Are All Minutes Created Equal?
Kevin Love and the Paul Millsap Doctrine
When I was in the 8th grade, it was a requirement for every kid to complete 'the gym class mile', which meant running around our track four times. Some kids were worried about being able to finish the mile. Not me. I was already the fastest sprinter in our class and I figured my speed would be just as valuable on a long run. The teacher yelled, "Go!" and I was off, running as fast as I could and easily going past the rest of my classmates.
It was about third-quarters around the first lap that it hit me. My legs didn't want to go anymore. Some of my classmates - the same ones who seemed to be going so slowly only a couple of minutes ago - were passing me by. Although I was one of the fastest 8th graders in the school in short bursts, I couldn't keep that speed up over a longer period of time.
The Paul Millsap Doctrine - a term coined by Tom Ziller - essentially attempts to show that in basketball, among players who are in far better shape than the average 8th grader, production levels tend to improve when given more regular minutes. Millsap, one of the standout performers of Ziller's study, was able to translate good performance in limited minutes into even better production as a starter for the Utah Jazz.
Last season on the Timberwolves, much to the bewilderment of fans and analysts alike, Kevin Love started only 22 games and averaged only 28.6 minutes per game. This season, Love has started every game and is playing an average of 36 minutes. His numbers have obviously increased as well and the increased playing time has certainly not harmed his ability to score or rebound the basketball.
So, does this prove the accuracy of the Paul Millsap Doctrine? Love and Millsap certainly have had their production levels improve with more regular minutes, but are these two examples of the rule or exceptions to the rule?
On BasketballProspectus.com, Kevin Pelton gives a brief recap of the theory and takes a deeper look at Paul Millsap's improvement. Pelton argues that, "there's a perfectly logical explanation for why [improved performance with more minutes] would be the case. Given more playing time, players have a chance to get warm and play through their mistakes instead of constantly watching the bench and waiting for their coach to pull them from the game."
Fair enough. But what about players who aren't in great basketball shape? What about guys who foul so often that they couldn't play extended minutes, since they would inevitably foul out? What about the fact that minutes against Kobe Bryant are much harder than minutes against Shannon Brown, for example? What about guys who simply get lucky or are on hot streaks during limited minutes, but don't get the opportunities or don't capitalize on those opportunities when they get more minutes?
There are certainly examples of those, too. Trevor Ariza, for example, received almost 12 more minutes per game after going from the Los Angeles Lakers to the Houston Rockets, but only improved his scoring by a little over a point per game; saw drops in rebounding, steals and shooting percentage; and forced more turnovers.
I wanted to know more information. After tracking down the original article, I was able to dive a little deeper into the Paul Millsap Doctrine and look at Ziller's study. Ziller, with the help of Pelton, compiled a list of players in 2006-2007 "who got stretches of starter-level playing time due to injuries to starting teammates". There were 17 players who fit that criteria. Both of the analysts made sure to note that the increased minutes for these players came from necessity - where starters had been injured or suspended - and not cases where players were given more minutes precisely because they were playing better.
The results:
Shooting percentage: On average, effective field goal percentage and True Shooting percentage both increased by .003. Eight players saw their shooting percentages improve with the extra minutes; nine saw declines.
Points per 40 minutes: +1.82 on average; 15 improved, 2 declined.
Rebounds per 40 minutes: -0.01 on average; 11 improved, 6 declined.
Assists per 40 minutes: +0.48 on average; 10 improved, 7 declined.
Steals + Blocks per 40 minutes: -0.11 on average; 4 improved, 13 declined.
Turnovers per 40 minutes: -0.10 on average; 9 improved, 8 declined. (Of course, improved means lower turnovers here.)
Fouls per 40 minutes: -0.92 on average; 13 improved, 4 declined.
And finally... PER: +2.38 on average, 15 improved, 2 declined.
I'll be honest, some of the numbers went against my original instincts. For one, foul rate not only went down, it went down quite substantially. Our own Nikola Pekovic is a shining example of this. Although Pekovic could hardly stay on the court during his first few games due to foul trouble, when Darko was hurt and Pekovic received more minutes as a result, his foul rate did not increase. Darko left the game against the New York on 12/6 with an injury and did not play in the next game against Oklahoma City. Pekovic played 25 minutes against the Thunder, and only had 4 fouls, despite racking up 2 fouls in 9 minutes in the previous game against the Knicks.
Scoring, assists and turnovers all improved in the study. Let's look at our own case of Sebastian Telfair to see if it held true for the Timberwolves. Luke Ridnour was injured against the Houston Rockets and Sebastian Telfair had to start the next five games. Telfair went from averaging 20.9 minutes per game as a backup to 37.2 minutes as a starter. His scoring went down from .432 points per minute to .311 points per minute. His assists, however, went up from .151 per minute to .172 per minutes.
The most surprising part of the study's results, however, involved rebounding rate. Rebounding actually went down ever so slightly on average and 6 of the 17 players saw their rebounding rates decline. Given that much (of course, not all) of Kevin Love's improvement - and Paul Millsap's improvement - has to do with rebounding numbers, this seemed to go against what the study originally attempted to prove: that production increases with more playing time.
Kevin Love's minutes have seen a 26% increase from last season. His rebounds per 36-minutes, however, have only increased by 11% from last season and his total rebound percentage has only increased by 9%. In other words, his increase in minutes has not had a corresponding increase in rebounding production. How about scoring? With that 26% increase in minutes, Love's scoring has increased by 17.5%; certainly more than his rebounding, but again, that increase does not correspond with his increase in minutes.
However, the study, and the Paul Millsap Doctrine, only states that production will improve. It does not state by how much. So far, from looking at the study's own data and even some of our own examples of the Wolves, the Doctrine holds up.
Of course, there are still questions to be asked and a couple of larger problems to address from this study. For one is the fact that teams are not only limited to one option to replace an injured or under-performing player.
Using our example of Telfair from above, if Telfair's production started dropping as a replacement starter for Ridnour, Kurt Rambis had the option of using Mo Ager/Wayne Ellington/Sundiata Gaines as a replacement. Coaches tend to let players play who are playing well - or are playing well enough - so its hard to tell if productivity increases with the numbers of minutes played, or if it works the other way around.
Silverbird at the site FreeDarko.com had similar concerns and tried testing for the relationship between Teammate and Opponent-PER with the number of minutes that a person plays. They concluded that:
"We find that yes, the longer a player stays on the floor, the higher the quality of both teammates and defenders. Thus, given the positive effect of minutes-played on match-up quality, and the negative effect of match-up quality on individual production, it seems plausible that – all things really being equal – an increase in minutes will lead to (slightly) decreased productivity, on average. And that this is especially true for above-average bench-players who get a large bump in mpg."
This, of course, leads to the counter that perhaps a player who is playing well with increased minutes will face better defense since the opposing coach will strategize to stop him.
If anything, it seems that players who get increased minutes, in general, will not see their production levels decline substantially as a result. Kevin Love is in shape enough to play 36 minutes a game. Nikola Pekovic has not fouled out of every game where he's received more than 20 minutes. And Sebastian Telfair improved his assists, while seeing a slight dip in scoring.
What I think the Paul Millsap Doctrine, and the discussion of its validity, really shows us is the complexity of the game of basketball and how hard it is to truly find any definitive statements. Unlike baseball, where stat analysis and sabermetrics are less messy due to the limited number of interactions, basketball is a free flowing game that is next-to-impossible to divide into the sum of its parts. I'll admit that stats can be valuable, but like this analysis shows, only when you can add context to them by looking at the individual scenarios.
Are all minutes created equal? Certainly not. The Paul Millsap Doctrine is helpful to show, however, that when bench players are performing well, there may be cause to want their minutes to increase, since its unlikely that their production will dip substantially. I'm glad I could look at the study and the numbers in depth to get a better understanding of this theory.
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Corey Brewer
last year versus his first couple of years and now this season seems to be another data point that supports the Doctrine. It’s not as pure of a data point because the context is one season versus another as opposed to stepping into a starting role within the same season due to injury or a trade. But it’s remarkable to see how badly his shot has fallen off after taking a nice step forward last year.
This bit demonstrates a, um, problem with following the numbers:
Kevin Love’s minutes have seen a 26% increase from last season. His rebounds per 36-minutes, however, have only increased by 11% from last season and his total rebound percentage has only increased by 9%. In other words, his increase in minutes has not had a corresponding increase in rebounding production.
- His minutes went up; and
- his rebounding rate – "per minute," see? – and his rebounding percentage – the share of available boards he gets – both went up.
How did he not have “a corresponding increase in rebounding production,” again?
Every real thought on every real subject knocks the wind out of somebody or other. – OWH
Noticed this as well
I think what he meant is that K-Love’s rebounding didn’t increase proportionally to his increase in minutes (In other words, his 26% increase in minutes didn’t lead to a 26% increase in rebounding.)
But if that is what he meant, he’s thinking too hard—expecting that sort of proportional increase in rebounding rate and percentage doesn’t make any sense.
In any event though, he most certainly did have a corresponding increase in rebounding production.
That was my impression, too, but it doesn't make sense for rates or percentages, as you say.
The way the text up there is stated basically implies that for every 10% increase in playing time, a player should get 10% better at a given skill.
WOW. Now THAT would be a much bigger “doctrine,” if that was true! Players who recorded 2 boards in 6 minutes a night – a very healthy 12 rebounds/36 rate – would have to improve to 8 boards (24/36 minutes) if they were given 12 minutes instead – a 100% increase, to match the increase in playing time.
(I genuinely like that you’re willing to post stuff like this, Tim, but there are some pretty basic gaps at times.)
Every real thought on every real subject knocks the wind out of somebody or other. – OWH
Well, I appreciate the feedback and
I certainly recognize I am no expert at some of this stuff. Pointing out those gaps is appreciated.
Everything in the computer need my face on it. Mega Gigabytes, son!
Well done
I’ll hit a few points though that I think you missed on:
- First off:
This, of course, leads to the counter that perhaps a player who is playing well with increased minutes will face better defense since the opposing coach will strategize to stop him.
Do you really think opposing coaches were more worried about Sebastian Telfair? Or do you think they thought, “Alright! Their starter is out and Telfair is worse!” While I know every position is addressed, I sincerely doubt a coach will give too much extra attention to someone who increases their averages by decimals per 40 minutes. - While it’s an interesting story, and I suffer from the same issues (well I used to be a good long distance runner and I’m built for it… but I stopped running as much after I quit soccer and turned into a pure sprinter), I don’t think your sprinting story has anything to do with these guys getting extra minutes. Maybe Madsen, but he’s the only guy that’s giving a 110% effort the entire time out there. Most guys know how to conserve their energy while still giving high output. And I realize you pointed out that they are in better condition, but they’re still going to get wasted after sprinting up and down the court for a handful of possessions.
- Probably a bad example to use Ariza. He was in a good situation and hidden by super/allstars. Then he went to Houston and was expected to be the first or second option. It’s just not remotely the same situation as going from a backup in somewhat limited minutes to being a starter with more mintues on the same team and with the same role.
- This paragraph was a little confusing, so maybe I didn’t understand completely:
The most surprising part of the study’s results, however, involved rebounding rate. Rebounding actually went down ever so slightly on average and 6 of the 17 players saw their rebounding rates decline. Given that much (of course, not all) of Kevin Love’s improvement – and Paul Millsap’s improvement – has to do with rebounding numbers, this seemed to go against what the study originally attempted to prove: that production increases with more playing time.
But I’d wager that there are a few explanations. The first being that there is a huge outlier in the downside of rebounding (11 guys improved, but the average declined? Doesn’t make much sense). The second, and a cause of the first, would be a change in role with the increase in minutes (maybe the difference between replacing a star or a fringe starter (i.e. did the star (Big Z) get injured? Or did a fringe starter (LeBron) get injured?)). A third explanation would be small sample size given the same weighting as someone with more minutes (could go on both sides though). Like I said, not really clear on what you were trying to say here, but I don’t think this is an indictment of the ‘doctrine.’
I also think Kevin Love has a somewhat unique circumstance. In that he went from being underplayed and underutilized, even as the best player on the team, to getting the minutes he deserves. He then got basically a new team (rebounding with Darko instead of Big Al, would be my biggest suggestion for rebounding improvement. Millsap would have been rebounding with Okur instead of Boozer, IIRC) and on top of that he started stealing rebounds from teammates to boost the numbers a bit.
I’d suggest that a few guys (Maybe it was only Millsap in the study) are guys who deserve more minutes and are just waiting for the oppoturtunity. Millsap’s role definitely changed, so I find it a little strange to name the study after him. Maybe it’s just me, but he seems to add a few variables to the study that should not be in there. In hindsight, it’s pretty clear that he deserved those minutes and just happened to be handed them because of an injury. But in reality, he was already more than capable of handling those extra minutes and an increased role.
Hopefully my thoughts are clear here. I didn’t do any editing and it’s a pretty long response.
In summary though:
I guess, overall, I’d still think that there is not much of a change when you increase their minutes. But I think some outliers like Millsap probably pushed upt he averages a bit (and then an outlier probably pushed down the rebounding numbers even more). I think if you really want to challenge the study, it’s probably going to be on the defensive side of the ball. Do they sacrifice defense in order to maintain their current level? The next area I would look at would be how much they settle into a new role just by virtue of not trying to earn it too hard. I think Bassy is a good example of this one. Early in the year, he would kill us on offense by forcing so many stupid shots. Then Ridnour got injured and he stopped taking [quite as many of] them. He was trying too hard to do things he wasn’t capable of doing. Then he settled down. Just too many variables to know for sure. But I still enjoy that they did the study and acknowledge that players don’t get worse, on average, with increased minutes.
Whenever I'm about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing.
I guess I wasn't necessarily trying to "challenge" the study.
Just look at areas that it might overlook and look to see what the doctrine might say about the best example of it on our team. I actually think the doctrine, for the most part, is correct.
1. I don’t think teams are game planning for Bassy. But I do think teams start to game plan for guys like Gary Neal, for instance, who has come in off of the bench and is now a major contributor with more minutes.
2. Right, I don’t think NBA players have conditioning problems. I was just pointing out my original logic behind one of the reasons I previously believed that some players – like Love – could get worse with more minutes. I know understand that I was definitely wrong in that assumption.
3. You make a good point about Ariza, but given that Ariza was made an option, shouldn’t his numbers have increased even more in Houston?
4. I don’t think its an indictment of the doctrine. I just thought it was an interesting point.
I appreciate your feedback. A lot of good stuff here. Your thoughts were definitely clear.
Everything in the computer need my face on it. Mega Gigabytes, son!
I also think it's correct
but I’d also suggest that it’s 100% correct. Just like all stats. The only errors are in how they are used and what they are used for. I’m not saying you think this, but it’s certainly not a way to predict that Gaines will start kicking ass if he becomes the starter. It is 100% accurate in saying, “In 200X the trend was XXXX and we expect that this may happen moving forward.”
Lots and lots of variables here though, many more than a regular statistic. Even more than PER. So while I think it’s a tremendous bit of work, I think it’s only slightly useful for predicting anything. And even then, not in many circumstances. When applying some context to it, like all stats, I think it’s pretty fun and useful.
And to Ariza: No. I don’t think his numbers should have inreased. I think people drastically overvalued him based on his production with LA. There are a few cases of guys who perform better when they are in LA. Most of them do so in reserve roles and should not be expected to maintain this as a starter. I’d suggest that this is a good example of a guy who coaches would game plan for and then it definitely would hinder his production. IIRC, he did a lot of what he did in LA from beyond the arc (probably pretty wide open in LA for the most part) and in transition. The few games I watched of them when he was there, I don’t remember him in iso situations or doing anything really close to creating his own offense.
Whenever I'm about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing.
I think ariza fits in a whole other category-
Players who look good as a 4th ot 5th option on elite teams and then get traded to a larger role on a worse team and become less productive (a mouthful). Other examples include bj armstrong and kurt rambis.
Beasley + Love = BeLoved.
by BeLoved842 on Jan 3, 2011 12:24 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
(Did Kurt Rambis look that good as a bit player on the Lakers?)
It’s before my time, but basically my impression is that he was a blue collar player and nothing more. He’d be on the level of a Stacey King, or someone like that – though King’s work ethic was nowhere near Rambis’s.
Every real thought on every real subject knocks the wind out of somebody or other. – OWH
Alvin Harper Syndrome
Oh right, this is basketball….oh, I got it: Dean Garrett.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 3, 2011 8:41 AM CST up reply actions
Love now has a saddle
If you’ve noticed the attention Love has gotten with increased minutes and production, you know that the opponents front line defense is on a mission to stop him. Last night Kris Humphries was fortunately not wearing spurs.
Breaking down cognitive dissonance and group think since gasoline was cheap.
Isn't it great that when defenses are keyed on Love, other players have it easier?
Ahem. The reverse argument has been made, and yet for some reason I feel this will be a controversial statement.
Every real thought on every real subject knocks the wind out of somebody or other. – OWH
Another one to watch for the Millsap Doctrine
is Marcin Gortat.
He’s gone from 4 and 4 in 16 mpg in Orlando to 8 and 6 in 27 mpg in Phoenix (only 4 games). With more familiarity should come even better production.
I think this is the first time in history one man managed to destroy an entire city by himself. Even the Enola Gay had a flight crew.
Good call. I think Gortat will thrive now that he's out of Dwight's shadow.
Everything in the computer need my face on it. Mega Gigabytes, son!
I think anyone would thrive
with Nash dishing dimes
Breaking down cognitive dissonance and group think since gasoline was cheap.
Millsap Doctrine
Shouldn’t have any effect on players switching teams/situations. Or rather the effect should be unpredictable. Ariza was used as an example, and Gortat has been mentioned in the comments, but while Ariza’s lower rates were predictable (going to a less appealing situation for a wing to play than the one he was in) and Gortat theoretically should play better (Steve friggin Nash), they are different situations, hence different predictions.
That being said, didn’t Kevin Love effectively change teams this summer? Obviously he stayed in Minnesota, but he’s been inserted into a starting lineup that started 0 of last season’s opening day starters. It’s kind of different than if he were to step into last year’s lineup for an injured player. He’s playing next to a center who is not necessarily a great rebounder and sells so hard on altering shots that he effectively takes himself out of rebounding position some plays. This compared to playing next to Al, who would sell so hard on rebounding that he would rarely alter shots. Obviously Love should grab more rebounds if he’s not competing as hard with his own teammates. The same can kind of be said about the increase in scoring rate, where he is expected to score more in the post than he did last year. So although the increases in numbers are very impressive, wasn’t it kind of predictable given the difference of the team from last year to this year?
All that said, very interesting post and concept.
Yep :)
I also think Kevin Love has a somewhat unique circumstance. In that he went from being underplayed and underutilized, even as the best player on the team, to getting the minutes he deserves. He then got basically a new team (rebounding with Darko instead of Big Al, would be my biggest suggestion for rebounding improvement. Millsap would have been rebounding with Okur instead of Boozer, IIRC) and on top of that he started stealing rebounds from teammates to boost the numbers a bit.
Whenever I'm about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing.
Is that an old foto of Kevin Kline's grandfather
…holding the basketball?
Jonny Flynn
It’s hard to watch how much Rambis dislikes him. I don’t understand how he can let a guy like Darko play through his terrible field goal percentages while Flynn barley gets off the bench. I would like to see him let him play and play through mistakes. I would hate to see him go if we decide to trade him. If we trade him, I think he will be pretty good in his next uniform.
The mystery is, why is the attitude toward Flynn so different this time around?
Based in this year alone, we could see this as Rambis being unwilling to play a defensive sinkhole. He’d give Darko space because Milicic is a defensive plus in his view, and Flynn would be off the court due to his defensive lapses.
But last year doesn’t line up with that idea very well. Flynn’s defense is just as awful as it was. Is it possible it’s even worse now? Did Rambis come to some tipping point on Jonny where he’s not even going to let him on the court until the kid decides to defend his man? I don’t see how, if that was the value system, Flynn got 81 starts last season.
Every real thought on every real subject knocks the wind out of somebody or other. – OWH
Well, Flynn is getting minutes this year, just not starting
but, you are right. I think, based on some quotes I vaguely remember, that they made a committment to start and play Flynn last year in the name of development, but even before they made the Sessions trade/Ridnour signing, they said that the point guard position would be an open competition this year. Flynn is not winning.
I say SHONDA you say WOLVES" SHONDA! WOLVES!
by Eric in Madison on Jan 3, 2011 7:49 AM CST up reply actions
That's very optimistic of you
Flynn is not winning.
On this team, it seems like it’s something to be lost rather than won. Flynn is losing.
Whenever I'm about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing.
Jerry Z made an interesting point in his chat last week...
Other than Rondo and Westbrook, how many good defenders start at PG in this league? He mentioned Paul as a guy who gets a lot of steals but doesn’t necessarily shut down his opponent.
by pagingstanleyroberts on Jan 3, 2011 4:00 PM CST up reply actions
Based on him being inactive on Saturday...
It’d be faulty to assume that his injury recovery isn’t factoring into his minutes. If this continues for the rest of the year, then it’s a story; now, it’s too small of a sample size.
by pagingstanleyroberts on Jan 3, 2011 3:54 PM CST up reply actions
Thanks for posting this.
I’d have to say that after reading the details, I’m less convinced than I thought I’d be. It’s too bad that the appendix appears to be lost to history, because the article doesn’t show any of the raw data.
They’re working with an awfully small sample (17 players) from only one NBA season. They don’t indicate that they calculated any formal tests of whether the differences they cite are statistically significant. Given the small samples and relatively small differences in means (before vs. after), I’m not at all sure that they would be. In the absence of that, what we have here is a fancy anecdote.
Their study is a good start on analyzing the issue, but words like “fact” have been thrown around about the Millsap Doctrine, and I’m not buying that yet. The sample is too small.
I agree about the sample
I think the only thing this study truly does is tell us that the commonly held belief that more minutes = less energy = less production is probably not as true as we believed it to be.
Whenever I'm about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing.
Yeah, it's an interesting finding
I just object to the way in which it’s been discussed as a settled matter. More work could be done on it.
Boy, slow day around here, huh?
It's always rough
the few days after Kim Kardashian leaves town…
;)
Whenever I'm about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing.

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