Dignity!
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 10, 2012 10:32 PM CST
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PrintSo act that you use humanity, whether in your own person or in the person of any other, always at the same time as an end, never merely as a means.
- Immanuel Kant's Formula of Universal Law
Everybody got to sleep in and we didn't even need a shoot around. I'll just ask Timmy and Manu to play hard for the first 5 minutes of the 2nd half and we should be good to go. Do I smell Cinnabon?
- Gregg Popovich's Formula of Winning at Target Center
Screw moral victories in individual contests. Let's get that out of the way. What really matters this season is that the Wolves are no longer a means to the end of getting out of town as quickly as possible. They are taken seriously. MVPs get irritated and feel the need to acknowledge their rookie counterparts. Opposing defenses turn two bigs to face Agape the Oregonian Rebounding God when shots go into the air. Rival scouts giggle with joy when Wes Johnson and Darko Milicic are still allowed to start. Visiting coaches actually have to make in-game adjustments instead of hitting the Kurt Rambis autopilot button.
The Wolves were beaten by the better team. Fine. What really matters is that they're close. They're close with Agape and the Spanish Unicorn and not much else. With just these two guys, they are no longer a means to an end. They are existentially defining who they are and that very act gives them dignity. It gives them purpose. It makes the Wolves an end unto themselves. It makes the inability of the front office to surround these two with a competent wing player all that much more infuriating.
As for the actual game, here's all you need to know: 47/30. That's Chicago's rebounding advantage. The Bulls shot 53.1% from the field and outrebounded the Wolves by a wide margin. Thanks for playing. That's really it. There's nothing else.
The rebounding poster play of the night came from Anthony Randolph (Randolph the Grey--NONE SHALL PASS!!!...h/t to Dave from Chisholm...buy his CD from the link on the left sidebar). When Derrick Rose daggered the Wolves with a late contested 3, he was only able to do so after Randolph the Grey failed to block out Omar Asik, who collected the oreb and tossed it out to Rose for the trey. That's the game in a nutshell. The Wolves gave the Bulls extra possessions on a night where they were shooting well. As I have said over and over and over and over: this isn't rocket science. Make easy defensive rebounds. Problems solved. Again, not rocket science.
Random thoughts:
- Wes Johnson should never see the court again. Unless that court is involved in an ISU rec league.
- Darko should only see the court when the....well, he can play with the ISU rec league too.
- Forget all the talk about Rose being the best point guard. He's not the best point guard. What he is is one of the best 10 players in the league and a fantastic athlete. Everything else is gravy.
- Derrick Rose is great but let's not forget he is also surrounded by some pretty damn good players. The Bulls only have 2 players on their roster with a wp/48 below .100. That's insane. Super deep, super good.
- The Wolves only had 11 turnovers.
- Rubio had 12 assists and 13 points. We're looking at at least 37 of the team's 100 points. Adding in the 3s, he accounted for 42% of the Wolves' scoring. Derrick Rose assisted for 25 points with his 31 points. His 56 points accounted for just over half of the Bulls' scoring. He played 6 more minutes than Ricky. As dagger as Rose was, Ricky was pretty damn close in terms of overall production. He even added rebounds and steals.
- The less we say about this D-Thrill game, the better.
- Anthony Tolliver and Randolph the Grey should handle all the team's non-Love 5 minutes from here on out. This shouldn't be up for discussion as Darko is terrible.
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My favorite part
is you can tell Adelman is getting sick of Wes and Darko with 9 and 8 minutes respectively. Wolves played well for being on the tail end of a Back-Back-Back with travel.
Also, Randolph is looking serviceable and seems to be getting a bit more active on defense. Still some confusion on the defensive end against a team that has many players with a quick release.
The best part of the game
came when the normal starting 5 were not all out on the court together to start the second half. First time this season, I think. Signs of change? Me hopes.
by unidos_corremos on Jan 10, 2012 10:45 PM CST up reply actions
first time ever
in the history of basketball.
it was great and definitely signals a change for the next game.
Darko should be traded to CSKA Moscow for Nenad Krstic
I’m sure we could work out a deal. Throw in Wes and whomever.
And a few nuclear wessels?
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
I hope...
this is a play on Wes Johnsons name. Cause it would be funny. Can we call him the Nuclear Wessel?
by bringbackbrewer on Jan 11, 2012 11:53 AM CST up reply actions
Brad Miller / Martell Webster
when are these guys supposed to be activated? They’ve gotta be an upgrade over Darko and Wes.
They're not.
You guys will have as much fun with Miller as we are having with Flynn.
Minnesotan Rockets fan
by Barragan on Jan 10, 2012 10:51 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
How would you rate him on a scale of bad to disappointing
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 10, 2012 10:58 PM CST up reply actions
Flynn I mean
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 10, 2012 10:58 PM CST up reply actions
It sounds like you are saying Flynn is the bottom rating
So Flynn would rate as a ‘Flynn.’
by TO12 on Jan 10, 2012 11:01 PM CST up reply actions 6 recs
This comment deserves green
And…there you go!
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Jan 11, 2012 8:58 AM CST up reply actions
There were a lot of Rockets fans who wanted him cut instead of JEREMY LIN in the preseason, and if it wasn’t for the fact that Flynn had a guaranteed contract, I think he would have been cut.
He basically doesn’t play, anyways, because Lowry is beasting and Dragic is a very capable backup. But he reminds me of Aaron Brooks. From last year, when Brooks had a sprained ankle and was fuming that Lowry took his starting spot. And Flynn’s worse than that.
But Miller does, sincerely suck. I mean….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oU8jICYLUgo
Minnesotan Rockets fan
Webster yes, though.
He’ll make a difference. Him plus a traded-for wing will hopefully be the starting 2 and 3 for the second half of the season. And man, what a difference that’d make.
Sorry SnP
But it looks like you said “Screw moral victories….But it was a moral victory!”
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
I'm a little sleepy...
….but I was trying to find some sort of link between an existential identity and….well, this wasn’t a moral victory but it was a step forward. They aren’t…well, you caught me. I knew that juxtaposition existed and I didn’t do anything about it.
It wasn't a moral victory
But a very, very good team had to play well to beat us. We didn’t beat ourselves like we tended to last year. This Bulls team is just… really good. And they shot incredibly well on contested looks all night.
GIve us a real SG and we’re a scary team. I think we can handle the center minutes for now with a little bit of Darko and a whole lotta Love.
Also
I was sitting in one of Rick Adelman’s seats. Not that I’m bragging or anything.
I’ve never sat that close at an NBA game. It’s a different experience.
Hear any coach or player banter that was interesting?
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 11, 2012 3:52 AM CST up reply actions
8th row, so not quite close enough for that
I could hear clearly whenever anyone shouted anything on the court, but nothing really beside that.
Pekovic and Darko were messing with Beasley when he came out to the bench. Pek seems like a funny dude. Martell’s a snazzy dresser and seemed really engaged the whole game. He obviously really likes basketball. I’ll be bummed if his back issues end up sinking his career.
We have a game wrap that led with Immanual Kant.
You wanted more? Expectations are so high.
"Opinion ...a confession."
Are high expectations now part of the site's facticity?
If so, we would be foolish and inauthentic to ignore them. While our existence in a state of despair, should we blow off our facticity, we would actually despair. Turtlenecks and absurdity for everyone!
But according to the categorical imperative,
it is wrong to piss and moan unless it would be just for every man (and woman) to piss and moan. Since it is empirically demonstrated that it is f***ing irritating for any man (or woman) to piss and moan, it is deemed objectively WRONG for anyone to piss and moan.
QED
"Of what use is a philosopher who does not hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes of Sinope
by Cynical Jason on Jan 12, 2012 2:17 AM CST up reply actions
I reject your premise....
….as Reason will tell you that altruism is for the weak and naked self interest of the wealthiest among us is what puts the world on its shoulders. If pissing and moaning is what Jamie Dimon wants to do, Jamie Dimon will piss and moan. Now fetch me some pills and pop in the Charlie’ Angels DVD.
Attack of the fifty-foot mustache!
"Of what use is a philosopher who does not hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes of Sinope
by Cynical Jason on Jan 12, 2012 10:40 AM CST up reply actions
Can we behave according to the categorical imperative with respect to the talent on an NBA roster?
Is each player an end unto himself? Or don’t we necessarily regard them as means toward team success?
I would suggest that Kahn is a decent human being, and actually tries to enhance both the well-being of individual players and the fortunes of the team with trades. We know the history of minor changes under him – it’s pretty extensive for someone with his tenure on the job – and even with guys like Bobby Brown, he’s always sending people into situations they might choose for themselves.
On the other hand, he’s got a law degree. So.
"Opinion ...a confession."
That would be an interesting approach
to the lockout. During that situation everyone treated everyone else as means (the owners hitting that mark first). Owners using players as means to make money, players using owners as . . . means to make money. Players willing to throw other players under the bus in order to make money.
I need to stop thinking about it.
"Of what use is a philosopher who does not hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes of Sinope
by Cynical Jason on Jan 12, 2012 10:43 AM CST up reply actions
We as fans are means to their ends. That much is terribly clear.
And yet somehow I still have these tattered shreds of self respect as a last defense against the long, long winter.
"Opinion ...a confession."
And Agape didn't even have that good of a game.
Also, Agape. Love it.
And since the thread title is Dignity: Dignity.
…seriously, Dylan’s outtakes are better than other’s greatest hits….
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 10:42 PM CST reply actions
Well he had 20-14.
So, yeah, I’d say didn’t have that good of a game is a pretty accurate description.
I know it's a weird statement, but...yeah, he didn't have that good of a game.
A good game for Love now is 28/14. This was an average game. He’s set that bar.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:00 PM CST up reply actions
We need to stop looking at the box score for Love
For better or for worse, he doesn’t make his impact with that.
And of course I mean, his boards are boards and his points still count, but it makes a huge difference if he get his stats during plays that affect the game, or if he does them without putting a mark on the outcome.
by TO12 on Jan 10, 2012 11:03 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
/hyperbole?
Maybe… and maybe it’s a good thing, but he can post a 20/14 without feeling like he did much.
He still scored 20 points and created 14 extra possessions
He positively affected the game in many ways. The criticism lies in his 5-18 shooting from the field. There was good and bad.
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
I guess if those 14 boards went to the other team...
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 10, 2012 11:14 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
My thoughts exactly
It isn’t like he got 14 steals, haha
It's worth the same
as if an opposing player gets the rebound and he steals it right back. Every rebound starts a new possession or keeps an existing one alive. It’s pretty simple: the more possessions a team has, the more opportunities they have to score. How are TOs that functionally different than rebounds? They both involve a scoring opportunity being created or lost.
Now, how efficiently the team/player scores during said possessions is another story. Love didn’t do too well in that respect.
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
Because there isn't a 1:1 correlation of Love rebounds to new possesions
He got 5 offensive, and 9 defensive rebounds. It is safe to assume that most defensive boards would have been sucked up by his replacement, or another teamate, and likely at least an offensive board or two as well.
We can be optimistic and say he created maybe ~5-6 extra possesions, but it is likely less than that.
When comparing TO’s (or steals) to rebounds, you forget to add a scale factor that allows for the fact the even if Love didn’t get a board, it is likely his replacment or a teamate would have grabbed them, while a steal is a more unique even that is created by that particular player.
Love creates more possesions with his rebounds, no doubt, but you can’t acurately attribute all his rebounds as creating extra possesions.
BOTTOM LINE IS
Love has played 2 straight below average games (for his standards). But he will bounce back, there’s no doubt about it, he’s proven people wrong countless times.
Joe Mauer grounded into double play, second to shortstop to first, ________ out at second
That's actually not the bottom line
I have no worries about Love. Just saying that counting rebounds the same way you count a TO/steal isn’t correct.
I agree with that
Joe Mauer grounded into double play, second to shortstop to first, ________ out at second
I understand that and considered the differences before I posted
I’m just saying that both rebounds and TOs result in the team either keeping possession or changing possession. On a purely “who is in possession of the ball” level, they mean exactly the same thing. The odds (and thereby the values) of each occurrence are different, but the fact of ball possession does not change.
So what I long-windedly and inarticulately have meant to say – rates and scale notwithstanding – is Kevin Love’s rebounds led to his team being in possession of the ball 14 times. It’s another matter to judge how relatively valuable the rebounds/turnovers are, but that wasn’t my point.
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
By playing point guard for 36 minutes
Rubio had the ball for probably 70+ possesions. Good thing he didn’t turn it over every single time.
I've been unnecessarily pedantic in trying to represent my very thin original point
You’re clearly correct in what you’re saying, and I don’t disagree with you. I understand that it’s much more complicated than I originally put it, but I just want to get across that I’ve been arguing semantics more than the value of what you’re saying. I think we’re more in agreement than has come across here; I’ve just been communicating poorly.
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
Plus, on the Wolves
a rebound by Love is not likely to be grabbed by a teammate, while a TO by any TWolf is likely just a bad pass that would have been dribbled out of bounds or converted into a charge by whoever caught it anyway. Thus each is similarly related to the number of possessions saved/lost.
"Correct" is, I am sure you will agree on reflection, a silly word here.
But I won’t ask you to review the “weight” placed on rebounding by number grinders. (They prize them, highly.)
Just take a look with the ol’ eye check. Think back on the handful of absolutely crucial possessions last night that got “re-set” by a Bulls offensive board. Remember the Derrick Rose three that iced it? That came after they got an offensive board.
Boards matter in a big, big way. Two years ago when Rambis wasn’t having Love in down the stretch, the Wolves were getting absolutely killed by late offensive rebounds. Love’s boards matter, a lot. And he does come up with then at crucial moments in a game, as often as any player I’ve seen. That “counts.”
"Opinion ...a confession."
Versus Milwaukee
there was a stretch, I think in the 2nd Quarter (recall how that game really got away from the Wolves in the middle parts of the game) where Love went to the bench and Ilyasova and others crashed the boards for a string of buckets. Part of that was a weird doubling strategy (Rubio didn’t need so much help on Livingston) but certainly Love’s absence was important.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
Ends of games two years ago: Ugh.
We won the opener on an offensive rebound and a putback by Damien Wilkins. Rambis started keeping Love out of the ends of games…. And whaddaya know, other teams would get three chances at a basket all the time late in games.
We hear all the freaking time about having “a closer” late, to finish games. Watch a lot of the NBA, and those late offensive rebounds are pivotal to a huge number of outcomes.
"Opinion ...a confession."
Yes, they are...
I would say, though, that a shot-creator (in my opinion) helps lead to offensive rebounds. Hell, even Darko’s jump hook leads to Love putbacks. But guys like Luke, Wes, AT, and even Love (when he’s the guy with the ball) struggle to shift the defense and open up the rebounding avenues. I thought this was on display against Toronto when the individual defense was just smothering attempts at shots, and the other four defenders could key on rebounding.
This isn’t disagreeing anything about Love or his late-game importance as a rebounder; just that I think his rebounding opportunities increase when the defense is a bit more scattered.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
(You truly think Love gets boards off Darko's misses?)
He have to be standing between Darko and the hoop, waiting for the ball to fall short.
"Opinion ...a confession."
"It is safe to assume that most defensive boards would have been sucked up by his replacement, or another teamate, and likely at least an offensive board or two as well"
Wow.
You must have missed the games Love was out last year.
The ignorance is amazing...
The theory of ‘stolen rebounds’ persists. Or this person could just watch 5 minutes of game when love is on the bench.
My goodness
Ingnorance my ass. Please read that I wrote, then comment.
Love’s dreb% from last night:
32.7
No one else was above 20. The Bulls had 4 guys over 20.
The 2nd best rebounder (relative to his position) on the Wolves is probably Ricky Rubio.
Guys
I don’t know what you are reading or how you decided to interpet it…
But I know Love’s rebounds are beneficial, I even go to state that he probably created 5-6 extra possesions with them. But counting every board as a possesion that would have otherwise been lost is very incorrect.
The point of all this was:
That a rebound is not equal to a ‘created’ possesion that same way that a steal or TO is equal to one, but a rebound has a much greater chance of being produced by the same teamwhether or not a specific player gets it.
Look, I’m not trying to comment on Love’s rebounding prowess, I feel I go to the necessary lengths to make that clear. Just saying 14 boards doesn’t equal 14 created possesions.
5, 6 maybe even more, but not 14 possesions the way a TO or a steal would.
But I feel that was all already stated clearly.
I don't know how you'd like to define a "possession."
You’re having a debate with yourself about that.
"Opinion ...a confession."
I means that if he doesn't get the board the other team will get the ball
That was the start of the convo. You’re coming in a little late…
Reviewing that thread
your point makes perfect sense. The editorializing you added, quoted by rickyp, is what invited the backlash.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
True, I guess we are just too far from the origin
But that is all open to guess work, really. I was just trying to make a point clear with an example.
Glad you see what I’m saying though, I might not be going crazy after all
Having read your entire line of thinking before I posted,
I do think you’re having a debate with yourself about the meaning of a “possession.”
You dismissed the idea of boards “counting” like a steal or turnover. There are all sorts of hazy qualifiers one can offer to any of those three categories. Ricky turned one over yesterday when Derrick Williams went toward the basket instead of stepping back for a pick-and-pop. Some turnovers “count” less, I imagine. “If Love hadn’t gotten that free throw rebound, somebody else would have.” Uh, okay, have a hypothetical debate with yourself. Love’s the guy with the ball in his hands.
If you want to measure anything usefully, you need to commit to a clear definition of what you’re measuring. Imagine any data collection you want, Synergy or whatever, and you still won’t be able to identify the stuff that would have happened if Love hadn’t grabbed a board.
What you want to do is make an argument that sounds plausible. Different goal.
"Opinion ...a confession."
Jeez dude...
Everything after my original comment was meant to clarify the original point. Maybe I didn’t do that well, but I didn’t ‘debate with myself.’ The reason I kept posting is because someone kept debating with me…
Put your fake proffesor cap on if you want, but this is a really simple point that you are putting un-do weight on.
Getting a little snippy.
Well I’ll be
I’ll make sure to send my comments through a CH-sanctioned editor before hand.
My goodness
Ingnorance my ass. Please read that I wrote, then comment.
That was the start of the convo. You’re coming in a little late…
(Shrug.) Why do you suppose several posters randomly decided to pile on here? Maybe because it was a really questionable argument, based (if you read the above) on the special, “unique” nature of steals as opposed to other basketball events, and on some really shaky “If he hadn’t done it someone else would have” assumptions.
"Opinion ...a confession."
FWIW, I agree with you TO12 (I think).
If your point is steals have greater value than rebounds, I agree. There can be exceptions to this (Allen Iverson comes to mind).
I think you get into trouble on this one as a matter of perspective
5 or 6 extra possessions per 14 is an enormous amount (42.8% for 6). I have no idea what the real answer is here, but even your fall back position of 5 or 6 places such added value to Love’s rebounding that it further heightens the absurdity of pointing out an obvious fact (the team would continue to collect defensive rebounds at a certain rate in his absence).
Let’s say that for every 14 defensive rebounds, Love is good enough to collect 3 above and beyond the non-Love rate. That’s 21.4% value added with a single player. That’s an enormous impact over time and 100 possessions. Saying that there isn’t a 1:1 trade off is just an affirmation of something that everybody knows and nobody is really talking about/arguing. It becomes especially grating when “likely” and “safe” and “most” are added to the mix.
Maybe if I was trying to argue something about the ability to replace Love's rebounds
It started as a simple correction to someone who said:
He still scored 20 points and created 14 extra possessions
He didn’t really create 14 extra possessions, the way I see it.
By the time we got all the way down here, it is not obivously way out of context, but the original point is no less valid.
No one is taking issue with your original point
It’s the editorializing and the juxtaposition of your original point and the innumeracy of your weighted guestimation. If a player is 20-40% better than his replacement at (insert task here), that’s the headline. When men bite dogs, people pay attention to that.
Well I'll be
I’ll make sure to send my comments through a CH-sanctioned editor before hand.
Basketball game, played by people.
(I left out ‘is’ and any details to avoid possible juxtaposition. Apologies in advance if ‘played by’ leaves any room for speculation.)
And you missed mine
I’m not talking about grammar.
Uh-huh
And 90% of the income earners have a chance to be in the top 1%. Being in the right ballpark matters and when you are not, people notice.
The "innumeracy" is well-put here.
This reminds me just a little of one of Chuck D’s “Love has to collect 90% of the boards out there” moments from last year.
"Opinion ...a confession."
What you are saying in this comment
Is that Love’s contribution is very valuable. And you are right, which is why I never said it was not, in any sort of way.
And of course everyone knows there isn’t a 1:1 trade off, that is why I made what started as a simple correction…
Very good point, you can't just look at the box score.
But….I did watch the game. So, are you disagreeing this wasn’t a ‘good game’ from Love?
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:04 PM CST up reply actions
Oh no
I wasn’t even really responding to you, just jiving off your comments. We always qualify our comments for Love with ‘he had a …. but it wasn’t a good game,’ and I agree. If he doesn’t affect the game at a higher level, it isn’t a good game for him.
Did you...
… happen to see the second quarter?
by TheH on Jan 10, 2012 11:05 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
No i know, I was agreeing with you and disagreeing with Sci Fi.
In that from an eye test perspective, he was off and didn’t dominate.
But any time someone scores 20 points and gets 14 rebounds, saying “he didn’t play that well” is an understatement… That doesn’t work.
Since we tussled about Dylan a while back...
….I’ve re listened to his entire catalog. He’s still a glorious weirdo and a song and dance man, but the more I listen to his early 90s and 00s work, the more respect I have. He’s almost at Leonard Cohen and Tom Waits levels in my book at this point. ;)
".....almost at Cohen and Waits levels....."
I know when I’m getting trolled, don’t sweat it.
Street Legal, man. Street Legal. Some forgotten, BS, late 70s album that no one reveres…I’d toss that up against anything Waits or (Cohen? Really? Ok.) Cohen has done. Give that a shot.
Then remember he began with Freewheelin, Times They Are-a Changin’, Highway 61, Blonde on Blonde…..in addition to Blood on the Tracks….in addition to his late 90s renaissance. In addition to other albums strung about 3 decades like John Wesley Harding or Desire or Another Side.
Dylan’s untouchable.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 10:50 PM CST up reply actions
I still go with Cohen and Waits
I get why certain art pieces might be more valuable, but Let Us Now Praise Famous Men talked about real people….that’s my attraction. He’s great, but he’s not my cup of tea.
I've been trying to get into Waits lately
I have Bone Machine. All I can say about it is that it is weird as hell, and this is coming from someone who listens to a lot of Radiohead
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 10, 2012 11:01 PM CST up reply actions
Waits is America's greatest song writing treasure
He is the true product of modern American life. Bone Machine is ok. Mule Variations is always the album I recommend.
Well now you're just blatantly trolling.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:04 PM CST up reply actions
Bone Machine is a bad place to get into Waits.
Go with the trilogy: Rain Dogs, Swordfishtrombones, and Frank’s Wild Years.
I love Dylan, but I’ll take Rain Dogs over any of Dylan’s stuff. Like SnP said, Dylan’s insights are general and remote. Waits is specific and tactile. He’s like a papercut on the tongue.
"Of what use is a philosopher who does not hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes of Sinope
by Cynical Jason on Jan 12, 2012 2:26 AM CST up reply actions
Waits also has great presence
It’s an odd movie, but he does well in Gilliam’s The Imaginarium of Dr. Parnassus.
Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!
....I have no idea what you're saying there....
Dylan didn’t think songs like Blind Willie McTell and Up to Me and Abandoned Love and I’ll Keep it With Mine were worthy of his albums.
Only the Beatles and the Stones can go head to head with his catalog.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:03 PM CST up reply actions
Dylan writes theoretical human emotional physics
Amazing stuff. Truly amazing and tingling. Waits and Cohen write about knife fights. Specific ones.
Well this seems like it's just a matter of taste now, and I will not have that!
Did you at least click that link? He spit that out in the early 90s.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:11 PM CST up reply actions
I did
I love Dylan. I think his late career 3 album swing is the greatest late-career swing in pop music history. Love and Theft came out on 9/11 and pretty much predicted the mood and content. He’s a genius. That being said, he’s not my bag. I could listen to Waits and Cohen all day long and never be tired. They write about people and things I know. I think Waits gets Weird America more right than Bob and I think Cohen hits the human condition a little more squarely between the eyes.
(squints eyes)
Couldn’t find the album version:
Yeah, he doesn’t know Weird America
I think I’ll call it America I said as we hit land. I SAID COULD YOU PLEASE MAKE THAT CREPE!
From 65.
Neil Young’s late career albums are pretty good as well; just saying that so you know I’m not actually pissed here even though I think it might seem like I am….because I probably am.
Dylan’s untouchable.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:20 PM CST up reply actions
i love neil toung, too
even though he is canadian. i just think weird america is at bit more home in modesto than on the range. bad as me is badder in weird circles than the trubedor. give him the nobel, im attracted to coffee and cigs. tastes and colors, and whatnot.
You're a lunatic. I just can't talk to lunatics like you. LUNACY I SAY!
In other news, ’Let’s Do It’ by Cole Porter is the greatest American song ever.
That or ‘My Land is Your Land.’
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 12:18 AM CST up reply actions
We lunatics gather down there by the train
No eye for an eye, no tooth for a tooth. Judas Iscariot is carrying John Wilkes Booth (the best Booth since Calvin, btw).
My Land is Your Land should be the National Anthem. Dead Serious.
(I’m drunk)
((and sorta smart))
(((just dropped my cig on the floor)))
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 12:32 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree
(not drunk)
(it’s a better song)
((hooray socialists))
(((woodie is better than tom or bob)))
This land is your land, this land is my land
From California to the New York Island
From the Redwood Forest to the Gulf Stream waters
This land was made for you and me.
As I went walking that ribbon of highway
I saw above me that endless skyway
I saw below me that golden valley
This land was made for you and me.
I roamed and I rambled and I followed my footsteps
To the sparkling sands of her diamond deserts
While all around me a voice was sounding
This land was made for you and me.
When the sun came shining, and I was strolling
And the wheat fields waving and the dust clouds rolling
A voice was chanting, As the fog was lifting,
This land was made for you and me.
This land is your land, this land is my land
From California to the New York Island
From the Redwood Forest to the Gulf Stream waters
This land was made for you and me.
This is not the Goldman Sachs version.
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 11, 2012 12:35 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
The lyrics they don't want us to remember
There was a big high wall there that tried to stop me;
Sign was painted, it said private property;
But on the back side it didn’t say nothing;
This land was made for you and me.
As I went walking I saw a sign there
And on the sign it said “No Trespassing.”
But on the other side it didn’t say nothing,
That side was made for you and me.
Nobody living can ever stop me,
As I go walking that freedom highway;
Nobody living can ever make me turn back
This land was made for you and me.
In the squares of the city, In the shadow of a steeple;
By the relief office, I’d seen my people.
As they stood there hungry, I stood there asking,
Is this land made for you and me?
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 12:38 AM CST up reply actions
I think Bob had it right when he decided that Walt Whitman was the man to copy
Oh, where have you been, my blue-eyed son?
Oh, where have you been, my darling young one?
I’ve stumbled on the side of twelve misty mountains,
I’ve walked and I’ve crawled on six crooked highways,
I’ve stepped in the middle of seven sad forests,
I’ve been out in front of a dozen dead oceans,
I’ve been ten thousand miles in the mouth of a graveyard,
And it’s a hard, and it’s a hard, it’s a hard, and it’s a hard,
And it’s a hard rain’s a-gonna fall. Oh, what did you see, my darling young one?
I saw a newborn baby with wild wolves all around it
I saw a highway of diamonds with nobody on it,
I saw a black branch with blood that kept drippin’,
I saw a room full of men with their hammers a-bleedin’,
I saw a white ladder all covered with water,
I saw ten thousand talkers whose tongues were all broken,
I saw guns and sharp swords in the hands of young children,
And it’s a hard, and it’s a hard, it’s a hard, it’s a hard,
And it’s a hard rain’s a-gonna fall.
And what did you hear, my blue-eyed son?
And what did you hear, my darling young one?
I heard the sound of a thunder, it roared out a warnin’,
Heard the roar of a wave that could drown the whole world,
Heard one hundred drummers whose hands were a-blazin’,
Heard ten thousand whisperin’ and nobody listenin’,
Heard one person starve, I heard many people laughin’,
Heard the song of a poet who died in the gutter,
Heard the sound of a clown who cried in the alley,
And it’s a hard, and it’s a hard, it’s a hard, it’s a hard,
And it’s a hard rain’s a-gonna fall.
That’s pure Whitman, and he gets my props for channeling that.
He was actually jacking some British song with that.
Dylan took Picasso’s phrase to heart: Good artists borrow, Great artists steal.
Doesn’t take away from nothing though.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 1:10 AM CST up reply actions
Yes, the Lord Randall origin is undeniable
but there is so much in the lyric that is pure Whitman. The listing, the chronicling of scenes from a journey. As with, for example, song of the broad axe:
I see the clear sunsets of the martyrs,
I see from the scaffolds the descending ghosts,
Ghosts of dead lords, uncrown’d ladies, impeach’d ministers, rejected kings,
Rivals, traitors, poisoners, disgraced chieftains and the rest.
I see those who in any land have died for the good cause,
The seed is spare, nevertheless the crop shall never run out,
(Mind you O foreign kings, O priests, the crop shall never run out.)
I see the blood wash’d entirely away from the axe,
Both blade and helve are clean,
They spirt no more the blood of European nobles, they clasp no more the necks of queens.
I see the headsman withdraw and become useless,
I see the scaffold untrodden and mouldy, I see no longer any axe upon it,
I see the mighty and friendly emblem of the power of my own race,
the newest, largest race.
See also song of myself:
The suicide sprawls on the bloody floor of the bedroom,
I witness the corpse with its dabbled hair, I note where the pistol has fallen.
The blab of the pave, tires of carts, sluff of boot soles, talk of the promenaders,
The heavy omnibus, the driver with his interrogating thumb, the clank of the shod horses on the granite floor,
The snow sleighs, clinking, shouted jokes, pelts of snowballs,
The hurrahs for popular favorites, the fury of roused mobs,
The flap of the curtained litter, a sick man inside borne to the hospital,
The meeting of enemies, the sudden oath, the blows and fall,
The excited crowd, the policeman with his star quickly working his passage to the center of the crowd,
The impassive stones that receive and return so many echoes,
What groans of overfed or half-starved who fall sunstruck or in fits,
What exclamations of women taken suddenly who hurry home and give birth to babes,
What living and buried speech is always vibrating here, what howls restrained by decorum,
Arrests of criminals, slights, adulterous offers made, acceptances, rejections with convex lips,
I mind them or the show or resonance of them — I come and I depart.
or song of the open road as well.
And it was Whitman who served as the original Woody Guthrie. The (mostly manufactured) drifter personae, the unbridled love of the redeeming power of America, as defined by the pure spirit of the American people. The difference being that, even in the times of the civil war, the unrelenting optimism.
by dropstep on Jan 11, 2012 2:12 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Bob would agree with that.
I wouldn’t, obviously.
This Land is Your Land is remarkable though. I love that I got taught that song in grade school as just another ho-hum song, and grew up to realize No. It’s not a ho-hum song.
TAKE THAT, Irving Berlin!
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 12:36 AM CST up reply actions
I like Dylan's stuff whenever covered by someone else.
by 1922 on Jan 11, 2012 9:24 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
All we need are some more average players to put around Love and Rubio.
The End.
Check out Humdinger TV on YouTube.
http://twitter.com/HumdingerTV
by HumdingerTV on Jan 10, 2012 10:45 PM CST via mobile reply actions
Friday the 13th @New Orleans
TWolves Season Part II….The Revenge of Rubio
by fanslaststand on Jan 10, 2012 10:52 PM CST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
I appreciate the philosophical bent to your post. This is a really good website.
Moral victories, winning, whatever. The games are so much more fun to watch this year. We can go into each game with a genuine chance to win. And Rubio is fun to watch, not just because of his fancy passes, but because of his all-around good basketball play. He does the little things and hustles. Williams is also
by mnlawyer on Jan 10, 2012 10:56 PM CST via mobile reply actions
Stupid blackberry. Anyway, to continue: Williams is also fun to watch, despite his rookie mistakes, because he is not afraid to pull the trigger from three or take it hard to the basket. The opposite mentality as Wes Johnson. Williams, as nice as he seems, has the killer instinct.
by mnlawyer on Jan 10, 2012 10:58 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
It's rather annoying that you fail to mention Ridnour who was very good and
can hardly contain yourself when praising Love. As a new fan, I find it rather unusual. Love was, at best, mediocre tonight. And the stat that you highlight as being most telling is the one that Love is supposed to address.
by Sci Fi on Jan 10, 2012 10:59 PM CST reply actions 5 recs
Yup
Luke calls his own number like a SG already. Makes a lot of them too.
by Dr. Wolfenstein on Jan 11, 2012 12:11 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Ya, but these recaps tend to focus on the overall season trends
And less on the particular game.
Luke played real well. He is normally mediocre.
Actually
Luke has had a handful of games already this season in which he has shot well, limited mistakes on the offensive end and played with effort (if not large amounts of skill/finesse) on defense. He’s probably having a B+ season overall.
by SSOL (thats what she said) on Jan 11, 2012 11:08 AM CST up reply actions
Luke has been great
He isn’t a pure PG like Rubio, but to expect that of him is ridiculous. He has never been that.
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 11, 2012 2:49 PM CST up reply actions
very typical of this guy...
Sees what he likes to see.
by SirLusciousLeftFoot on Jan 10, 2012 11:49 PM CST up reply actions
Luke was great tonight
Pek apologist
by running with Twolves (and scissors) on Jan 11, 2012 1:07 AM CST up reply actions
One of the best shooters in the league
Ask him to be your lead guard and yeah, he’s going to struggle. Ask him to play off others and he punishes teams.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 11, 2012 11:23 AM CST up reply actions
Luke played balls out
If he’s playing like this 20 games in, he gets looped into the rotation.
Quick editorial note: as a product being consumed by a fairly specific group (Wolves fans), this site has to offer something that sets it apart from all of the other offerings available to its consumer group. Basic box scores and game wraps are something the Strib and PiPress handle, message boards are better handled by Real GM and MN Sports, ESPN has the national take, and so on and so forth.
This site is about 2 things: It’s a virtual bar and it trades in themes and stories. It is focused on not just the team but what the team means to fans, how other aspects of life can be rolled into its viewing, and all sorts of other things that exist above the nitty gritty of this, that, or the other specific contest. That’s the bit. That’s the selling point.
This isn’t some sort of grand plot or agenda (I’ve never really got the agenda accusation—exactly what…well, it just doesn’t make a lick of sense) or me being unable to see that every now and then other players jump up and have really awesome games. It’s simply a matter of this site choosing to offer something specific that is not offered elsewhere. Other people do the game wraps much better. Other sites have better message boards. ESPN has incredible access and lots of resources. This is still a hobby and the motive of the site is simply to offer something unavailable elsewhere in as good of a way as possible.
That’s the motive here, not me being hardly able to contain myself about Love or me seeing what I want to see. If Luke can maintain this role, it becomes a story and I’ll do my level best to roll it into the bit.
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 11, 2012 11:52 AM CST up reply actions 5 recs
And for that, we thank you.
I’m really just here for the jukebox
by dropstep on Jan 11, 2012 11:56 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm just here for the chicks.
Not going too well so far.
by saudagg on Jan 11, 2012 12:25 PM CST up reply actions 7 recs
i love the atmosphere of this site...
…and the general lack of internet troll-ery and morons. most people on here seem like people i could hang out and eat chicken wings with.
by davechisholm on Jan 11, 2012 12:01 PM CST up reply actions
I just had chicken wings for lunch
and they were amazing. Seemed like just a normal tabaso-ish sauce and they really hit the spot.
Oh hell yes!
Thank you, davchisholm, for mentioning chicken wings on a Wednesday rather than any other day of the week. Time for John Doe to walk down to the local Pizza Hut for some 50 centers.
My twitter: www.twitter.com/HogeJ
ooooh is that a national promotion???
…time to check the couch cushions for change.
by davechisholm on Jan 11, 2012 1:46 PM CST up reply actions
I'm in for mock chicken wings!
"Of what use is a philosopher who does not hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes of Sinope
by Cynical Jason on Jan 12, 2012 2:28 AM CST up reply actions
Not to mention
that it offers people ample opportunity to make their own “Uffda, that Luke Ridnour sure was something tonight, huh!?” fanpost.
It's not global warming...it's the Rubio effect.
by BrettAhlgren on Jan 11, 2012 12:12 PM CST up reply actions
FAQ-worthy description
This editorial note should be put at the top of Wile E’s FAQ
Good idea - I'll add it
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 11, 2012 3:20 PM CST up reply actions
Pretty Much Agree with Everything
1. Rubio is amazing and playing with him is very very good for AR and D.Will.
2. We definitely don’t need more evidence that Wes Johnson is a one dimensional shooter who can’t shoot that well.
3. I’m a long-time Darko defender because, when he is motivated, he plays very good defense (both man to man and PnR) and makes it much harder to drive the lane against us. But, after a pretty solid start to the year where he looked engaged in every game, he’s basically taken three games off. He should be embarrassed to do nothing against pathetic defenders like Bargnani and Boozer. At this point, you could probably cover Darko with Korver and he wouldn’t take it hard to the hoop.
4. I love the ball movement on this team. Beas needs to accept a sixth man role when he gets healthy or we should ship him out.
5. Wing is a bigger need, but Love looks completely dead and we need a true banger down low. How about throwing Pek out there for ten minutes a game?
They had an assistant coach on 1500 today, not sure which one as I caught it mid interview
But he said something to the effect that they don’t really care if Wes goes 0-5 because they see him developing into a shane battier like defender.
I’m thinking this is just a cover up for him saying yeah, he kind of sucks.
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 10, 2012 11:05 PM CST up reply actions
In fairness to him
This is partly true. He’s better in that one small way.
And has the Yips on offense.
Both Love and Rubio
Looked gassed to me tonight with more than 5 minutes left. Love has already played 100 minutes more than anyone else this year.
by Dr. Wolfenstein on Jan 11, 2012 12:13 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
I still think
Wes has an NBA career ahead of him if he ever gets his head back on straight. Most of his problems seem to be mental and if he fixes that the shots will go in.
What's wrong with the NBA is what's wrong with the USA: too much respect for superstars and not enough for working class heroes.
The world is full of
people like Wes. Golfers who hit the ball a mile and can’t putt a lick. Most sports are played in the six inches between your ears. That’s very difficult ground to till.
by Adam Chandler on Jan 11, 2012 3:32 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Man I'm glad people are jump off the Rose train
He is really good… at being a totally ball dominat SG-playing-PG. A really good player, but we should stop crediting him with PG play. This is akin to calling Westbrook a PG.
Rubio is a point guard brothers, accept nothing less.
Rose > Westbrook and it's not close.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:01 PM CST up reply actions
He looks like he was just denied a bank loan.
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
by nja700 on Jan 10, 2012 11:11 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Which player was the MVP last year and which got villified in the playoffs
Player MIN FG% 3P% FT% REB AST BLK STL TO PTS PER
Player A 34.7 .442 .330 .842 4.6 8.2 0.4 1.9 3.9 21.9 23.5
Player B 37.4 .445 .332 .858 4.1 7.7 0.6 1.0 3.4 25.0 23.5
You can make an argument for Rose, but to say it’s not even close is just not true.
by Spouting Opinions on Jan 11, 2012 9:11 AM CST up reply actions
Rose didn't take the ball out of Durant's hands
He has that going for him.
I agree the Westbrook backlash was a little over the top.
Pace has a lot to do with Rose's shooting percentages
Just saying, Chicago played with one of the slowest paces. OKC with one of the fastest paces. It logically follows that defense has more time to get set in a slow-pace games and shots will be more contested.
If you put Rose on a high-pace team next to Durant, you’d see a marginal dip in scoring with large upticks in efficiency and assists.
by SSOL (thats what she said) on Jan 11, 2012 11:22 AM CST up reply actions
That explains the Wolves
High offensive efficiency last season
Sense of proportion: OKC was 13th in pace last year, Chicago 23rd.
(The difference between those two Pace rankings is about 2.5 possessions a game.)
This year, OKC is 14th and Chicago 22nd. Those are grouped a little closer this time, so far.
"Opinion ...a confession."
Rose is fantastic.
Whatever you want to label him as, he’s ridiculously good.
Follow me on Twitter @timallenonline
He is, he is
Maybe I didn’t go out of my way enough to say how good he is (I think I kind of did), but he isn’t really a point guard. I mean, what is the difference between his game and D-Wade’s game?
And one is all PG while the other is all SG? Anyways, it’s not totally important. It works with his team anyways.
He did finish with 11 assists to 2 turnovers
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:13 PM CST up reply actions
And 22 shots
I love assists when they make Rubio look good, but it’s a very flawed stat.
Ha, nice.
It is flawed, based on who’s doing the scoring. Pretty sure Nash and Paul’s assist totals have been padded pretty nicely at their home arenas these past few years.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:21 PM CST up reply actions
I wasn't even thinking that
I was just thinking, that if Rose handles the ball most of the time, any pass he makes is likely going to need to be a shot. Plus he actually has really good shooters around him (unlike the Wiz fan’s take on our team).
But I mean, it’s splitting hairs. He works perfect for their team, I just have a soft spot for ‘real’ PG’s, and like to pick a fight when someone doesn’t go way out of their way to make that clear.
I get what you're saying now, my bad.
But….I think Rose is….man, I’m not sure what comp I wanna go with here, because I know it’s gonna be ludicrous, but……a super-charged Isiaih Thomas? I spelled Isaih wrong, fuck it, hard name to spell….Isaiah?….but that’s what I’m going with.
IsaiagaahQ?
It might not seem like he’s orchestrating the offense because he shoots so much more than what you’d expect from a PG, but he is.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:28 PM CST up reply actions
Isaiah Thomas is the point guard who plays for the Sacramento Kings
Isiah Thomas is former Knicks GM who ran the CBA into the ground.
Follow me on Twitter @timallenonline
That should really be on his Wiki page
“Isiah Thomas is a former Knicks GM who ran the NBA’s CBA into the ground.”
600 N First Ave "like a Pirate's cove".
He is...
I think there is still some residual hate for his being vastly overrated his first two seasons. That at least is how I explain my own Rose pessimism, but the guy can be pretty awesome. His ability to beat people off the dribble in isolation is without peer.
by vjl110 on Jan 10, 2012 11:22 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
His hype is always a year or two ahead of his actual performance
Which is to say he’s totally awesome, will continue to become even more ridiculously awesome, and will continue to be overrated the entire time.
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
by nja700 on Jan 10, 2012 11:43 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Dude plays his ass off at all times
That probably contributes to the lovefest. I do think he sets the tone for that team with how hard he works.
Kinda like Love's hype is a year or two after his actual performance.....
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 11, 2012 11:26 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Don't forget to wave your arms furiously while jumping up and down
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
On a separate topic (that I'm reminded of with this):
I’ve done some digging into the 09 Draft since it’s come up a few times in the past few days. There are a few differing opinions about what happened so I’ll just lay out a few points and people can pick what they want (or make up their own).
- Kahn was mesmerized by Jonny’s smile and handshake and wanted to pair him with whoever Memphis didn’t take at 2.
- Sacramento and OKC had made up their minds about who they were taking and this left the Griz as the wildcard.
- The Wolves last few mock drafts had Ricky falling to 5.
- Kahn said on draft night that they couldn’t believe Ricky was there at 5.
- HoiStackCock were the guys who really wanted Flynn. Kahn was deadset on Ricky and he made the Flynn pick as a compromise.
- Kahn engaged in a CYA campaign throughout the 09/10 season to make it seem like he wanted Reke all along. This was, I think, even alluded to at Hoopus Night when he spoke to the group. If not, I have several emails from season ticket holders who were told as much during private meetings with Kahn.
- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKncXwTYsVs
My personal thoughts: Kahn didn’t know what he was doing and he made it up as he went along. This is the one constant theme. If Flynn was really Hoistackcock’s guy, then he either made an astoundingly foolish decision to placate the “old” front office or he didn’t really know a whole lot about the player he drafted. At the cliched end of the day, POBOs need to be talent evaluators so they are able to discern when typical office infighting over asset x, y, or z is actually detrimental to the franchise.
I personally think he was genuinely shocked Rubio would be there.
Kahn is a smart guy but his greatest strength/weakness is that he views transactions through the prism of office politics. He’s a horse trader and self preservation is a strong (and rational) motive. Unfortunately, this approach often puts him in opposition to the correct basketball move. His knowledge of the game consists of being a fan of the Portland championship team and being near people who know things about basketball.
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 11, 2012 2:11 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
IDK i think you look around the league
and the best Gms also have the best people around him
look at Larry Bird and the Sacramento guy. Sacremento guy built a 7 year run as a West power but can’t hit the broad side of the barn now
Bird almost ran Indy into the ground before he picked up a few FO assistants that are a little more numberzy and now Indiana looks like they are on the up.
San Antonio would hit like crazy on all these 2nd round picks in the early 2000s…and while they’ve done fine they really haven’t established anything for the future (or arguably anything to help them in the presnet) and it’s no coincidence that they’ve been completely fleeced as a FO in the last few years.
I don’t think you need to be anything other than a fan to not make some of the blunders he has. Steph Curry is the ultimate example…He’s made some bad moves, made some good moves, hasn’t signed any bad contracts really.
I could care less if he stays or goes after the year, but I feel like he’s a good enough administrator that if you put the right people around him (like team Adleman) he can get the job done.
The obvious rebuttle is why not get a GM who can do it himself AND have Adleman and I say…go for it!
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Fire HoiStackCock!
That guy should never work in our league again.
Yes, he sure is.
As pissed as I was to be at the game when it was 51-27, the silver lining was getting to see an MVP live and playing his best. He’s incredible.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
Ok guys, I can't take it any more
Rose is really good. But he is not the MVP either.
Last year, he was 5th in WS, 8th in WS/48 for players over 2500 minutes, and he had a 44% FG% and a 33% 3PT% despite taking almost 5 threes a game. It took him 20 shots a game to score 25, and he averaged 3.5 TOs per game.
But, his teamates were considered poor (they weren’t), and he had a very high usage, let’s check some other stats:
His offensive rating (points produced ber 100 possesions) was below Wes Mathews and Elton Brand. His eFG% was 49% (worse than Kobe, the ultimate ‘chucker’), and his PER was 9th in the league, below Westbrook.
Rose plays an important role on his team, and is really good player, but he wasn’t the MVP, and he isn’t a whole lot more than a ‘top 10’ player.
Rose is definitely a top 10 guy.
And, well, agree to disagree, but I think he was a Worthy choice.
I might’ve picked D12 though….
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 12:16 AM CST up reply actions
Rose isn't the MVP
and Dallas is not the champion. Miami should have won that series.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
My mistake
I forgot CH will corner you unless everything is squared to the T.
Rose should not have been the MVP.
I’m not trying to change the history books.
I'm just joking--
I’m a big Rose fan, so if you say he’s not the MVP I at least have to point out that, yes, he was given the award. I understand the counterarguments, Hollinger did a great job of making the other cases last year.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
That he did
And I’m not really concered about the MVP too much, Rose was super-valuable for his team, I just think that award and all the hype has gone past his actual ability at this point.
Results don't lie.
Not another top-30 player on his team and he got Chicago to the ECF. Sounds pretty darn valuable to me.
Follow me on Twitter @timallenonline
What about Dirk, then?
Not another top-30 player there, either, and he won the NBA title.
(Rose is phenomenal, of course.)
Regular season award.
No one was handing Dirk any hardware until he dropped the hammer on the Heat.
"Sportsmanship is just loser talk for losing."
by boyonthedock on Jan 11, 2012 12:23 AM CST up reply actions
precedent set? carry on then
I’m just very happy with the way the H’s and D’s are all alliterating in my last comment.
"Sportsmanship is just loser talk for losing."
by boyonthedock on Jan 11, 2012 12:27 AM CST up reply actions
Chicago 62-20
Orlando 52-30
That’s why.
Follow me on Twitter @timallenonline
by TimAllen on Jan 11, 2012 12:27 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Ok, you win the MVP debate, I don't even want it
But Deng and Noah were probably top 30 players last year. He had a lot more talent than Orlando.
Just… DRose is overrated, as general as that sounds, that is my point.
I would have voted dwight for mvp personally
rose is still awesome. I am now questioning my decision to get into a “Which awesome guy is awesomest?” debate..
"Sportsmanship is just loser talk for losing."
by boyonthedock on Jan 11, 2012 12:29 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
The point is
Rose was a worthy choice. It wasn’t an abomination.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 12:33 AM CST up reply actions
Yep, and that's why he won Finals MVP.
But Chicago was better than Dallas in the regular season.
Follow me on Twitter @timallenonline
Don't forget Wayne Ellington's brutalness!!
The artist formally known as Shane Heal, but FORMERLY known as Blakeley
I'll call it a moral victory.
We lost, but I enjoyed watching it and didn’t feel like I had wasted my time when the game ended.
I’ll gladly take a Wolves loss against a top 5 opponent in exchange for wholesale changes in our rotations, which it looks like we’re about to get. I’m optimistic now.
My love for Randolph is quickly becoming irrational, but he’s tall enough to play center and protect the rim, and his synergy with Rubio is unmistakable. Defensively, I’d really only worry about him against Howard, Bynum, and Marc Gasol. Per synergy, he’s actually a competent jump shooter as long as he’s balanced and not shooting off the dribble. I think a Ricky Rubio-led team will find him those types of looks, stuff around the basket, and keep the ball out of his hands in most other situations, limiting his ability to commit mental mistakes. And he makes his free throws! His rebounding was lousy tonight, but I put more stock in his career numbers that show him to be an above-average-rebounding big man. The Wolves found themselves a new starting center tonight. I, for one, welcome the reign of Anthony Randolph.
In general, I leave this game really feel like things are coming together. Luke Ridnour was exactly what we needed him to be tonight. He’s a competent NBA point guard, well worth the $4 million/year we’re paying him, and his shooting stroke allows him to spend some time alongside the Spanish unicorn as a Boobie Gibson/Mo Williams/Gary Neal type of sharpshooting 3rd guard. Martell Webster is competent. Not more, but not less. I think we could be in really good shape once he gets back.
Rubio (34)/Ridnour (14)
Webster (14)/Ridnour (14)/Barea (20)
Beasley (30)/Webster (18)
Love (20)/Williams(24)
Randolph (34)/Love (14)
Make it so. (With some amount of leeway for Beasley/Williams/Tolliver at the 3 and 4 depending on whether one or both of Beasley and Williams demonstrate some ability to play the game of basketball at some point)
My twitter: www.twitter.com/HogeJ
by John Doe on Jan 10, 2012 11:06 PM CST reply actions 9 recs
Tim recently revealed that our best lineup
only runs out 4 guys. We should just see how those 4 minutes play out.
It's not global warming...it's the Rubio effect.
by BrettAhlgren on Jan 11, 2012 12:06 AM CST up reply actions
I think that is a legit guess
although I think Tolliver gets some minutes. Adelman likes his defensive versitility and outside shooting. Ideally I think Adelman would like to surround Rubio with 4 guys who can shoot.
I think before the deadline Kahn makes a move for a SG. I doubt it will be a blockbuster because I don’t think any of the core guys will be included. Most likely some combo of Beasley/Pek/Wes/Wayne. They’ll try to get back a competent SG who can handle the ball and does not have sticky fingers.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 10, 2012 11:17 PM CST up reply actions
I'll hopefully post a graph on this tomorrow
But some combo of AR/Williams/Tolliver needs to be starting with Love at the 3/4/5. I’d personally try AR at the three with AT at the five and keep Williams as instant offense off the bench (along with Barea unless he’s fully healthy).
But our rotation is literally only 7 guys deep: Love, Rubio, Ridnour, Barea, Williams, AR, and AT. Darko is useful for certain matchups. Ellington has his moments. Both would be best served by sliding down the bench a few spots. This team – without trades – will most likely get a big boost once Lee and Webster return because those guys get fewer minutes, and Wes gets reduced to Darko niche player status. It seems as tho AR has really responded well to his lack of PT 4-5 games ago because of boneheaded decision making. We’ll see how Beasley responds to becoming captain of the B team. I think his future on this team is either as a sixth man or as a jack of all trades developing defensive SF.
by Dr. Wolfenstein on Jan 11, 2012 12:26 AM CST via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
Re: AT
See the footnote. He belongs in there somewhere, and realistically would get minutes. In an ideal world, where Beasley and Williams play like what they’re supposed to be, there’d be no room more a reliable-but-limited role player like Tolliver, but more realistically, you’d probably shave some minutes off of those two plus Randolph to find 20-30 for Tolliver.
Long term, though, I think playing Tolliver as much as we have been caps the team’s potential, because there’s only so much he can do on offense. And this is coming from a big time Tolliver supporter.
My twitter: www.twitter.com/HogeJ
Disagree that playing AT 20-25 minutes/gm caps our potential
Good teams often play guys like Tolliver. He’s a little bit like a Shane Battier; he defends, plays his butt off, sets screens, and shoots selectively and well. I’ve actually been quite impressed with him when he’s guarded SF’s this year, and I think he can absorb some minutes there. To me he’s the epitome of a backup that should be in just about any team’s rotation because he’s positionally versatile, he defends, and he’s willing to let the spotlight shine on the other guys. I don’t think his limitations are the sort that hurt a good team. Even if Beasley, Williams and Randolph all play like we hope they do (I haven’t given up on Beas yet!) I think you have to at least find 10-15 minutes for Tolliver.
Here’s how I’d divide the minutes up, assuming Beas, Williams and Randolph play somewhere between how they have and how we hope they can. It’s close to yours except I’d roll with a 9 man rotation.
Rubio (34)/Ridnour (14)
Webster (16)/Ridnour (12)/Barea (20)
Beasley (28)/Webster (8)/Tolliver (12)
Love (18)/Williams(24)/Tolliver (6)
Randolph (30)/Love (18)
Total
Love (36)
Rubio (34)
Randolph (30)
Beasley (28)
Ridnour (26)
Williams (24)
Webster (24)
Barea (20)
Tolliver (18)
That rotation is rock solid
I meant more than 36 min/game for Tolliver would cap our potential. My impression was that the Chicago game wasn’t the first time he had gotten that much, but the gamelog shows that I was wrong.
My twitter: www.twitter.com/HogeJ
no AT?
Pek apologist
by running with Twolves (and scissors) on Jan 11, 2012 1:13 AM CST up reply actions
Agreed re: AR and Rubio
Great chemistry there. But something tells me that it is way too early to start counting on AR to man the center position for over 30 minutes a game. He looked pretty good against Boozer today but he’s generally been very easy to post up.
vs. Gasol on 1v1 there were 3 possessions that I remember
Gasol scored on none of them he had one assist, a missed shot, and a shot that was blocked. However, it was obviously an off game for him.
Pek apologist
by running with Twolves (and scissors) on Jan 11, 2012 10:49 AM CST up reply actions
I don't think we can label one game as do or die
Especially with this crazy season.
I've already labeled six games as do or die.
I think I might get up to 52 by the end of the year.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:16 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, that was hyperbole.
But as I mentioned in the game thread, the Toronto and Cleveland losses are really killing any buzz that these competitive losses would have given me.
An NOH loss would just put that over the top. I’d be borderline inconsolable. The key to this season is games against teams at or below our talent level. WIN THEM.
Lol, all good
Let’s get some wins. As up and down of a start to the season as we have had, I feel real good about the rest of the season and next year and beyond.
I don't know
We beat SAS, DAL, and WASH in a 6-game stretch. Not bad. One could argue we should have lost the games to SAS and DAL, but win the two against CLEV and TOR. It’s kind of a wash to me.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 11, 2012 11:34 AM CST up reply actions
Good point. Thanks for calming me.
Except that I’d feel better about us continuing to beat the CLE and TORs of the league than the SAS and DALs.
Good game thread title for Friday 13th. Just sayin.
by fanslaststand on Jan 10, 2012 11:19 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
KLove demands change to the starting lineup
Joe Mauer grounded into double play, second to shortstop to first, ________ out at second
It doesn't look like he said that at all
It looks like he was maybe dancing around the question, but he definitely didn’t demand a change to the SL.
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 10, 2012 11:32 PM CST up reply actions
Opposing defenses don't have to pay very much attention to Darko
Love is starting the game where it’s basically 5 defenders to guard 4 offensive threats.
I could see Randolph starting at center, but he has to rebound the basketball with two hands. He lost a lot of rebounds last night because he goes after the ball with one outstretched hand. He plays with Love too who basically tries to gobble up the basketball with his forearms.
Rebounding is about using your body to your advantage. Randolph isn’t that smart of a player yet. He’s still using finesse as if he’s a SF playing Center.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 11, 2012 7:35 AM CST up reply actions
Last night?
Yes. On average? No.
His shot selection was good on 4 of his 5 shots. Three of them were makes. His one bad shot was an attempt to get to the line.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 11, 2012 8:13 AM CST up reply actions
I'd like to see AR
at SF. He’s got length, some shooting ability, and some handles. It’s just a better spot for him than C, IMO.
by Dr. Wolfenstein on Jan 11, 2012 10:26 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
No
The last thing we want him to think is that he’s now a perimeter playmaker out on the wing. That will just reinforce his instinct to chuck it. I like how he’s being used now. Plus I question his ability to stay with opposing SFs defensively.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 11, 2012 11:37 AM CST up reply actions
And yet Darko doesn't use his body to rebound
But he still starts
i think adelman finally changes the starting lineup
essentially he already did in the 2nd half tonight. we just can’t keep getting off to slow starts. bringing barea off bench still gives us energy.
so i see rubio at the 1 and luke at the 2.
who will be at the 3 and 5 though?
by illwafer on Jan 10, 2012 11:30 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Here is another thing
How many practices have we had?
At minimun, we were going to have to wait until this back-to-back-to-back was over to change the starters up.
Good point, wouldn't be surprised if Adleman saw the schedule and pinpointed this game as the game to make the changes, even before Rubio/AR made it pretty obvious.
I’d be shocked if Rubio and AR aren’t in the starting lineup the next game, in place of Darko and Wayne.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 10, 2012 11:33 PM CST up reply actions
It will be
Rubio and Luke, with Live, Tolliver, and probably Randoph but maybe Williams.
by Dr. Wolfenstein on Jan 11, 2012 12:28 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
I agree
What people seem to overlook about him sticking with Rubio and Willaims off the bench is that they get to get there feet wet against 2nd teamers. This makes their life way easier. Then Rubio played the 4th. So it was get your feet wet and do your think in the 2nd. Then play against the big boys in the 4th. To me it’s brilliant. Obviously his play is fine.
I get we need wins, but there is so much going one beside getting a few Ws. We really have to build for the future. Develop these guys the right way. Let them take their lumps. Be patient for the right tread to come along for a good SG. It’s just being smart.
by Rodman99 on Jan 10, 2012 11:45 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'd mostly agree
but not every rookie needs to be brought along slowly. Depends on both the player’s ability to produce as well as his psychological makeup. Just look at Shumpert in NY.
It would also seem to be important that rookies and very young players get their minutes surrounded by vets who can demonstrate positive habits and traits and demand the same (Shumpert again). Maybe the Wolves can’t provide that sort of situation right now.
Based on Rubio's play
and the fact he’s pretty much closed out every game so far, I see no logical reason at this point to keep bringing him off the bench. I get why Adelman started out the year with the same starting unit as last year. He had minimal time to prep and he gave them the benefit of the doubt. Now 10 games in they’ve had their chance and it’s time to make a change. Ricky has clearly proven to be the second best player on this team. He needs to start.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 11, 2012 11:48 AM CST up reply actions
Friday's starters/bench hope
Rubio, Luke, DWill, Love, AR
JJ, Wes (sorry, I know. Gotta see if he can play against 2nd team), Beas, AT, Darko
Still have JJ and Beas in 2nd unit to score, AT for D.
What else do you do? Go in a huge hole, then try to make comeback?
signature
by ChicagoViking on Jan 11, 2012 9:12 AM CST up reply actions
DWill's legs were shot tonight
And thus he had no shot. All part of the rookie growth curve and playing back-to-back-to-back.
by Rodman99 on Jan 10, 2012 11:46 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Idk
Derrick Williams needs to figure out his foot work and how to find his shot in the NBA. Once that happens, I think he will be disgusting. But tonight was an example of his steps are off and he his throwing up ill advised off balance shots even when very close to the hoop.
Agreed
But there is no better teacher than getting blocked. For him and Rubio too. You have to go in among the trees figure it out. The guys who aren’t willing to be blocked never really learn how to improve.
I think he’s going to be great. And I love that he has that balance of willing to take a big shot, and not demanding it, and kind of playing within himself.
Also think he needs to learn where to catch a pass. A few times tonght he was dished up right before he hit a crowd of people.
by Rodman99 on Jan 10, 2012 11:53 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I like the fact that
when Love was blocked so much in his first few years it was a clear indication of the fact that he was not big or athletic enough. With Williams getting blocked is a learning experience. It’s not like I disagree with your take on Williams, although I’ve never been as enthralled with his non-set shot skill set, it’s just a comment on the way we think of athleticism. It seems we always expect the great athletes to “figure it out” and reach their ceiling, but the guys who have great basketball IQ, and have a history of figuring out how to get by without elite athleticism, are always perceived to have already maxed out.
If getting blocked is a good teacher
Jonny Flynn should have been an all star with the Wolves…..
signature
by ChicagoViking on Jan 11, 2012 9:15 AM CST up reply actions
so down on Darko
I still believe.
I'm still a Minnesotan at heart...
by urluckyday on Jan 10, 2012 11:54 PM CST via mobile reply actions
Very excited for the T-wolves future
Fun team to watch. Rubio looks like a stud. glad he finally got over here. Best of luck and fortune!
And Thibs said, Let there be three's, and Deng shot threes
And Deng saw the three's, that they were good
And didn't shoot long two's anymore
by windycitywarrior on Jan 11, 2012 12:05 AM CST reply actions
Gotta get rid of those dang apostrophes though...
It's not global warming...it's the Rubio effect.
by BrettAhlgren on Jan 11, 2012 8:52 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I will have none of this
Thible-thumping madness!
’Twas written by a man!
It's not global warming...it's the Rubio effect.
by BrettAhlgren on Jan 11, 2012 11:08 AM CST up reply actions
Right!
At least be consistent. Screw it up on all of them or on none.
"Of what use is a philosopher who does not hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes of Sinope
by Cynical Jason on Jan 12, 2012 2:32 AM CST up reply actions
Rubio and Barea
I tend to harp on problem areas until other posters get real sick of it, but this is a very smart bunch who has to see what I’m seeing. Rubio and Barea in the game together is wasting Rubio. I’d rather see Wes in there with him…or better yet, let Rubio and Barea precisely split the 48 minutes. Sure, maybe for five minutes max, but it seriously takes away from the positive of Rubio. It makes him a spot-up shooter. And I really like Barea.
And as I write this, I’m realizing that Rubio as a quasi-SG is still better than Wes or Well. I guess maybe the minutes they’re together do actually afford Rubio a rest mentally and somewhat physically. And it’s better than Wes and Well. We need a healthy Malcolm Lee, because he just can’t be worse than those two, and he might actually work pretty well with Barea. Rubio, not being a scorer per se, really benefits from Luke.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
People get upset when Luke or JJ take over a set
I think it may be that they are just giving RR a breather. Do you see how hard he works with the ball in his hands (even though he makes it look easy)? Maybe if Rambis was the coach he could rest on D, but with RA this isn’t happening. You can’t let one guy do all of the work all of the time.
Pek apologist
by running with Twolves (and scissors) on Jan 11, 2012 1:20 AM CST up reply actions
I actually like how we mixed things up a bit
A good offensive team will run different kinds of plays. It makes the offense harder to figure out. If e.g. Ridnour can take some easy shots by taking over, or Beasley can consistently beat his guy in isolation, the opponents coach needs to do something about it. If we assume that the opponent can always optimize the defense against only one kind of an offense, making the opponent adjust to a different kind of offense will lead to a sub-optimal defense against another type of offense. You need to hit your shots though.
That’s why I like the potential of this team. Adelman said that the team didn’t have the time to learn any of his sets, so next year (or hopefully even this year, after the all-star break) we will be able to mix things up even more.
I can't contain myself anymore. Does Ricky Rubio have the highest BBIQ ever?
This thought has to have crossed someone else’s mind.
That is a big call right there
Live And Stupid From England
by JonesTheCat on Jan 11, 2012 3:05 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Magic and Bird
I think that’s exactly what they brought to the NBA and why it changed everything.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 11, 2012 3:25 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
But how much of Ricky
is from watching Magic and Nash and other greats?
Athletic greatness grows over time, and the kids who are inspired by Rubio’s career will be even more special.
What's wrong with the NBA is what's wrong with the USA: too much respect for superstars and not enough for working class heroes.
Ha
haha
haha
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 11, 2012 3:57 AM CST up reply actions
Heh, No
But it is very good. The PTI guys were talking about how they would take Rubio over John Wall knowing what they know now.
Rubio is already a mature professional. He is still learning what he has to do to win in the NBA. But he is already a seasoned pro at avoiding making the same mistakes twice.
He had a couple ridiculous passes to wide open Wolves that they didn’t connect. The Bulls are a top defensive team and they really had no answer to Rubio’s passing ability.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 11, 2012 6:39 AM CST up reply actions
I hate questions with no answer.
espn talking points are designed to be stupid.
So you think he's the most knowledgable basketball player of all time?
That is preposterous on so many levels…
a) you know every basketball player who has lived
b) you know him closely enough to have quantifiable data on his knowledge
c) ? profit ?
It’s simply an impossible question. Designed solely to have people argue without the slightest possibility of being right. Nothing personal, I know a lot of people here watch espntalk, but these questions…
Just my opinion, that's all. Like almost everything else here.
Actually, like most everything in life. I admit though, that I had thought about players from earlier. Impossible to really judge unless you go back and watch tape. Even Magic I truly can’t remember specifics about. So I’ll just say of today’s players.
You know it is possible to discuss things without arguing. And who says it’s important to be right? Maybe just discussing is enough.
Over at the Bulls' site, they're talking about trading Noah for Iggy and Kevin Martin and the likes. Playing on the trade machine and stuff.
Seems like they’re disappointed in his play this year, and Gibson + Asik is good enough behind him.
I’m sure the Bulls’ decision-makers aren’t in that same boat, but Derrick Williams and Anthony Randolph for Noah?
I can't imagine they are looking for
anything other than a SG. We should try to beat them to it.
Yeah I'm sure that's correct.
I also can’t imagine they’re interested in trading Noah in the first place.
Isn't that why
They signed Rip Hamilton?
by Dr. Wolfenstein on Jan 11, 2012 10:30 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
The Bulls are not going to trade Noah
Wanting to trade Noah is a desperate attempt to think he won’t return to form.
A lot of NBA players are playing well below their career averages. The schedule is pretty brutal.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 11, 2012 7:30 AM CST up reply actions
Trading Noah would be idiotic
…he anchors that defense.
But, if they were willing to trade Noah for Martin, our package of crap w/ crap probably wouldn’t work.
Definitely
I don’t care how they get those 2 players of awesome production. Right now, Ricky is one of those 2 guys and he’s fun to watch. I hope he stays, but I’m not going to say that I don’t think this team should not think about trading everybody but Love in order to get that production.
It really is too bad that the Wolves don’t have that draft pick. D-Will + the pick + filler might be the best Orlando can get. I think Dwight would need about 2 games to realize that Ricky + Love = all the help he needs in life. It would be glorious. The world needs it. Mother Nature desires it. Humankind would be redeemed by it.
Dwight, do right. Force your way to the unicorn.
Rubio is already pretty non tradeable
For Marketing AND basketball reasons. Love would probably be annoyed to see Rubio go, any player worth doing that is probably unavailable or unkeepable long term (Dwight)
Would be incredible
I’m surprised at your willingness to move Rubio so soon, especially after these 10 games of insane rookie contract production. You could argue that for the next 3 years he will be more valuable to the team than Love when you factor in how cheap he will be in comparison (assuming Love signs the max). I’m not saying Rubio is better, but 4 years of great PG production + the fun factor all coming on a cheap rookie deal is one of the most valuable chips in the league, no?
I don't know if I have a willingness...
…to move the guy. I certainly wouldn’t let it get in the way of surrounding Love with 2 awesome players. That’s the goal. 2 awesome players + Love.
Dwight, do right. Bigger market, being 1/2 of the best lob connection in league history, help on the glass like you’ve never had before….sign here!
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 11, 2012 12:05 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Dreaming alongside you for a moment...
Here’s an honest question: how far from title contention would we be with Dwight joining our current roster?
They're immediately the best team in the West
Opposing teams get only 1 shot on offense. Continuing to dream…they attract Ray Allen in free agency. 3 point shooters flock to Minnesota. They become the Magic, but actualized with awesome upgrades over what Dwight has to work with.
Wonder if RJ & Kahn have had the audacity to call?
Or how Orlando feels about Williams.
I agree w/o our pick doesn’t seem like we can bring near enough value to the table (assuming we keep Love & Rubio).
Would help a bit if the UTA and MEM picks weren’t so heavily protected.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 11, 2012 12:58 PM CST up reply actions
The MN market has certainly not
stopped Rubio from getting AMAZING pub. He has been in an ESPN story practically every day, including today.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 11, 2012 12:24 PM CST up reply actions
He deserves it
but never forget the media’s hunger for the growing Spanish speaking audience. Rubio is for PR purposes the NBA’s Tim Tebow.
What's wrong with the NBA is what's wrong with the USA: too much respect for superstars and not enough for working class heroes.
awesome recap vid
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 11, 2012 2:50 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Love. This.
And holy hell it is a good thing I don’t read Spanish or else I do not know how I would get any work done over the next few months ;)
It might be nice if Hanny just sticks with his usual and J-Pete chimes in with a really loud and muppet-like BOING! at the appropriate moment.s
Other option
Alan Horton could become the first play by play guy with a sound bar during games. That clip has about 20 sound bar opportunities. I’ll email it to Alan and hope for the best ;)
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 11, 2012 3:06 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Annnnddddd...sent:
Alan,
http://espndeportes.espn.go.com/news/story?id=1446060&s=bas&type=story
Watch the video. I think you should incorporate the “BOING!” sound into your game call ;)
I think there’s an entire sound bar worth of sounds in that clip. Has there ever been a sports broadcast with a sound bar?
Fingers crossed! ;)
Hmm
that’s not a word for word translation of the English language site, is it?
Reading The Whore of Akron right now (and will post on it) and was surprised that Raab seems to hate ESPN even more than LeBron. ESPN is muy especial when it comes to flogging the League.
What's wrong with the NBA is what's wrong with the USA: too much respect for superstars and not enough for working class heroes.
The crazy thing to me
is that the idea of a big-name FA like Dwight signing here actually seems plausible with this squad. I still think it is unlikely, but with Love, Rubio, and Adelman it doesn’t feel as far-fetched as it once would.
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
Despite SnP's ever-expanding influence in the baketball interwebs..
and the almost-embarrassing Rubio-fawning of the national media, I can hardly fathom Dwight Howard signing with Minnesota.
That said, I can get behind this campaign, and fantasize about the reactions of everyone from Deron “I could sign with Minnesota%” Williams to the trolliest trolling Knicks fans commenting on ESPN.
Here's how it will work
We just need to get someone to ask him about it and for him to be aware that there is a clamor for the creation of Lob Universe. Cities are too small for the Man of Steel. He can create an entire existence.
Unfortunately, Orlando doesn’t play here this year. Section 121 could have dressed up like super heroes and held up banners of cute kittens demanding that Dwight help guide Planet Lovetron to Lob Universe. Posters of Dwight planking on a unicorn could be waved. Robbie Ismalufogus could ask him if he ever thought about what it would be like to play with a passer as gifted as the Spanish Unicorn.
He just needs to be asked about it and to be aware of it. The meme needs to be developed and set free into the talk radio/ESPN world. Right now, people hear Dwight and Ricky and they scoff at it. This is like when you first hear a crappy pop song. Repetition will cure that. It always does.
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 11, 2012 2:32 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
A much-older and worn-down veteran star free agent...
that I could see entering Wolves discussions is Kevin Garnett.
When—not if—the Celtics fizzle this year either to the tune of no playoffs, or a decided one-and-done, I kind of expect KG to either retire or leave Boston. Depending on whether his ego could handle being the 4th or 5th fiddle (his basketball ego hasn’t necessarily been a problem for him, in terms of pecking order) he might like to finish his career in a state he loves, that loves him, playing for a great coach and with exciting and likeable young players. The current version of Kevin Garnett, even if for 20-25 minutes per game, would be a welcome addition in my view. Depending on what is done with amnesty and team options (Beasley) a KG signing might attract another veteran of note.
Just a thought. D12 has a short list and Minny ain’t on it.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
Having an old and crusty KG in the locker room
wouldn’t hurt anything one bit. KG would kick ass and take names and would make life hell for unmotivated players. He would also be a stone cold terror off the bench.
What's wrong with the NBA is what's wrong with the USA: too much respect for superstars and not enough for working class heroes.
KG is an asshole though
And a dirty player. I don’t know if he was the same when he was here in MN (I was too young then to really look for dirty plays) but his last year or two as a celtic have been pretty pathetic
Jonny "Bag o' Chips" Flynn is gone, who's next?
Crystal Ball says Wes "The Ghost" Johnson
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 11, 2012 3:02 PM CST up reply actions
So are many other
all-time greats. I’d rather he be our asshole than someone else’s.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
I'd be far, far more concerned
about Darko.
But he would be traded or cut in this scenario.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
Another good reason to add KG.
He could fire up Darko before every dang game.
"Opinion ...a confession."
I was thinking Randolph...
If he’s extended, there’s a guy that could learn from Kevin Garnett. Just look at KG’s body now versus at AR’s age.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
KG, rookie summer league:
So thin, Chad Hartmann wondered if his shorts might fall off.
"Opinion ...a confession."
Not sure AR
could hold up under KG’s tongue lashings. Darko, otoh, might duke it out with KG and that would probably improve both their ’tudes.
Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!
Wouldn't that be something?
Dwight + Love + Rubio + anyone who can shoot and defend a little on the wing = change at a ring.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 11, 2012 12:23 PM CST up reply actions
chance
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 11, 2012 12:23 PM CST up reply actions
It would be glorious. The world needs it. Mother Nature desires it. Humankind would be redeemed by it.
League Pass needs it!
We’re humble and don’t ask it for ourselves; we ask it for the league.
by jianfu on Jan 11, 2012 12:51 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Must See TV would be back.
Don’t get me excited, jerks. I’m a beaten down MN sports fan and things like ‘hope’ tear me apart.
Brain on Funk seems fond of using Ricky for its captions.
My favorite:
source: http://docfunk.tumblr.com/post/14402217204
My twitter: www.twitter.com/HogeJ
by John Doe on Jan 11, 2012 1:57 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Anyone know why Wes Johnson never returned after the 1st quarter?
He shot the ball well. I know the Wolves were down 15 points during his playing time, but was that on Wes? I thought Ellington and Love were just awful during that stretch.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
The alternate lineup could compete against the Bulls.
Wes’ lineup could not.
I really think that was the end of the story—and his career-long ineptitude was more than enough to justify what you might think seemed unfair.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
But Wes was out there with Darko and Ellington
Does that make the 5 man “Wes’ five man”?
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 11, 2012 9:37 AM CST up reply actions
Wes sucked.
In about 5 minutes he turned over the ball like 6 times. Some were so bad that he like just set the ball on the ground and walked away, and I’m not kidding.
He’s managed to get worse and worse by the game.
The box score lists just 1 turnover
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 11, 2012 10:16 AM CST up reply actions
I was actually little confused why he didn't play more in this game
it seemed like he was one of the few people to have a little life in the 1st quarter
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 11, 2012 10:19 AM CST up reply actions
HIS POINT STILL STANDS!!!
…did i do that right?
by davechisholm on Jan 11, 2012 10:20 AM CST up reply actions
I can understand yanking Wes when he's bad
But he was good last night.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 11, 2012 11:10 AM CST up reply actions
Wet, except when frozen, and round, except when faceted...
But wes really is always terrible. The one real truth in the universe.
I don't know how their system works..
But I think it is like football where if you try to hand off to someone and that person slaps the ball out of your hands onto the ground it is the initial controller’s responsibility for the turnover.
He made a couple shots yes, the rest of the time he was bumbling the ball over to the other team. I watched it, I didn’t peruse the box score after the game. And obviously adleman saw something similar to me because wes sat the whole rest of the game.
Big Thrilla fan
but I may have given some of Williams minutes to Wes last night….It was pretty clear Williams didn’t have it last night
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 11, 2012 10:41 AM CST up reply actions
After watching the entire game, I suppose 1-7 could have been replaced,
but making those decisions in real time is overwhelmingly in favor of Williams over Wes, I think.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
Yep
plus Williams seems to give you more when he isn’t scoring
he played pretty scrappy and had a few big plays down the stretch. wish he’d hit his free throws though, that’d have been a big diff maker.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 11, 2012 10:46 AM CST up reply actions
Dude, thanks again for the shout-out.
I just put out a new album called “Calligraphy.”
Some of you guys might like it (some won’t). One dude said it’s like a mix of Radiohead and Miles Davis (great compliment, but it’s mostly inspired by Sigur Ros, kind of).
here’s a link to my website. There are some cool animated promo videos some friends did for my new album on the front page of the site.
Here it is on Itunes
and Amazon
you can listen to the whole thing here, but you should buy it instead! ;-)
sorry for the long-ish spam-ish post, but i figured i’d let y’all know about it!
RANDOLPH THE GREY!!!
the new one is very different from the first...
…i think it’s wayyyy better.
thanks SO much for the kind words, man!
by davechisholm on Jan 11, 2012 11:58 AM CST up reply actions
First game all year I didn't watch
and once again the starting unit disappoints… I sure hope RA changes his lineups up soon.
http://www.popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/gameflow.cgi?date=20120110&game=CHIMIN
Chicago's rotation
Why were Boozer and Noah not in the game during the fourth quarter? Is that their normal rotation? Or, was Chicago sitting their two best inside players to make the game competitive for the home crowd because they knew Rose would win the game in the fourth quarter? (just kidding with that last questions). I thought Boozer looked especially good when he was in the game.
hmm
Boozer was 3-10 with a -7. He definitely was having an off night.
Noah seemed like he was getting frustrated, but he always seems like that.
by davechisholm on Jan 11, 2012 8:14 AM CST up reply actions
Boozer was doing well early on.
But struggled to do anything offensively against the longer Randolph.
It's not normal
Unless normal is “what they did last night against the Pistons”.
Thibodeau will stick with a hot hand if its working. He had Rose, Deng, and Korver working offensively. The Wolves really were not stopping it. With Asik and Gibson, they are primarily defensive stoppers and rebounders. They play big and tend to get their hands up to change shot attempts.
Gibson had a nice recovery block on Love in the 4th. Love probably converts that on most nights and then goes to the line for the easy 3 point conversion.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 11, 2012 8:17 AM CST up reply actions
Boozer looked good in the first quarter
After that, Adolph bullied him completely. He played like crap:
2nd
Boozer Layup Shot: Made (7 PTS) Assist: Rose (3 AST) 05:36 [CHI 50-27]
Boozer Rebound (Off:0 Def:3) 05:24
Boozer Turnover : Bad Pass (1 TO) 04:51
Boozer Jump Shot: Missed 03:13
Boozer Jump Shot: Missed 02:38
Boozer Jump Shot: Missed 00:48.9
3rd
Boozer Rebound (Off:0 Def:4) 10:59
Boozer Foul: Shooting (1 PF) 10:24
Boozer Turnover : Bad Pass (2 TO) Steal:Rubio (2 ST) 10:12
Boozer Fadeaway Jump Shot: Missed 09:56
Boozer Rebound (Off:1 Def:4) 09:13
Boozer Layup Shot: Missed 09:11
Boozer Rebound (Off:1 Def:5) 08:53
Boozer Foul: Shooting (2 PF) 04:33
Boozer Substitution replaced by Gibson 03:21
Gibson was much more aggressive on D.
After 10 games, we know who can play at least...
..but it’s not that deep a team.
These players are the only ones who should get minutes: Love, Rubio, Luke, JJ, DWill, AT, Beas, Randolph, and during injury/blowout situations — Wayne. And anything beyond those first two are trade OK.
Here’s hoping things look up (in Feb??) when Martell, Miller, and Lee return. Or when we pull off a trade.
So, at least we have learned something.
signature
Gotta give respect to Randolph and Ridnour SnP
Agape, Unicorn and not much else?
Ridnour was perhaps our MVP of that game
Tolly/Randolph aboslute should be the only 5’s we play
This was a bad Thrilla game, first time all year he really looked like he had the “deer in headlights” rookie look. It’s probably overall a good thing, but you still don’t wanna see it.
Rubio is amazing.
I’m starting to think Randolph/Ridnour could be a very enticing trade package for a team giving up a 2….considering they are both producing very well and give us depth (albeit at positions we already have covered) we shouldn’t just trade em for anyone….but they are both good and cheap and should be attractive in a trade if an offensive strapped team (Miluakee, Cha, Cleve) is looking to get a kick in the pants
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
The Knick fans are infuated with rookie Shumpert
And I think that team is going to be hamstrung by its weakness at the point. They’ve signed the fetid remains of Bibby and the injured, flabby Baron Davis. So I’m wondering if a Luke for Fields trade would have legs.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 11, 2012 9:43 AM CST up reply actions
Doh - typo - infatuated
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 11, 2012 9:45 AM CST up reply actions
It's too bad that we couldn't get them to part with Shumpert
Shump is an absolute animal
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
I like Fields
He needs to get away from that toxic ball-stopping team.
Having three competent ballhandlers has been nice though…
Well can fields handle the rock?
if he can it shouldn’t be an issue right?
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
As a sign and trade maybe, but the Knicks cap-space doesn't let them trade straight up as Fields isn't getting paid NBA money yet.
600 N First Ave "like a Pirate's cove".
I actually went to Raptors HQ to ask what they thought of DD
Their opinions kind of varried…it seems like a lot of people view his asset level as similar to DThrill (in that there is a camp that never wants to trade him, one that absolutely does, and another that is kind of in the middle) but the consensus was the coaching staff does get a little frusterated with him from time to time
and they do believe they have a huge hole at SF.
So I do think DD is gettable and this might be the way to get him
Toronto gets: Marvin Williams/Michael Beasley/Wes Johnson
ATL: Luke Ridnour (Pargo is their current best and only back up point)/Darko/Randolph
Minn: Derozan and Amir Johnson
Now Marvin Williams is currently rocking a 20 PER, but he’s always seemed like a guy they would move and ATL has really nothing for point guards outside of Teague
Toronto gets some depth at SF which they currently have none and they then move Bayless to SG and have a four headed rotation of Bayless/Forbes/Barbosa/Calderon for their main backcourt rotation
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 11, 2012 10:11 AM CST up reply actions
Knick fan here...
but have always loved the Wolves since the Pooh days. Being a UofA fan has drawn me back towards you guys again as I’m wishing D-Will the best with you guys.
We’re pretty down on Fields at the moment, but as a cheap option he’s still a good fit for us. I don’t think we’ll make any moves until Baron is back and shows us what he’ll be able to offer.
From the little I’ve been able to see of you guys, though undersized, Rid, Rubio and JJ make up a pretty decent 3-guard rotation. Not sure if you need to make a move just yet at least until you see how a new lineup might work out there. It’s nice you seem to have some tradeable assets to work with! :-)
Also nice to see y’all voted onto NBA-TV last night… shows the respect you’re earning up there. Best of luck to you all and stay patient with D-Will… he’ll get there.
How much you loving Shump?
The guy is insane. He is going to be an absolute beast for 2’s and 1’s to guard for years
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 11, 2012 10:35 AM CST up reply actions
You have no idea the love he's receiving on our site... lol
It’s outta control and just about everyone already views him as absolutely critical to our team after such a short time (with basically no camp even!). So yeah, the kid seems legit and the confidence/poise he shows is unreal.
As a rook, I hope all the hype this early doesn’t go to his head in any way and he stays exactly as he is and continues working as hard as he does. He doesn’t seem like the type that will let it affect him at all… so I’m keeping my fingers crossed.
Nice to see he’s getting recognition around the league and among other fans already too.
If you guys don't want fields...
…we want him. Yesterday. With bells on.
Are we positive about this?
the guy has a 9 PER and last year didn’t have a PER over 15 and he’s 23
isn’t this a pretty similar situation to Wes?
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Luke was the MVP against the Bulls
with Ricky a close second.
Luke hit shots all night long. And lately when others (read Love) have been cold, Luke has kept us in games by making shots.
He’s proving to be a very good offensive pairing with Rubio, better than Rubio/Barea as Barea needs the ball in his hands more.
Luke both highlights and helps compensate for Wolves glaring weakness at SG. He’s the best SG we got, and it’s not close.
signature
by ChicagoViking on Jan 11, 2012 12:37 PM CST up reply actions
The verbal pats on the head continue...
From 4-letter:
“Rubio played a hell of a game,” Rose said after the victory, in which he finished with 31 points and 11 assists. "All of their other players played well, knocking down shots when he was passing them the ball. They’re a different team. They play with a lot of energy. “They all are on the same page. Everybody knows their own role.”
Granted, verbal “attaboys” got tossed their way back when Ryan Hollins was starting over Kevin Love, probably. But back then the focus always seemed to be on “young guys.” Code for “they’re not good (yet, or maybe ever).” Now it seems like there’s more respect for a real foundation (or maybe that’s just me).
It just feels like they’re so close; and yet, still so eff-upable.
Close to what though?
I think they are close to being a 20-25 win team this year. That’s a nice improvement over last year, but not close to being a playoff team. They don’t have enough talent yet.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 11, 2012 12:00 PM CST up reply actions
Speaking more long-term
Close to finally having a legit 3-player foundation to move forward with and get off the lotto carousel. I think they’ve maybe got 2 of the 3, and everyone else is expendable to get #3.
Close to getting messed up if the Love extension gets botched, or if they acquire the wrong third wheel, or if they just sit/extend contracts on these diminishing and/or mismatched extra pieces.
If we could just add some so-so wing players. Gawd.
Luol Deng is what we need, but I’d settle for less. Damien Wilkins; what’s he doing now?
"Opinion ...a confession."
I was amazed at how long and good the Bulls are.
All of them. What a good team.
Ahh man...the one that got away...
But seriously. What is he doing? Just bring in Bogans or something already.
(Bogans is exactly whom I was thinking of there.)
He’s today’s equivalent of Trenton Hassell. You can patch things together with a Bogans type. Do this.
"Opinion ...a confession."
I guess I'm a pessimist then
2 out of 3 means we’re missing one. It took us years and multitudes of picks to get a second good player to join Love. I assume it will be the same kind of slog to get a 3rd.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 11, 2012 1:31 PM CST up reply actions
My understanding of players in free agency is that players want...
1) money
2) minutes
3) wins
4) everything else
We never compete in area 4 with the big markets, but getting close the threshold of number 3 is important.
600 N First Ave "like a Pirate's cove".
Understood
My point is that I think we’re still a long ways from #3, even with Rubio and Love. May be instead of being a perennial top 5 lotto team we go to being a top 10 lotto team. It’s still a losing record.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 11, 2012 1:54 PM CST up reply actions
Having bad flashbacks about all those Draft trade downs for $
Marshawn Brooks, Iman Shumpert anyone at SG? At least, we’d have a plan. Too bad about Malcolm Lee for now.
I give Kahn kudos — big kudos — for work on trading for/drafting/convincing Ricky to come. AT was a good, cheap signing. JJ good this year.
?? abound though — Beasely, AR, Pek, Wayne
as do Duds — Jonny, Wes, Darko (yeah, “cheapish” but so what, just not good), and the silent killer of passing on better players
signature
I wish we had Brooks..
..but if trading Brooks for Lee meant that we have Adleman instead of rambus… It’s an overall win.
by bustaone on Jan 11, 2012 1:12 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Iman Shumpert is going to be the biggest Kahn blunder
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 11, 2012 10:14 PM CST up reply actions
Haha
Well I generally like picking out players that are “undervalued” or “on the rise”
like obviously I love KLove, but who doesn’t on here? I do tend to fall in love with guys that are in that sub superstar category like Harden (which I think Shump will be in soon).
Harden, Shump, Thrilla, Paul George, I actually do like Malcom Lee’s game quite a bit, I need to see him play some real ball games first but man did he look like a true SG in those pre-season games.
I go off a lot of “eye testing” I watch college ball and try to at least watch highlights of all the games. Shump makes moves like a big time NBA guard and he is a monster (6-5, 220) he can’t shoot all that well right now but I would describe him as having almost “unlimited upside” as an NBA 2 guard.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
I would say with 3 years in college
of sub-40% shooting, and the continued trend at the professional level, his upside is decidedly “limited.”
It's not global warming...it's the Rubio effect.
by BrettAhlgren on Jan 13, 2012 10:36 AM CST up reply actions
He is going to be a bear for 2's to defend
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Wow, watching him for the first time tonight
Color me unimpressed by his chucker mentality. I’ll say pass, and hang my head over passing up Brooks, Selby, and….I think one other, but the name eludes me.
(but he’ll fit right in in NYC!)
It's not global warming...it's the Rubio effect.
by BrettAhlgren on Jan 12, 2012 8:31 PM CST up reply actions
Actually, Kawhi Leonard was the guy I was hoping would keep slipping to that second pick of ours
But SA took him sooner, so I don’t think he counts.
Isn’t a shooter, but he would be a gritty, finishing slasher at the 3 (what we’ve wanted Beas to be, basically).
It's not global warming...it's the Rubio effect.
by BrettAhlgren on Jan 13, 2012 10:50 AM CST up reply actions
Here is what I will say
are you talking about the 5-20 game? I saw that and laughed that it was right after I made my previous post about my love for Shump. It was a bad game, but all these guys have bad games early in their careers.
He’s being played as a point right now, which is much like us trying to make Wes a 2 in that Shump is 2 guard. that’s what he is. everything he does well is resembling of a true 2. if they can get a real point guard there they will be in business.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
If he's being played as a point...
…why is he chucking like a chucker?
And this is not a stand-alone bad game. 38% FG, 26% 3FG for the year. Ish. Sure, it’s a small sample size, but what else are we looking at?
Heck, I just went back to his Ga Tech stats from last year: 40% FG, 28% 3FG
Looks like he is what he is.
Have your love affair if you want, but is he going to shoot even more when he plays the 2?? No thanks.
It's not global warming...it's the Rubio effect.
by BrettAhlgren on Jan 13, 2012 10:31 AM CST up reply actions
Just read that Greg Ostertag is making a comeback
Once he gets into shape, I wouldn’t really mind giving him a shot.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 4:16 PM CST reply actions
(reads that again)
I can’t believe I’m serious.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 11, 2012 4:16 PM CST up reply actions
Wow.
The article mentions Luther Head as another D-Leaguer. He’s another guy who, sadly, could help (like Bogans). But we can’t do that with all of the potential we’ve got to give minutes to!
Wow - We could finally get the guy
McHale was all set to trade Brandon Roy for!
(I think the rumored trade McHale was angling for was Roy for Foye + Luther. POR sniffed it out and drafted Foye themselves to make us trade Roy to them instead).
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 13, 2012 8:58 AM CST up reply actions
It just occurred to me, and seemed quite funny
the “NONE SHALL PASS” from Randolph the Grey might be referring less to blocks and more to his theory on offense.
by dontbesomean youngfella on Jan 12, 2012 12:36 PM CST reply actions
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