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Will The Wolves and Jazz be Fighting for the Eighth Seed? (With Poll!)

There's a good chance the Wolves and Jazz will be fighting it out for the eighth and final seed of the NBA playoffs this year. At stake isn't banners, but picks. More below the jump (along with women in bikinis and by women in bikinis, I mean numbers).


Star-divide

Here's the Western Conference standings by Point Differential (which is a better indicator of future performance than current record) as of 1/19 (courtesy of ESPN):

DEN +5.6
OKC +4.5
LAL +3.9
DAL +3.7
SAS +3.5
POR +2.6
UTAH +2.2
MIN +2.1
LAC +0.8
MEM +0.4
HOU -0.4

By current point diff, Utah is the seventh seed, we're the eighth, and the Clips just barely miss out while still possessing a positive point differential. Phoenix is on the outside looking in with a -2.6 while Memphis and Houston both have a good chance of screwing this all up with a current 0.4 and -0.4, respectively. Admittedly, we're only 15 games into the season so there's not that much data to go off here.

Want more statistical probability hocus pocus? Okey dokey.
Arturo predicts the Jazz finishing eighth in the Western Conference and the Wolves finishing ninth.

Arturo's model does not account for injury, player development and team chemistry, but it does attempt to account for elevation, rest, strength of schedule, homecourt advantage, and current point margin. And it's in these factors Denver and Utah have an edge over other teams. According to Arturo's number crunching, both teams on account of rest and elevation, get an additional four wins for homecourt advantage. They also receive an advantage for strength of schedule, or lack thereof. So what? So...if Utah is currently over-performing and bound to come back down to earth, it can only come back down to earth so far (darn high elevation). Their W/L record has 'em sitting pretty in the number two seat in the west. Barring any unfortunate injury, at this current pace Utah will make the playoffs. At a slightly slower pace, Utah will still make the playoffs.

Like I said, Arturo's model does not account for injuries, team chemistry, or player development (how can it?). Our Wolves are the only western conference team to have a positive point differential and a losing record, which should mean we're better than our record. But are we good enough for the playoffs?

Right now, we are the eighth-ranked team in the West by point differential and eleventh by W/L record. Most observers (to be fair, obsessed fans) believe a trade will occur this season to balance the roster while Rubio continues to develop, Williams gets more playing time and develops, JJ recovers while playing, and Webster, Beasley, Lee, and Brad Miller return from injury. We are a young team with a new coach with four players about to return from injury (and one who just returned from injury). The future is undoubtedly brighter than the past. It is not unreasonable to believe we will play better after the All-Star break. Howver, it's not unreasonable to believe the same about the Clippers (or the Griz or the Rockets, but I discount the Griz because I think their chemistry is ruined and Randolph is dropping off, and I discount the Rockets because they are cursed with Flynn, Thabeet, McHale, and the ghost of Adelman).


There's a very good chance the Jazz end up in the playoffs, which means the draft pick we acquired from them will be #15 or higher (right now, it would be #21 -- their pick is protected so we want them to make the playoffs). There's a decent, outside chance we make the playoffs, which means the draft pick the Hornets acquired from the Clippers from us would not be a lottery pick, but instead #15 or higher (right now, #12 pick with potential for lottery dash to the top. This pick is unprotected so just out of sheer spite and not wanting to see someone else benefit from our crappiness, we want to make the playoffs). [N.B. -- My understanding of how these protected and unprotected repeatedly traded draft picks work year by year is shaky at best. If I got my facts wrong or if it requires further illumination, please correct my errors in the comments below. Thanks!] There's even a chance both the Jazz and the Wolves are in the playoffs, but that would mean the Clippers don't make the playoffs or one of the other teams currently seeded -- which all have solid records and strong avg point diffs -- completely falls off. I'm not a stats whore nor am I entirely crazy -- the Clips not making the playoffs while the Wolves do seems to be a very unlikely scenario. Either or, it's obvious there will be plenty of competition for those final two spots and our Wolves will be a contender this year.

What if we're fighting Utah for that final spot? Do we tank to give Utah the spot and thus obtain their draft pick, although at the same time it bequests a lottery pick to the Hornets? Do we fight for that final playoff spot even if it means bumping out the Jazz and losing that draft pick for this year?
Poll
Vote.
Wolves make playoffs, who cares what anyone else does.
84 votes
You're crazy.
3 votes
Wolves tank to Utah to acquire the draft pick. Hornets' pick miraculously turns out to be #1; Hornets' rep at the draft is a charismatic terminally ill child.
23 votes
Wolves fight it out to develop a winning tradition and piss off Stern for another decade by ruining the Hornets' draft pick. Wolves fandom Schadenfreude at its finest. But we bump Utah out of the playoffs and lose their protected pick in the process.
40 votes
Utah plays how it should and doesn't make the playoffs at all.
10 votes
Wolves maintain a losing record and don't make the playoffs.
32 votes
There are no playoffs after Stern reveals his true form as Xenu and converts the NBA into the Galactic Confederacy and absorbs the souls of all max contract players, much to the delight of Dan Gilbert who transcribes Xenu Stern's exploits in comic sans.
16 votes

208 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 39 comments  |  1 recs  | 

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The Wolves best chance of making the playoffs

Is if Dirk or CP3 goes down for the season. That also would be Utah’s best chance. I’m not sure who is better of the two teams, but I suspect Min, Utah, and GSW fight it out for best record among non-playoff teams.

One thing I’m pretty sure of. The Jazz might finish one or two games out of a playoff spot, but they will not finish 3-6 games out. Either they’re contending or they’re tanking. I’m thrilled with every win, and I can almost cheer for the Wolves to lose to them Saturday (maybe not).

Wolves will not contend, but they will destroy the other non-playoff teams starting in March when the other teams want to tank and don’t think they’re disrupting playoffs by losing to the Wolves.

You can't...dust...for vomit.

by twinstalker on Jan 19, 2012 11:30 AM CST reply actions  

I expect the wolves to contend for the 8th spot (less than 6 games back at end of season)

Actually winning it is contingent on a trade for either a decent 2 or 5 and Webster playing acceptably (.9+ ws48). Signing Bogans plus a decent Webster I think actually gets us there but I’m definitely a Homer.

by zebano on Jan 19, 2012 11:59 AM CST up reply actions  

You're forgetting the effective-Pek factor.

"Of what use is a philosopher who does not hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes of Sinope

by Cynical Jason on Jan 19, 2012 2:30 PM CST up reply actions  

You are hopefully right about the tanking factor.

for the Wolves to make it this year Love and Rubio would have to stay healthy and some other players would need to improve. So far the Defense is much better and that means players are buying into Adelman. Love keeps playing better defense than Aldridge for example.
These next several weeks look really tough when you consider we don’t seem to catch teams at the right time injury wise or in terms of being the second day of back to backs.

by mr.sorbet on Jan 19, 2012 3:46 PM CST up reply actions  

What happens to our pick is meaningless

We finally got a good team to cheer for. Kahn was right. He said 2 years ago it would take several years to show improvement and contend. We are definitely improving and contending. All I care about is us and Utah both making the playoffs. Let’s see how we do on this trip against two very good teams.

"I don't think I've ever seen a group that is as good at turning the ball over as this one." Rick Adelman

by Action on Jan 19, 2012 11:32 AM CST reply actions   1 recs

well what if it's either or

Either we make the playoffs or the jazz do.

by TO12 on Jan 19, 2012 4:24 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions  

Having not been in a number of years, you want to be in the playoffs. Period.

There is firstly validation and secondly a reason to hope and enjoy, regardless of the odds.
A home playoff game? Exciting. Winning a home playoff game? Euphoric.
worry about next year later.

Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"

by Tangerine dream on Jan 19, 2012 10:19 PM CST up reply actions  

So...

Clips get our pick no matter the place, correct?

And we only get Utah IF they are playoff bound correct?

by y2jayjk on Jan 19, 2012 12:02 PM CST reply actions  

Kind of

Utah’s pick to us [from Al Jefferson trade] = lottery protected

Our pick to the Clippers [from the lovely Marko Jaric Acquisition] has been protected to varying degrees since it was conveyed….all protections are now expired. However, it was conveyed to the Hornets in the CP3 trade. The Hornets get it, regardless of where it lands.

by PDGirl on Jan 19, 2012 12:11 PM CST up reply actions  

I'm sorry

I meant Hornets, it’s early!

Thanks for confirming!

by y2jayjk on Jan 19, 2012 12:17 PM CST up reply actions  

Need another poll option

Neither Wolves nor Jazz make the playoffs…

by DR_JPK on Jan 19, 2012 12:15 PM CST reply actions  

Certainly some of the scenarios you list are possible

but the west, especially the wolves division is just a monster and the wolves and jazz will have to play more games in their division (see OKC, DEN, & POR).

by DR_JPK on Jan 19, 2012 12:19 PM CST up reply actions  

yeah hands down the best division in the NBA now that

the wolves are a good last place (in the division ) team.

by mr.sorbet on Jan 19, 2012 3:49 PM CST up reply actions  

So the best thing we could do

is somehow get into the lottery via trade. Unfortunately I don’t think we have any pieces. I think Free Agents would want to play with Rubio though so that is now an option.

by y2jayjk on Jan 19, 2012 12:18 PM CST reply actions  

We should always play for the playoffs!

Call me crazy but one of the reasons our team plays so well is because we have many players who make clutch plays. Whenever we are down by double digits, we always seem to come back to make it a game at the end. Hopefully we have learned to win these close games, and if we do get into the playoffs, this team can make a lot of noise. If this team gels together by then, this team is deep enough and good enough to go deep in the playoffs with Webster, Lee, Miller, and Beasley back.

by andrew33 on Jan 19, 2012 12:26 PM CST reply actions  

Yeah, I don't know if that is the case.

I would say one of the reasons we don’t play well is because we have many players who don’t make clutch plays. We just won three games against three of the five worst teams in the NBA (two of which were at home and the other against a team missing its star). I would hold off making statemennts about how great a team this is. In fact, I’d say the last week has really shown just how bad the non-Rubio/Love guys are.

You can't...dust...for vomit.

by twinstalker on Jan 19, 2012 4:16 PM CST up reply actions  

I disagree

Love, Tolliver, Ellington, and Rubio in my eyes make clutch plays down the stretch, and that is why we are never out of a game. When the other team begins to grow their double digit lead, we make clutch offensive baskets, and clutch defensive posessions which allow us to catch up.

I would argue that we fall behind NOT because of our lack of clutch plays, but lack of concentration to detail. For example, we have alot of careless passes which lead to alot of fast break points.

by andrew33 on Jan 19, 2012 8:32 PM CST up reply actions  

Well, hopefully

We get plenty of chances to find out which of us is closer to being right. :-)

You can't...dust...for vomit.

by twinstalker on Jan 20, 2012 1:33 AM CST up reply actions  

Best case scenario.

If we get the 7th seed and Utah gets the 8th seed. Then our pick (from the Jazz) is better than the Hornets pick (from us).

by xraraavis on Jan 19, 2012 1:06 PM CST reply actions   1 recs

this would be such a sweet

middle finger to the whole basketball universe

http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub

by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 19, 2012 1:08 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

exactly. not outide the realm of possibility

but I think we’d have to bend the walls of reality to make it happen.

by monkeywolf on Jan 19, 2012 1:30 PM CST up reply actions  

And that's the main reason

I picked #1 and not #3, as brilliantly prescient as the third option probably is.

I predict that future drafts will be held at a NYC children’s hospital with all teams represented by dying children but that Kahn will up the ante by making the Wolves be the first team represented by a dying child holding a very cute puppy.

Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!

by TMiss on Jan 19, 2012 3:13 PM CST up reply actions  

A very cute puppy

that will be euthanized the next morning unless …

"Deserve ain't got nothin' to do with it."
-- W. Munney (1992) / Snoop (2008)

by ol' weird harold on Jan 19, 2012 4:44 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

Yes, it is the best case scenario

Now tell me which two of Dallas, Memphis, and Portland don’t make the playoffs. :-) Barring injury, I don’t think either team makes it. I’d love an even money bet on that if I could find it…except by winning it, I’d be cheering against two teams I want to make the playoffs.

You can't...dust...for vomit.

by twinstalker on Jan 19, 2012 4:20 PM CST up reply actions  

Utah has surprised me so far

I went to two games at Target Center last year one of which was against Utah after the Deron trade and Sloan’s departure. We absolutely killed them and I remember thinking that Utah was likely in for a rough couple years. They certainly seem to have adjusted nicely to the shakeup in spite of having a roster that’s almost as unbalanced as ours. I haven’t really looked into how they’re doing it, so I can’t really make an argument that they can’t sustain what they’re doing.

As much as I would like to see it happen, I don’t see many believable scenarios where the wolves make the playoffs. I don’t want to be too greedy, we only won ~20% of our games last year. I would be thrilled if we win ~40% of our games this year. That would represent a huge year-over-year improvement, but it’s not going to get you into the playoffs in the western conference.

by TenderWolf on Jan 19, 2012 2:33 PM CST reply actions  

Utah is winning

because they are playing Hard-nose defense, even Big Al is playing defense, before the big blow up between Williams and Sloan, they started out 27-13, so who knows, how good or bad they really are. 30-40 games in, we will see where everyone stands but right now its too early to tell.

by TheGreat on Jan 19, 2012 3:18 PM CST up reply actions  

AKA they're doing the same thing as us

A great PF or two + defense, we just happen to have Rubio while they have decent players at every other position. If you look at point differential, we’re at nearly the exact same spot as Utah, they’ve just been able to win a few more close games.

by zebano on Jan 19, 2012 3:38 PM CST up reply actions  

Looking at Utah's past schedule

They won their games against the Bucks and Cavs; we obviously did not. Those are games we should be winning, and if we had we’d have a winning record like Utah. They, like us have a couple victories over playoff caliber teams as well. Will be interesting to see how our match up against them goes.

by TenderWolf on Jan 19, 2012 4:22 PM CST up reply actions  

They just don't

have bad players like we have, I suspect had we took DMC instead of Johnson, we’d probably have won 9 or 10 games.

by TheGreat on Jan 19, 2012 4:31 PM CST up reply actions  

He's doing a little better this year, eh?

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Jan 19, 2012 4:40 PM CST up reply actions  

Meh

He looked decent last game but otherwise he has been crap.

by TheGreat on Jan 19, 2012 4:49 PM CST up reply actions  

really?

averaging 18 points and 13 rebounds and 1.5 blocks per 36 minutes. He played poorly against Pek but has had a couple of very good games. He could stand to be more efficient but he’s certainly had more than one decent game.

by zebano on Jan 19, 2012 8:08 PM CST up reply actions  

your guessing 10-4

Just by replacing Wes with DMC? Well excuse me if I have my reservations.

by TO12 on Jan 19, 2012 6:03 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions  

Don't forget

That Darko wouldn’t be here either, OK I admit I probably over reacted, but we would definitely be better with DMC.

by TheGreat on Jan 19, 2012 6:09 PM CST up reply actions  

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