Two not particularly new trade ideas & an amnesty note (revised)
by stelvis10 on Jan 23, 2012 10:03 PM CST
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PrintI'm not sure if these have already been suggested, but curious what people's thoughts would be to these two trades done in combination to try to solidify the current and future shooting guard spots.
Minnesota trades Michael Beasley and Brad Miller to Boston Celtics for Ray Allen. Minnesota gets a quality shooting guard for at least the rest of the season and the highly publicized veteran leadership on the team. I think I saw an article linked on here saying Beasley might be the best option Boston can get at this point. At worst, they're out the same salary they already are with nothing on the hook for next season since Miller's salary is a team option for next year.
Minnesota trades Wayne Ellington *and Utah's lottery-protected pick* to Utah for *only* Alec Burks. Hopefully this would be a long term option at shooting guard to take over as the starter when Allen leaves (likely next season, but you never know if Allen would want to stay at a reduced price).
What do you think? Do these trades hypothetically work for all teams involved? If not, for whom do the trades not work?
Random side note: If I remember correctly, the amnesty clause is only available for players who were on the team when the new CBA was completed. Is this correct? If it is, will the Timberwolves even use it? The only players with guaranteed money past next year are JJ Barea and Luke Ridnour. Everybody else is under $5.2 million, and seems to have at least marginal value (so could be traded) or used as expiring money for others.
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Clarification
By reduced price for Allen, I meant from his current contract – not reduced compared to other offers he may receive.
If the Wolves can get Alec Burks I am all for it
I don’t know that BTP Wayne gets the job done.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7dpkkvx
this might work as the Jazz are ultra thin at point and Ridnour might even start for them over Harris
This would be deal to look into.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Favors and Burks for Luke and Miller?
You must have some AMAZING pictures of Utah’s owner in a VERY compromising position…
they aren't playing either of them though
Idk, Ridnour would start for them
Are they about winning now? If so this is a deal they might listen to….Also I’d give them their pick back
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 23, 2012 11:09 PM CST up reply actions
I'm under the impression
Most of the CH community would trade 2 of our “upside” guys for 1 starter…IDK if the Jazz feel the same way.
It’s gonna be tough to move both Jefferson and Milsap (not to mention they are both playing very well and part of the reason they are doing so well) so my guess would be they are gonna have to choose between Favors or Kanter…and early returns appear to be Kanter.
Burks never plays.
Ridnour, cap cut Miller, and their first round pick back…..maybe we give them the Memphis pick too idk if we’d even have to do that….but they get a starter for a team hoping to make the playoffs….seems semi-fair from a Wolves homer at least
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 23, 2012 11:13 PM CST up reply actions
Favors and Burks have pretty high value...
hell, Favors was the center-piece of the Derron Williams trade. This proposal would get you laughed out of the room.
"Burks never plays."
He’s played 175 minutes. So they either think he’s a total bust, or just not ready yet. I’d lean towards the latter.
But seriously, Luke and Miller for Favors and Burks is like us trading Williams for Dorell Wright…
From who?
who has the pg to burn?
Nuggets? Miller> Ridnour? Maybe.
there are a lot of good pg’s in the NBA…But it’s not like every team has a good one to burn.
I’m also not a Gm, I don’t know what the Jazz are doing, but it appears Favors and Burks don’t really play that much and they have a chance to make the playoffs. I would take advantage of our pg to burn and see what they would want for those two in a deal starting with Ridnour.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
As you like to say about Williams,
both Burks and Favors are 20 years old. To trade them for a borderline starting PG would be suicidal for management.
And while Utah may be competing for a late playoff seed, they are not “a Luke Ridnour away” from doing any damage.
To put it another way:
Williams hasn’t played that much more than Favors this year, would you trade Williams and say, Malcolm Lee for Luke Ridnour, Brad Miller and an out of lottery 1st?
well no
cause we don’t need a pg
would you trade Williams for Kevin Martin is probably the better trade comp.
If it’s suicidal management for the Jazz to trade Favors or Burks, then why are we so loosely throwing around the idea of trading Williams?
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Its not suicidal to trade Favors or Burks.
Its suicidal to trade them for a 31 year-old back-up PG.
And Williams for Martin isn’t a better comp because Martin is actually a very good starting player with an elite skill. Ridnour is a good shooting back-up PG.
The better comp might be would you trade Williams (a struggling, but talented rookie) for Anthony Morrow (a solid back-up player with 1 real skill)? I wouldn’t.
So you think Morrow=Ridnour?
I think i win this round buddy
Luke Ridnour, 30 years old .137 WS/48 1.8 WS, 15. PER oRTG 114, Drtg 105
Kevin Martin 29 Years old .144 ws/48, 1.6 WS, 17 PER Ortg 117 Drtg 111
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/martike02.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/ridnolu01.html
Kevin Martin has had a better career, but statistically this season they are actually about as effective as each other.
Maybe Martin is having a bad year…or maybe he is on the downside of his career as he his closing in on 30 and that is a big reason I don’t want him for Williams
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Martin is having a mostly slower start, but
I still say its apples and oranges. Martin does score at an elite rate. He gets to the line as much as anyone in the NBA. Luke is a good shooter, but that’s really what he brings. Morrow is a better shooter, so even if Luke is a bit better all around (all both suck at defense), its probably close value-wise.
Also the drop off from Martin to our next SG is MASSIVE compared to the drop between Harris and Ridnour.
I would just never trade Williams for Martin
I thought I read Martin was already 29, but that’s my bad. Like I said, maybe he’s having a slow start….or maybe he’s slowing down. His body is not made to take a bunch of punishment, I get that shooters never really die, but I look at Ray Allen’s physic/conditioning routing and then I look at how thin Martin is and how nonathletic he was to begin with and I can’t help but wonder how much longer he’s going to be able to take it to the hole.
He’s been a very flawed but good player for his career and may continue to be, but I think trading Williams for him would be selling awfully low.
For the record if I were running the Jazz I would not do the deal I suggested.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 25, 2012 11:06 AM CST up reply actions
routine not routing
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 25, 2012 11:07 AM CST up reply actions
I wouldn't trade Williams for Martin either - and I want to trade Williams.
I just think Martin is on a different level than Ridnour as a player.
I would trade Williams for Burks and Favors.
You also seem to have added a year to Martin's age, but not Luke's.
Martin turns 29 in 7 days.
Luke turns 31 19 days.
Would Utah do that?
Seems like selling extremely low on two high draft picks for basically a marginal starting point guard. If that’s the trade, why not drop Favors & Miller to just make it Burks for Ridnour (and something like their pick back, since otherwise it seems to favor Minnesota)?
There is no way
Utah gives us either Burks or a lottery protected pick for Wayne.
No, we would give them their own lottery-protected pick back in addition to Wayne.
Crap. Just noticed I wrote that incorrectly.
Oh. That's a bit better.
But I still doubt Utah is ready to give up the #12 pick after less than 200 minutes.
Especially for a non-lottery pick and a guy you can find in the D-League.
Allen makes little sense for our team, if we are going to trade with Boston..
Then we trade for The Truth.
disagree
Allen is the only thing we could from Boston that does make sense. The truth about The Truth is he’s old and slow. Allen might be old, but he is in top physical condition and can/will shoot all those Rubio passes to the weak side…and make more than 36% of them.
Reason is the first victim of strong emotion.
I stopped at Boston
With Jeff Green out for the season Ray Allen isn’t going anywhere
by midlife crisis on Jan 24, 2012 12:17 AM CST reply actions
Would love Allen on this team
Beasley honestly has negative trade value right now. I think teams would pay to keep him off than the opposite. Ainge would ask for Derrick Williams in any move.
For the loser now
Will be later to win
The Wolves will not have a championship window
without another major piece. We can’t just tank for draft picks anymore. We need to win games. Allen would help tremendously.
For the loser now
Will be later to win
I think both Boston and Utah say no
voted Utah because I think it’s farm more likely that Allen is moved this year than Burks is.
Utah's needs to be adjusted...
We can’t even begin talking about Favors and Burks for any package that doesn’t include DWill.
However, they want to shed D. Harris…
So maybe something like:
D. Harris
Favors or Burks
for
Peckovic or Miller (whomever they prefer)
Their 1st back
Ridnour
Wes Johnson
by Cris Carter is a Muppet on Jan 25, 2012 10:08 PM CST reply actions
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