Raptors.

If we don't or can't sell him on it, well, the Raptors are still down one highly productive big man.

So as you can see, there are a number of teams already interested in Al, and a number more who could be by summer's end. His value will probably be pretty solid late this month, so I wouldn't sweat over us trading him for nickles and dimes.

Comment 103 comments  |  5 recs  | 

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nice work

BigAl next to DHoward could be scary. Could Gortat and Redick or Pietrus be enough?

by nodnarb on Jul 3, 2010 2:53 AM CDT reply actions  

Do we know for sure

that the Wolves offered Al for Prince before the draft?

by littleboxes on Jul 3, 2010 7:09 AM CDT reply actions  

Yes

It was reported by Chad Ford and confirmed by DX

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/17022/wednesday-night-draft-chatter

I’m not sure if Minnesota will greet the news with joy or relief. They focused in on Johnson early but got comfortable with the idea of taking Favors at 4 over the course of the last 24 hours. The Wolves continue to look for an Al Jefferson deal after being rebuffed by Detroit over the weekend (Wolves offered Jefferson for Tayshaun Prince and No. 7) and the Grizzlies (for Zach Randolph) earlier in the day.

by Oceanary on Jul 4, 2010 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

great writing

amazing how you can go to a website of a franchise mired in losing and mockery and get a better article then you could ever hope to read in SI or ESPN Magazine. Exceptional.

Great quote here:

Personally I feel this is a real missed opportunity, because we could have had Randolph for fairly cheap at the beginning of last season, if the team hadn’t been so hellbent on proving to itself Al and Love couldn’t play together successfully.

I have hope for this year (and this summer). Just frustrating when the team does things (Jefferson + Love together!) and it’s obvious to everyone else (not just media, but fans of the team, fans of other teams, casual observers) that it’s not going to work. And it doesn’t. Would have been nice to be out front on the Jefferson/Love thing. But such is life

Kahn Has a Top Secret Plan that even he doesn't know about

by Son of Gerald Green on Jul 3, 2010 7:49 AM CDT reply actions  

A possible David Lee deal

I am trying to connect a few dots here.

Given that the Twolves are pretty much left with a S&T deal involving Big Al, it is interesting that David Lee is visiting the Twolves. The only way they can get him is in a sign and trade deal where NY gets something in return. Given that NY is expecting the sign Amare, they probably are not interested in Big Al.

According the Hoopshype.com, Tony Parker is very interested in playing in NY with Amare. With the Spurs on the list of Big Al suitors, a possible trade scenario is Big Al to the Spurs, Parker to the Knicks, and Lee to the Twolves.

by tomxx on Jul 3, 2010 7:51 AM CDT reply actions  

I sure hope not

I don’t like David Lee on the Wolves.

by Facial on Jul 3, 2010 8:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

Not sure how Lee makes sense for T'Wolves

I’m a fan of Lee and If he’ll probably leave NY, if it happens it’ll probably be better for him but it doesn’t make sense. the 4 spot is a little crowded already and of the many good things Lee does D isn’t one of them.

Actually he’s pretty similar to Love, so why Lee? An off guard would make more sense.

Maybe Kahn should move in on the Joe Johnson action try to pull a sign and trade, ATL needs another interior presence?

What did the 5 fingers say to the face?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R7CBwX1891A
HaHaHaHa!

by Lord Smackington on Jul 3, 2010 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

Lee signing

We sign Lee for a reasonable amount and then trade Love for another player on a rookie deal. Because of the high supply of PF’s right now, we might be able to sign Lee for a reasonable amount, whereas Love will probably ask for the world in a couple years — and he may not be worth it.

by Mike B. on Jul 3, 2010 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

Lee will probably cost you what your paying for Jefferson now

12-13M, the minimum he’s asking for is 10M. I think he’s a bargain at that price but if you use Jefferson in a sign and trade for Lee, you’d be right to trade Love but then your back at square 1 and just tore up your front court.

I think Kahn could use Jefferson as a salary dump trade and then use the spare cash to pick up say….a roger mason jr maybe? There are a few dynamic two guards on the market.

What did the 5 fingers say to the face?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R7CBwX1891A
HaHaHaHa!

by Lord Smackington on Jul 3, 2010 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Revisit Amare?

He would have been a rental player. By now Al would be a pure salary dump.

by Miss Test Pattern on Jul 3, 2010 8:04 AM CDT reply actions  

A good rundown

But, as I often do, I think you are radically optimistic about what teams are interested in Jefferson, and what he could bring back.

For example, if Dallas offered Erick Dampier’s magic disappearing contract, Kahn would have jumped on that before the Mavs could hang up the phone. The articles I read said they did not make that offer.

“We know the Warriors are interested.” We do? How do we know this?

I’m just not as convinced that there is a much bigger demand for power forwards than there is supply. with STAT, Lee, Boozer, and Bosh on the market. Once those guys go, there might be someone still looking, but…I’m not feeling a feeding frenzy.

We Are the Washington Generals

by Eric in Madison on Jul 3, 2010 8:33 AM CDT reply actions  

How many teams have huge amounts of cap space?

If 2 of the big 3 free agents end up in the same place and a few other FA’s re-up with their current teams, the teams with a ton of cap space are going to be scrambling.

by KMils on Jul 3, 2010 8:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

Teams with cap space

NY, NJ, Chi, Miami, LAC

NY: Amare
Chi: Bosh
Miami: Boozer
NJ: Lee

(For example. Sure, maybe Boozer goes to Orlando in an S&T or something).

I don’t envision a ton of scrambling for Al Jefferson.

We Are the Washington Generals

by Eric in Madison on Jul 3, 2010 8:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

clips don’t need a PF

by tkired on Jul 4, 2010 2:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

they might when Griffen gets hurt again. Aren’t the Clippers cursed?

by nodnarb on Jul 4, 2010 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think this is the penultimate best chance

to land a star. Not with just Al, but with Al+ (Sessions/Flynn/Brewer/Pek/etc.) + a protected first rounder, in exchange for somebody like (but not necessarily) Granger—a good player in his mid 20s on a big, long contract.

Kahn’s greatest achievement in the past year has been that he has a player at every position who is serviceable, young, and cheap—especially relative to some of the FA deals offered in the past few days.

It’s like he’s standing in the parking lot at Wal-Mart with his trunk open, soliciting other teams as they walk by. “Waddya need? I got me some point guards, I got long twos, some skinny threes, rebounding fours, a couple a foreign fives—hell, back at the home office I got a whole bunch of foreigners that just came in. You’d love ’em!”

The downside of this approach is that if other teams aren’t offering much of interest for Al other than a “meh” player like we already have, it’s unlikely the Wolves are going to improve much beyond the 20-30 win mark until Rubio gets here.

by PoorDick on Jul 3, 2010 8:55 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

I agree

And this is no small feat. We have tradeable assets (though I don’t want to trade a first rounder because we still owe the Clips for Marko). Think after the dust settles people will come a knocking. The worst thing we can do is rush the Al trade. The guys not a cancer, he’s young, and after this FA period, he’s a good value.

And along with Rubio, if we could get a star, we’d really have something.

by Rodman99 on Jul 3, 2010 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

No small feat?

Kahn had 3 lotto picks, the 16 and 23 this year along with the 28 last year (when you add em together, 6 firstr rounders sounds like a lot huh?) and several 2nd rounders. We had Pekovic’s rights, the MLE last year and a ton of cap space this year. With all of that we’ve netted “tradeable assets?”

by Blond Ricky on Jul 3, 2010 6:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Even if we get a good player for Al

… we are looking at a 20-30 win season. This team is being built for Rubio.

by Dave T on Jul 3, 2010 10:11 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

I agree it's being built for Rubio

but I think they need to get much better in the meantime because:

1. More losses = less revenue
2. Rubio might not ever come
3. Rubio might not come to play with four versions of Corey Brewer
4. They’re not going to have a whole lot more opportunities to get better before the beginning of the 2011 season

by PoorDick on Jul 3, 2010 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

What is our goal at this point?

So many of our supposed targets are SFs. Really? We want to add Deng, Granger, or Prince after the draft we just had? Even Melo makes less sense post-draft. (Unless Denver wants Wes Johnson and Al, in which case I’ll do backfilps.) ESPN’s DDL (can’t remember the commentator) suggested Butler as the main piece coming back from Dallas. None of these names make sense to me.

I think we need to target athletic bigs first and foremost – Favors (as everyone agrees), Nene, or (gulp) Randolph (not a big fan, but I guess it’s a fit).

SG would be next – I love the idea a CHer mentioned earlier of sending Jefferson, Sessions, and Brewer for OJ Mayo and Zach Randolph. Upgrades SG significantly and gives us a ton of cap space going forward. Jason Richardson might be worth a look also.

Unfortunately, David Lee’s agent sounds like he knows an Al deal is going down (presumably for cap space) and that we’re going to overpay for Lee. Good grief. We’d no longer have any room on our roster for an athletic big even if one became available… though we’d have the market on lumbering white bigs pretty well cornered.

by deus04 on Jul 3, 2010 10:23 AM CDT reply actions  

mayo cannot guard SGs (very well)

he’s not a solution at SG. He’s undersized and does not get to the FT throw line or attack the basket. He’s an excellent shooter and an adequate defender against players around his height, but he’s not the answer at SG.

by littleboxes on Jul 3, 2010 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

mayo reminds me of billups

His future is as a point guard who is bigger, stronger, and more athletic than any other pg. Mayo is more athletic than billups, so he has amazing potential as that type of player.

by Are we cursed? on Jul 4, 2010 9:54 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

could be

the guy is a pro and his highest upside is as a billups-esque point guard.

by littleboxes on Jul 5, 2010 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe MN gets involved in a 3-team deal

including Denver and NJ. Melo signs a max extension and goes to NJ, MN gets Favors, and Denver gets Jefferson and parts from MN and NJ, with MN probably taking back a little salary from Denver.

by Rumblebee on Jul 3, 2010 11:11 AM CDT reply actions  

Still possible Jefferson sticks around a while

They could dump Hollins on a team with cap space and a shortage of players. Then they use Jefferson, Love, and Darko as the primary front court, with Pek getting eased into the season. If Jefferson looks healthy, he could have serious value at the deadline in February.

by Rumblebee on Jul 3, 2010 11:13 AM CDT reply actions  

Hollins to Miami for future second rounder

by HeDidWhat? on Jul 3, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

THIS

Would be the best course of action IMO.

by WhiteManCantWrite on Jul 3, 2010 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

What's the appeal of Mayo?

I think he’s a talented kid, but he can’t guard opposing SGs and he’s not suited to play big minutes at PG.

Are we looking for another future 6th-man type or do folks feel he is a top-flight starter?

by foobee on Jul 3, 2010 11:18 AM CDT reply actions  

Good question, I'm confused too.

It’s like we want to go back for a redo, but it’s not worth doing.

by timmuggs on Jul 3, 2010 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Its obvious the best value is for Anthony Randolph

Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!

by StinkyFingers on Jul 3, 2010 11:27 AM CDT reply actions  

Was that necessary?

by Achilles Fang 1 on Jul 3, 2010 12:12 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

If he is THAT valuable..

then you would obviously want to keep him. Please stop with your Randolph posts.

by RBizzy on Jul 3, 2010 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

AR would be potentially a good fit here

But he is shocked and embarassed by the constant trolling on his behalf:

"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra

by Wile E Coyote on Jul 3, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Denver

With Billups probably in decline, there’s not a lot to be excited about long term in Denver. Lots of high seeded playoff appearances and mid-first round draft picks. Melo could be the guy that looks at the Wolves and decides that we have all the other pieces in place.

by Mike B. on Jul 3, 2010 11:51 AM CDT reply actions  

Milwaukee

Al for Michael Redd’s expiring contract, Ersan Ilyasova, and a #1 pick.

"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."

by ignign*kt on Jul 3, 2010 12:13 PM CDT reply actions  

I don't have any problem wih that, but...

do you think Milwaukee is really looking to upgrade Drew Gooden this soon? Al’s definitely better, but he’s over 2X the price. Though Gooden is a nice 25-30 mpg to back up both the 4-5 spots.

Can’t see it happening though – and, man, expiring contract or not, I really am not a fan of what Redd brings to the table these days…

by foobee on Jul 3, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

i'd expect Redd to be waived or bought out.

It is more important for the t-wolves to develop their young players.

I think Jefferson will give them a reliable inside scorer. I wouldn’t call Bogut dependable at the moment, because of the frequency of his injuries. I think Jefferson is a guy who’ll be able to carry them for stretches where Bogut is on the shelf.

They did draft two bigs, but I don’t think they’re very good prospects.

"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."

by ignign*kt on Jul 3, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm going to go with the Brooklyn Nets.

Once they miss out on everybody they will come a callin, the pf I think they have a real shot at is Boozer and I think he’ll go somewhere else maybe Orlando in a s&t. Al for Favors and cap space(I would hope Brew is included in this to give us more cap space plus they need another guard).

by Magoo12218 on Jul 3, 2010 1:43 PM CDT reply actions  

100%

Im completely behind this move… which means it has probably no shot, but AL + Brewer for Favors sounds sooooo nice.

by AmRadTheory on Jul 3, 2010 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think they need to a least get one big name at another position. If they don’t sign anyone then they may just go into rebuild mode.

by Achilles Fang 1 on Jul 3, 2010 5:04 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

If we do send Brewer away with Al...

And get cap space along with Favors, I would hope we would make a push for Josh Childress.

Flynn/Sessions
Childress/Ellington
Webster/Johnson
Love/Favors
Darko/Favors

Me Likey.

Check out Humdinger TV on YouTube.
http://twitter.com/HumdingerTV

by HumdingerTV on Jul 3, 2010 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

It’s impossible to predict. Part of me thinks Al’s game is about as trendy as the rat tail haircut right now and won’t draw much interest. Part of me thinks the theory that teams will start getting desperate might have some merit.

We’ll see, I guess. I wasn’t anticipating getting a wing for Al, but was hoping for something like Nene-for-Al. Not sure if they’d do that now that they’ve got the infamous Darko locked up.

by jianfu on Jul 3, 2010 2:55 PM CDT reply actions  

I don’t think any team that emphasizes offensive flow and efficiency are going to want Al. The ball goes into the post and then dies. He is not conducive to the styles of Phoenix, Denver, Golden State, Utah, or Portland. I think teams that lack any offensive identity such as New Jersey, Detroit, and (soon to be) Toronto are much more likely candidates.

by jstamp26 on Jul 3, 2010 3:44 PM CDT reply actions  

I could see Charlotte as a darkhorse destination. They’re the classic high (or low?)-seed team with no flexibility to improve. They’re the best defensive team in the NBA but they can’t score. Seems like a natural fit for Al. They also have a QO on guy the Wolves have been rumored to want in Tyrus Thomas.

I don’t know about cap specifics, but let’s say the Wolves offered to pay Tyrus Thomas $8-$10 per, and then agreed to take him along with Boris Diaw’s expiring deal ($9 million) for Al plus a little filler to get the Wolves’ outgoing salary into the $15 millio range. Would Charlotte do that? Maybe. The Wolves could then look for a scoring 2 with Pek or Love.

by jianfu on Jul 3, 2010 4:53 PM CDT reply actions  

If we do that… can we undo the Love/Mayo swap?

by AmRadTheory on Jul 3, 2010 5:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

mayo is not that good

has physical limitation issues, just like Love.

by littleboxes on Jul 3, 2010 6:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

I was thinking more along the lines of Pek for Morrow, or Rudy Fernandez, or Paul George. Something along those lines.

by jianfu on Jul 3, 2010 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Love would need to net someone better than Mayo, but it’s tough to figure possibilities there. Something like Love for James Harden? That’s probably close to fair, although you never see trades such as that.

by jianfu on Jul 3, 2010 11:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Options

It is clear to me we have three options…

1. Dump ASAP – This means for Dampier’s contract or giving him away to a team with cap space and no PF options left. Maybe we get a protected #1 pick out of the deal. We only do this if we want to sign Lee.

2. Slow Play Dump – This is where we take an expiring and a young player in return. Not exciting, but puts us in play for FA in 2011.

3. Big Deal – I think people are missing the real story behind the Wolves interest in Lee, it means they can move AL AND Love. An offer of Love, Brewer, and Flynn should get Granger and an offer of Love, Brewer, Johnson, and a future #1 (or the chance to switch picks for a couple years) should get Melo. The Wolves must be certain at this point they can give AL’s contract away to Dallas or to a team missing the big FAs. A starting line-up of Darko, Lee, Melo/Granger, Webster, Sessions/Flynn (waiting for Rubio) has a chance to be more than a bottom feeder.

My bet is on Granger…they drafted George, like Flynn, and this deal would put their rebuilding on a fast track. Wolves would like that deal as well as Granger is affordable and locked in. I also think Love, Brewer, and Flynn would be enough allowing the Wolves to keep Johnson.

by Grant Anderson on Jul 4, 2010 12:29 AM CDT reply actions  

Granger deal

Actually sounds reasonable. IMO the most interesting possible deal mentioned.

Although a C would still be a need…. Darko is not starter material, despite what Kahn seems to think.

by tkired on Jul 4, 2010 2:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

also, i dont think Melo will be dealt this cheap…. nor for any other package mentioned here… unless he says he will try to force Denver to trade him.

by tkired on Jul 4, 2010 2:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don’t think Melo goes that cheap either, but it would be the best we could offer. I also think Melo is more prime time…bad fit for MN…would not sign after this year. Granger makes the most sense for both teams. As for Darko…who knows? History says no way, but if he comes in healthy, in shape, and with his head on straight…I think there is a 25% chance he could be a viable starter…which is not much to bank on.

by Grant Anderson on Jul 4, 2010 9:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

Granger?

I’ve thought they wouldn’t trade him, but Love, Flynn, Brewer…maybe they would. They’d have to like George enough and figure they’re not going anywhere with Granger anyway.

Of course, if that deal would put Indiana’s rebuilding on the fast track, why didn’t those three do the same for us?

Interesting trade to look at in that it’s our three last first-rounders traded for a guy we could have had, way lower in the draft.

by Neumms on Jul 4, 2010 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

Regarding #2

No free agent wants to come here. Even if Rubio came over, it will take at minimum a year or two to create any sort of environment that will attract any worthwhile free agent.

by badpoet on Jul 5, 2010 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

A likely scenario?

Lee to MN, Ellis to NY, Jeff to GSW?

I would be cool with this looking at Lee’s last two years, basically 18 pts/11.7rebounds/high FG%. He also can move and played out of position at C in NY a good deal.

The Love = Lee has been debated. We get Lee to a 4-5 year deal and we can move Love for another piece. He only has 2 years remaining before his FA (restricted). He still has good value with a low contract.

How much for Lee? He made 7 million last year. Does 8-9/year get it done or is it 10 million? Do other teams top that when they strike out on Lebron? Even if 10 million, that adds 3 million from Al and leaves us about 7-8 million for maybe another player.

by ChicagoViking on Jul 4, 2010 10:46 AM CDT reply actions  

Possible, except Lee will get a worst $10M. More like $12M. Maybe more.

by Neumms on Jul 4, 2010 10:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

So, up to Al

If Rudy Gay gets 16, maybe Lee gets 13. Might have to overpay. But, that gives us a better player for our system and maybe Love flexibility. I still like this better than Dampier and cap room because what are you going to use the cap room on if not a player like Lee?

by ChicagoViking on Jul 4, 2010 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

I agree

Lee seems as good as we’ll get for Big Al. But what could be Love flexibility is also kind of a box. You can’t keep both Lee and Love at PF, but if you trade Love, we’re too thin there. It’s what Lord Smackington said above. That is, unless they can get Favors for Love.

At some point they need to stop collecting assets and finally get somebody great. We can hope they’ll do it this summer, but we’ve been burned before.

by Neumms on Jul 4, 2010 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Lee with Love VS. Al with Love

At the risk of sounding contrarian, I can actually see a lot of sense to this whole pursuit of David Lee, whether it’s a trade for cap space and we sign Lee outright; or an elaborate sign-and-trade.

Lee is neither hyper athletic, nor is he completely an above-the-rim player, nor is he an elite defensive player, nor is he the best running big man ever, nor is he a traditional center.

BUT,ALAS he’s better than Al Jefferson in all five of those areas – He’s more athletic, more above the rim, better defensively, better in the running/transition game and can masquerade as a center better than Al Jefferson. And, certainly not to be minimized is perhaps the biggest difference between Lee and Jefferson. David Lee is is an excellent passing big-man, whereas Al is a below average passer at best.

Because of those differences in big-man characteristics, David Lee is a much better fit with Kevin Love from a comparitive perspective to Al’s fit with Love.

So, in short, I guess I don’t think signing David Lee is necessarily a harbinger to trading Kevin Love.

by foobee on Jul 4, 2010 1:10 PM CDT reply actions  

Foobee with a strong post

And always good to go strong with the contrarian viewpoint, unless you’re me and 20 years ago called cell phones a “fad” and bet heavily on the return of the CB radio. Seemed so right at the time

Kahn Has a Top Secret Plan that even he doesn't know about

by Son of Gerald Green on Jul 4, 2010 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

+1

but mine was “why am I getting an email address at the U. Nobody is going to use this 5 years from now.”

by midlife crisis on Jul 4, 2010 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

How about Louis Amundson

Looks like Louis Amundson is pricing himself out of PHX… not sure what $$$ offers he’s getting, but if Minnesota goes the route of a back-up frontcourt type instead of David Lee, I think Amundson’s a great fit because:

1. He’s played big minutes off the bench at both PF and C.
2. He’s excellent in transition.
3. He’s a very good defender and post-agitator.
4. He’s one of the better offensive reboundrs in the NBA.

by foobee on Jul 4, 2010 1:12 PM CDT reply actions  

Not to mention that he is

another white player and fits in with our goal to have an all white team before Indiana or Utah.

"The world is full of idiots and I am the world" ... Sleepy Freud 12/08

by skeptic von urquell on Jul 4, 2010 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Plus, he's undersized.

old(er), and brings echoes of Mike Miller’s unfortunate hairdo.

However, to help fit the profile of the scrappy hustler, he does have the “flex pose” going that is usually seen only in photos of high school wrestlers:

by PoorDick on Jul 4, 2010 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

White-Rock Roster Rebuild Plan:

1. Trade Jonny Flynn for the recently-signed Steve Blake.
2. Trade Ramon Sessions for Goran Dragic.
3. Trade Al Jefferson and Corey Brewer to The Pacers for the expiring contracts of Mike Dunleavy and Troy Murphy.
4. Relegate recently-drafted Wes Johnson and Lazar Hayward to The D-League, until a trade for JJ Redick materializes.
5. Sign Bjelica immediately insert him into the starting SF role.
6. Bring “The One Who Got Away” Mark Madsen back from retirement.
7. Ship Wayne Ellington and Ryan Hollins to Utah, who finally find a place to dump Andrei Kirilenko’s contract.
8. And, yes, sign Louis Amundson.
9. Bring back Sasha Pavlovic and Brian Cardinal on minimum contract

Three-Deep Of:
Ricky Rubio, Steve Blake, Goran Dragic
Bjelica, Mike Dunleavy, Sasha Pavlovic
Andrei Kirilenko, Troy Murphy, Brian Cardinal
Kevin Love, Louis Amundson, Mark Madsen
Darko Milicic, Nicola Pekovic, Greg Steimsma

by foobee on Jul 4, 2010 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Enough with the white jokes guys

The idea that this would be done to appease fans is insulting to both the team and the fans.

From a factual standpoint, everyone seems to think Kahn should have kept Babbit but he traded him for Webster. So there goes that theory.

"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra

by Wile E Coyote on Jul 5, 2010 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

Sure it would be very insulting

If a team would do that kind of promotion. That’s why some may find it funny. Making fun of white suburban guys like myself. It’s very unlikely that the team would actually do that promotion. Therein lies the humor

When Henny Youngman said “take my wife please” I’m almost positive he wasn’t imploring random strangers in the crowd to take his wife away from him. I bet he was making a joke.

Kahn Has a Top Secret Plan that even he doesn't know about

by Son of Gerald Green on Jul 5, 2010 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

My problem with it

Isn’t that it’s offensive to me or anything. Far from it. I just think those jokes are tired and uncreative. I’m the same way when a white comic mimes ebonics or when a black comic does the “white guy voice.” I just don’t find it particularly funny after the millionth time hearing it, especially after it wasn’t that good in the first place. Believe me, I’m all for self-deprecation and not over-worrying about political correctness, but I just don’t find the “All White Guys” joke particularly funny or interesting.

by nja700 on Jul 5, 2010 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

What about

jokes that are just about Polacks?

by PoorDick on Jul 6, 2010 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

They're funny

Because they’re all true, right? I mean, look at all of those one-handed Polacks that are hanging in trees these days…

by nja700 on Jul 6, 2010 11:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oops

Bad bit of phrasing there with “hanging”, but I hope you get the point of the absurdity of the joke.

by nja700 on Jul 6, 2010 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

My first boyfriend was Polish.

It was third grade. He told me at length about how Polish men, when they wanted to, could be 100 feet tall. Also they could fly.

by Miss Test Pattern on Jul 8, 2010 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

but can't

change a lightbulb…takeout the trash, etc.

No one is getting Rubio's rights unless they pry them from our cold dead fingers.

by TheEvilProfessor on Jul 8, 2010 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

and

%

No one is getting Rubio's rights unless they pry them from our cold dead fingers.

by TheEvilProfessor on Jul 8, 2010 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

I actually really enjoy

Absurd and nonsensical imagined stereotypes, or ridiculously mis-attributed ones. They help show how stupid the more serious stereotypes are, in addition to being hilarious.

My half-Japanese friend and I had a running joke that the character Sun from LOST was going to leave the island by turning into a pterodactyl, because, well, duh! It’s a well-known fact that it’s just something Asian people can do!

by nja700 on Jul 8, 2010 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

What??

My brain hurts. Foo, how many beers have you had?

by Dave T on Jul 4, 2010 3:46 PM CDT via mobile reply actions  

Dave T -

What don’t you like about your new Minnesota Whiteys?

by foobee on Jul 4, 2010 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Since there's a lot of discussion about David Lee, I figure I'll add my two cents here

Lee is better for us than Jefferson. I think, when you put Lee in our system, he’s going to be equally productive (if not more) on better efficiency.

I realize Lee isn’t exactly a sexy pickup compared to say, Nene, Randolph or Derrick Favors, but all things considered, it’s solid value in return for him. Certainly better than what many people thought we’d get a month ago.

by Oceanary on Jul 4, 2010 5:13 PM CDT reply actions  

As for Lee and Love, I think there's a few things to note

They are very similar players, but Lee does offer a couple unique things. First, he’s more athletic….not tremendously, but he is. And second, he’s a much better finisher at the rim, so in terms of working pick and roll situations and getting points in transition, I think he has an advantage there.

But yes, they are very similar players in what they do and how they do it. And Lee isn’t any bigger, or any better of a defender (solid in man defense, terrible in help defense)

But if we do sign Lee, Love could be a very very valuable trading piece if we decide to go that route.

by Oceanary on Jul 4, 2010 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Speaking of Nene

What does he bring us again? I just checked his stats and they don’t seem too impressive: 14ppg 7rpg 1bpg. He does have a good FG% and a decent FT%. Maybe Denver just didn’t go to him much on offense, but I’m wondering about defense too.

by Facial on Jul 4, 2010 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Size, athleticism, and defense

He’s bigger than Al, standing 6’11" with over a 7’4" wingspan. He’s also much quicker vertically and laterally, and he’s better at both man and help defense

He does score less, but also scored much much more efficiently…one of the most efficient big men in the league…with us, he’d probably score between 16 and 18 points a game and shoot well over 50%.

by Oceanary on Jul 4, 2010 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lee doesn't make sense

From the posts above, Lee brings nothing special to the team except a higher contract than Love and the fact that he is 27. So by the time the rest of the core (assuming Rubio comes over) gets their games going, he will be in his 30s. He would also take minutes away from Love’s development.
Bad move to take Lee simply because they want to get rid of Al.

by hoopsfan1 on Jul 5, 2010 8:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Come on guys

I think we can do better than jokes (?) about ethnicity.

"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra

by Wile E Coyote on Jul 4, 2010 11:54 PM CDT reply actions  

If somehow

Houstons cannot get any big men in the FA, “Bosh?” then should they be interest in Al? We could send him packing for someone/someone and Jordan Hill?

by abcnerdd on Jul 5, 2010 11:10 PM CDT reply actions  

3way

Min gets D.Lee, NYK gets Tony Parker and SA gets Al.

by madtownsfinest67 on Jul 6, 2010 10:09 AM CDT reply actions  

I honestly think Melo will end up in

Denver, After watching Lebron, Bosh, and Amare split, Denver is gonna have to do something to keep Melo.

by TheGreat on Jul 10, 2010 2:33 AM CDT reply actions  

No good trade scenario there.

We can get pure cap space for Jefferson. No sense in trading him for expirings (Kenyon Martin) then. Assuming Melo’s untouchable, everyone else is some combination of old, bad, or overpaid.

by John Doe on Jul 10, 2010 3:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

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