Couple of Different Bad Trade Ideas
by VoodooMagic on Jan 20, 2012 12:57 PM CST
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Marc Stein: Been hearing reliable rumblings since trip to Reno for D-League Showcase that Jazz have made it known Devin Harris is available via trade
There are two trades I'm very interested in involving the Jazz, one maybe more realistic than the other.
More realistic one:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=84t5aws
Since you can't trade draft picks on NBA Trade Machine this is how I see this trade working out
Jazz: Ridnour and Beasley
Minnesota: Devin Harris and Jazz drop protection on our pick (as I have a feeling they might not make the playoffs)
Less realistic Jazz trade:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=737dhu7
Jazz get: Ridnour, Beasley, Randolph and their pick back
Wolves get: Harris and Favors
I like this trade cause we solve two problems with one swing (wing penetration and a starting 5). Jazz cut a bunch of salary, get a better point guard, get their pick back, and get an Anthony Randolph flier. They are having a tough time playing Favors, Kanter, Milsap, and Jefferson, while clearly their preference would be to move Jefferson or Milsap (probably Jefferson) that is a lot easier said than done with their contracts.
Raptors Bad Trade Idea:
this is an updated take on a trade I did a few weeks back involving the Wolves getting Derozan. I don't think he's amazing, but he is a starting quality 2 that is probably gettable. I went on Raptors HQ to check in on the status of DD and the consensus there seemed to be if they could get a starting 3 they would be willing to move DD.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7d3ugb4
Raptors: Marvin Williams, Wes Johnson and Utah draft pick. They get depth at the 3, they move Amir Johnoson's contract, which isn't bad now, but once JoVal comes over and they have Joval, Bargs, Ed Davis, Johnson and Klezia vying for playingtime the front court could get crowded.
Hawks: Beasley, Randolph, Ridnour. They get out of over 8 million dollars of salary, plus they get a massive upgrade at back up point guard on the supreme cheap in Ridnour.Plus they get depth at the 4 for the rest of the season while Horford is out.
Minnesota: Amir Johnson, Demar Derozan, Kirk Hinrich. Wolves get an actual 2 guard for once, and they get Amir Johnson who is, yes another 4, but he's got the wingspan and defensive ability to play the 4 with Love as the 5 in a post duo type tandem. And they get a rental in Hinrich.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=88ot6w9
Wolves ship out Beasley and Randolph and get Gerald Henderson and Ty Thomas
Thomas is having a woefully inefficient season right now, but is a career +.1/WS48 and +15 PER post player. He's making a lot of money on a long contract, which would be the appeal from the Bobcats in this trade I think. Maybe we toss in a protected pick, but if Thomas can return to his normal form he's produced like for years he would be a super solid post player to team with Love and Henderson would help at 2.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=88d8b3y
I'd add any package of picks to make this happen....but with no real back up pg's and them just maxing out Durant and Westbrook there is a small chance this is possible. Small chance. And I would be happy.
Anyone think there is a trade in here that is both plausible and helpful? Have a favorite, have a least favorite?
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I don't know why it didn't direct link to the trade machine stuff
but if you just copy and paste it works
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Harden
I agree, any scenario where we keep our core guys and get Harden is a win. He would bring a lot of scoring power to our back court and he would be an asset late in games as a clutch shooter and by drawing contact and getting to the stripe. Plus, think of how awesome we would be with a Unicorn, Pek’s tattoo, and the Beard all on the court together. I am salivating.
The beard and Rubio would run teams out of the ground
at all costs sans Love and Rubio (and hell if Love doesn’t sign an extension….Ibaka/Harden/Sefalosha and some picks wouldn’t be awful compensation)
But good lord could you imagine Harden and Rubio with Love setting 50 picks again….we would murder teams
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
*a game* not again
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
A few comments.
I don’t see any way OKC gives us Harden, but I’m ALL for that one.
Why do we want Devin Harris?
I still don’t think Toronto (and maybe ATL) do that deal. I really don;t see the benefits – especially for TOR.
I’d do the CHA trade.
I did preface these as Bad Trade Ideas ;)
I was thinking Harris would give us the slasher we clearly need. He and Rubio are both big enough (both at least 6’3 I think) to play together.
After I posted this the less interested I was in the Harris plus drop protection trade…..if there was a way my Harris/Favors trade was legit I think that would be an extremely good trade to make.
OKC…Just me Harden loving…
I responded to the Raptors on in the other thread. in short: all teams (imo) come out on top, Raps get the best player in the trade, Hawks get depth and cap relief, Wolves get two good players for one basically. The only way the trade isn’t fair is if DD becomes a stud, but Williams is young enough and actually producing where I’d think the chance of him becoming a stud is equal to DD.
Cha trade seems pretty likely don’t it? Not an earth shatterer…but it would help without giving up anything really.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Harris has shown in the past he can get to the line 5-6 times,
but he can’t shoot- especially from deep. And while he’s not tiny, he’s really not big. He was 6’1 without shoes and 170 pounds at the combine. So Ricky is going to have to guard SGs when they play together. Plus to get those 5-6 FTAs, Harris has been a very high usage guy.
I want nothing to do with him.
Devin Harris can't shoot
Ridnour can. I wouldn’t swap Ridnour for Harris (sounds strange to write).
CHA trade does sound the most appealing. Even though Henderson doesn’t get to the rim very well, he has a pretty polished mid-range game and would solidify the 2 spot.
by Stabby Stabby on Jan 20, 2012 1:44 PM CST up reply actions
He'd at least give us
a competent level player at a position of weakness. He might not be the answer…but he’d help without giving up anything of value.
Ty Thomas might be nice too
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Ridnour has value though
Rubio is the far superior PG, but I would argue that Ridnour is the best thing we have going at the SG position. Certainly helps that he shoots the 3pt very well (44% last year). My argument is that Ridnour plays the SG position better than Harris.
by Stabby Stabby on Jan 20, 2012 1:59 PM CST up reply actions
I meant the CHA trade
my b
my thing with Harris is he would give us a guy who is a good slasher from the wing which we don’t have and need. and by absorbing his contract hopefully we can get a Favors as well. Ridnour would be the better player and cheaper but that would be why Favors would be involved (which may make the trade obsolete anyways)
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
"my thing with Harris is he would give us a guy who is a good slasher from the wing which we don’t have and need"
Look at his usage rates. Would 5 FTAs a game be worth keeping the ball out of Rubio’s hands so much? And dude can’t shoot. Or defend.
it seems as though he is having a much worse year than usual
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/harride01.html
seems like he’s consistently over 15 PER. He’s about split on years with ws/48 over .1 most when he was with Dallas (not surprisingly he goes to NJ and his efficiency goes down)
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Not a big fan of PER for guys like Harris
It doesn’t ding them for taking (and missing) a lot of shots.
I would give up anyone outside of Rubio and Love for Harden.
Problem I see it is with them trading Harden to us is they know how much it improves us right away so they might want to trade him to someone else in the future. Probably someone in the East. But man I want that guy in a Muskie……I mean T-Wolves Jersey soon.
by Doug West Domination!!! on Jan 20, 2012 3:08 PM CST reply actions
Go Muskie's
I would literally trade everything we have and draft picks and then fill the rest of our roster out with d leaguers
we would be the 3rd best team, long-term in the West with a bullet….unless Dallas gets D12 and DWill
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
everything but Rubio and Love
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
DWill for Harden, with various filler, would be worth thinking about
It gives OK a wowser young PF, and gives us the 2 we need.
It is almost an equal trade, but we could toss in Wes, or picks, or other stuff. This is an asymmetrical trade, the kind that Kahn is good at finding unlikely combos.
OK faces a problem if they keep Westbrook, so maybe they would like the PF they seek in DeRok, on a rookie contract. They make him into a star, and either keep him or trade him later. Good long term planning.
But they may rather trade Westbrook, and I’m not sure he has the makeup to be a wolf on a sharing team. And he may not want to be a SG on a Rubio led team. So I hope that the OK brain trust decides that Harden must go.
Other trades
Don’t want Devin Harris. He is highly overpaid.
Toronto doesn’t give up Derozen at all unless someone blows them out of the water. So thats out.
I would take the Charlotte trade. Beasley is gone next year IMO, not sure about Randolph he seemed to figure it out and now he is back to his old ways.
And like I said anything for Harden except Love and Rubio. But they are in no rush to do that yet.
by Doug West Domination!!! on Jan 20, 2012 3:12 PM CST reply actions
if we could get Favors
would you take Harris as the salary dump for the Jazz?
assuming that is a deal
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
hmmm....fair enough
that’s a legit take. don’t completely agree, but I hear you.
I wonder what Favors availability is though….I’d be curious if this trade would have legs to it…take Harris contract give up Luke and cap relief and take Favors
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
I find the Jazz front court situation interesting
It would seem like one of them has to go. There just aren’t enough minutes for Big Al, Millsap, Favors, and Kanter. Not to mention the dollars needed to commit to just 2 positions.
Millsap is playing the best, and is the only one that put the ball on the floor. So he seems the likeliest to stay.
So far Kanter has been the odd man out, in terms of minutes, but I’m sure they still highly value his potential. And his minutes are gradually increasing (at the expense of Favors).
From a cohesion standpoint, I’m sure they want to keep Favors. Since he’s the most different from the other 3, in terms of defense and athleticism. But his offense has been a mess, he can’t shoot FTs, and turns it over too much.
Big Al appears to be the odd man out, but we already witnessed that he’s not a guy that going to get you much in return.
Some of us thought the Love/Big Al debate was a tough call. But this is really a conundrum. To make matters more complicated, they are winning games and can’t really afford to dump Big Al for picks.
I would like to take a stab at Favors
But I feel the RIdnour/Rubio combo works great right now. I’m not confident in Harris although he only has 2 years left on his deal and likely could be traded for a sack of potatoes so maybe its worth it.
But the way Favors has been playing the year and a half he’s been in the league the pick might have more value than he does.
by Doug West Domination!!! on Jan 21, 2012 1:18 AM CST up reply actions
It's also fair to speculate on McGee's availability
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7232bwr
we take Lewis contract off the books for them, trade them a bunch of junk…most of it expiring/team options and we get Lewis and McGee
I think Lewis contract is only partially guaranteed next season…but that still doesn’t mean Washington wants to pay that money.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Lewis is guaranteed a minimum of 10M next year,
that could go as high as 17M depending on incentives (no idea what they are).
My question is will Taylor pay Lewis’ deal next year, Love’s max and give 11M or so to resign McGee?
Idk about TayTay
but would you?
I would. Seems like a fair price to pay (trade nothing to get a guy like McGee and a starter in Rashard) to upgrade the talent. Then focus on trading Williams for a 2 (maybe using Rashard and Williams as a salary dump/young talent tandem trade) maybe over the summer (like see if Hornets wanna do a sign and trade with Gordon)
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Ya but, this gets us a great team and insupportable salary obligations
We gotta look at role players or rookie contracts, not guys in prime earning years, like McGee and Rashard and Gordon.
Harden
You need to let that dream die…
by Hold_Steady on Jan 20, 2012 3:58 PM CST reply actions 4 recs
I remain skeptical
The thunder will be able to pay him less than what he’s worth and not play him what he should be getting and keep him.
Maybe he such a professional he’ll take both a reduced role and salary to stay..but considering he can win, get paid and play on all but three teams in the NBA I think there is a price OKC would take for him
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 20, 2012 5:34 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
ok
there’s still no reason that the Thunder would trade him at this point, even if he’s not part of their long term plans. (which he is)
I think Ibaka
will be available (like the celtics and heat, you pay 3 guys big money and avoid committing big money to replaceable guys like Jeff Green and Ibaka), but he’s a straight up 4, which we’ve got plenty of.
Problem is
Harden could get a max deal on the open market. Can the thunder give him that much with Perkins, Durant and Westbrook all making good coin
Also he could start for teams like Dallas San Antonio chicago or Minnesota and still be on a contending team, playing a bigger role and make more money
I would be very shocked if both harden and Westbrook were long term thunder. My money has one of them going at some point.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 20, 2012 6:03 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
I still don't understand all the Westbrook hate/trade hypos
The guy is an animal and the team is good with him running the point. His driving ability is insane, as is his defense when he wants it to be. All the talk out of the locker room players say everything is fine.
All that chatter seems to me to be amplified by the media and others, because OKC seems too perfect.
If I were them
That is absolutely the move I would make. Westbrook and Perkins for D12 and reddick
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 20, 2012 5:58 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
I don't think the numbers would work.
But if they do, I think that OKC does it in a second and they don’t even worry about Howard leaving after the season. Probably because he wouldn’t knowing that he can win several championships there.
I don't know I think they trade him at the end of the year
Not because they want to but because they might have to. Eventually he’s going to want to start and get paid. Dude could easily be an all star if he was starting and he knows that.
by Doug West Domination!!! on Jan 21, 2012 1:23 AM CST up reply actions
That my thought
Not that we have what it takes to get him (unless we can properly show case Williams)
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 21, 2012 7:43 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Harden
would be great but I believe Ellington will grow up to be as good of a player.
He better hurry.
Right now he’s nowhere near as good as Harden AND he’s 2 years older.
I appreciate your unrealistic optimism sir.
by Tollysnipes on Jan 20, 2012 5:55 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
You know it's out there
When I can’t even stomach the take
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 20, 2012 6:06 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
I like that Bobcats trade, and it seems somewhat feasible...
Although, if Barea can get healthy, and Ridnour/Ellington can continue their production, then SG might not be as big of a hole as it was at the beginning of the season.
The artist formally known as Shane Heal, but FORMERLY known as Blakeley
It would still be nice
To have a normal sized SG that is also fairly solid
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 20, 2012 11:06 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
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