23 year old superstars should be held for as little time as possible
All roses are flowers.
Some flowers fade quickly.
Therefore, some roses fade quickly.
If this little bit sounds like your bag, then I bet you just loooove the fact that the 23 year old Kevin Love was signed to an extension with a buyout after the 3rd year.
If that sounds kind of iffy, then congratulations, you are a functional human being.
Let's get the contract stuff out of the way first. The 5th year is ego BS. Kevin Love is one of the best 3 players in the 08 draft and he has every right to be paid as such. Instead of getting the contract that will forever be known as his college roomie's deal (a'la The Westbrook), Love gets the Dwight Howard 3rd year ETO. It's nothing to turn one's nose up at, but it's needlessly antagonistic.
Getting Love to stick around for another 3 years is fantastic...not giving him 5 years is insane. What will the 5th year be used for? The guy who just completed his 18th game in the league? The incentive that can be wiped out with the differences in state tax rates? Ish. (Sloppy writing alert/edit: the incentive I meant to tie the state taxes bit to is the 7.5% vs. 4.5% yearly escalation with Bird rights. The 5th year bit is "being saved" for...well, nobody knows for sure yet except the best GM in the league, Sam Presti.)
Listening to both national and local radio today the one "silver lining" take from the 3 year deal seems to be that the 3 year potential opt-out will somehow incentivize the Wolves to make a better attempt to win in the next 3 years. This is nonsense. Just think about how many people need to have car repairs right now. Either you can or you can't. The Wolves can currently afford to pay their superstar superstar money. In 3 or 4 or 5 years they may not. Moral incentives are always more promising as abstract ideas than real world situations. The Wolves should always be striving for wins. Their clock should always be ticking. A 3 or 5 year Love deal should mean the same damn thing: get smart people to do smart things...the end. The 5th year isn't being saved for Rubio, Love will stay no matter what deal he gets as long as there are competent people here, yada, yada, yada.
Anywho....the Wolves won tonight. I wish I could say more about the win but I was at the HS orientation for my oldest daughter's swim team. I feel really old right now. I have a daughter who is about to enter HS. Congrats, Love. Good job on your extension. I'm about to let my baby girl go into a building full of boys.
Crap.
Anywho...while I was paying more attention to stroke camps and meet duties, I'm hoping someone actually caught the game.
A review would be greatly appreciated.
Until later.
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Yep.
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by HumdingerTV on Jan 25, 2012 10:51 PM CST via mobile reply actions
Off-topic, but man Sacramento is terrible.
They’re losing 86-58 to Denver, and I feel like every time I look at the box scores they’re getting just shit-pounded.
And to think early last season I would’ve gladly switched rosters with them.
And TOR got a nice win in Utah... still not sure how we want them to finish...
…but I think if they just barely skate into the playoffs it will maximize our pick of theirs.
We want them to win, win, win, baby.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
8th seed all the way!
Will the Real Thor Please Stand Up ... ?
by the Real Thor on Jan 26, 2012 12:44 AM CST up reply actions
We are worse than a D-League team right now
To keep my sanity, I’ve been watching wolves games to see the PG we passed on and the Coach we fired. It looks like our loss is your gain.
by SharkKings49 on Jan 26, 2012 10:44 AM CST up reply actions
ouch
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 10:54 AM CST up reply actions
Thats the nice way of saying it after we allowed 92 points in the paint in 1 game
by SharkKings49 on Jan 26, 2012 11:45 AM CST up reply actions
My buddy from El Dorado Hills
had a running commentary via facebook last night on points in the paint in that game. He has branded his team as unwatchable. From what I’ve seen I’d have to agree. Sorry.
Last night was another drop in the well for the Kings.
This team, or more accurately Tyreke Evans and DeMarcus Cousins, are atrocious night in night out with their play. It’s disgusting to think 2 guys with that kind of talent are puke worthy, but they very much are.
Cousins blinds people with his rebounding numbers, but if you watch the game you will realize that the Kings are one of the 5 worst rebounding teams with one of the “5 best” rebounders on the team. This isn’t a team like the Wolves that is inept and with no other players who can rebound or something like Love’s last few years. You will also realize that Cousins board numbers while sometimes great are not really in the grand scheme that big of a deal when in 39 minutes he grabs 13 boards and in 23 minutes grabs 13 boards. Both are problematic on every level.
This is a team that has two young “cornerstones” that don’t give a shit about committing to a real gameplan on a night in night out basis on what’s going to happen. Which is very much the antithesis of Kevin Love and Ricky Rubio right now. (And even Love in past years with little help most nights.)
As bad as the Wolves were in recent years (they were unwatchable), the Kings are that team this year. I would suggest flipping the channel unless you have an interest in morbidly frightened/amused by the worst AAU basketball the NBA game has ever seen.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
by pookeyguru on Jan 26, 2012 7:22 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
So Tyreke Evans and DM Cousins < Love and Rubio
Kudos to McHale and Kahn.
Now, for the triumvirate!!!
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 7:31 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, I've said it before
but there aren’t two young, highly talented players in the NBA I’d less like to build a team around than Tyreke and DeMarcus.
I can't say how many times I've had to tell myself..
…you’re a Kings fan and they are talented. You are a Kings fan and they are talented. Because nothing has happened that really couldn’t be anticipated in advance of either being drafted.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
As a bonus
Johnny Flynn’s option was not picked up so you can bid on his services for next year.
I'm going to pretend you said no such thing.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
They did win at San Antonio last week
It’s a weird team that way.
The good news is hopeful doesn't mean dumb. The bad news is cynical doesn't mean smart. -- Sarah Silverman
by pagingstanleyroberts on Jan 26, 2012 12:45 PM CST up reply actions
completely mysterious to me why they thought this was better than 5 years
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 25, 2012 10:54 PM CST reply actions
I think it makes sense
Its all about flexibility for player and team. This is the new CBA at work – protection from bad decisions at the cost of keeping good decisions around for a long time.
by Dr. Wolfenstein on Jan 26, 2012 6:46 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
There is no more flexibility with 5 than 3
If they extend him, they still pay the 7.5% escalator. They now have him for 6 years with his 5 year extension starting at 29 instead of 28. I really do not get the flexibility bit. It sounds great, but how exactly are they more flexible? What good decisions have you seen from this franchise in the past and are waiting to see in the future to surround Love? I couldn’t disagree more that this is the new CBA at work. That would have been the 5 year incentive deal. This is just weird.
They will be negotiating with Love and Ricky at the same time.
The Wolves will be able to ask them to make the necessary to stay together and go for a championship, as Miami did with the three amigos, who are earning around Love´s new contract money.
Kahn: “Ricky, do you want to play with Love? Love, do you want to play with Ricky? Show me the way!”
I know that sounds great
But why is that an incentive? Both agents and both players will want the most money. Either they’re winning by then or they’re not.
Kahn: Ricky, do you want to play with Love on a (insert wins here) team? Love, do you want to play with Ricky on a (insert wins here) team?
That’s the question. They’ve just moved the date where this question gets asked up 2 years. This question gets asked all the time. They probably thought about it last night when Ricky hit the 46 minute mark. They’re a Bill Withers song right now. I’m sure they think about this a lot and don’t need matching contract dates to make that point hit home.
It is an incentive for Love if Rubio becomes the first pass PG lovable teammate who can make Love much better.
They won´t be able to move together to any other team.
Again
I know this sounds great as a fan, but as an employee wanting to make as much as he can in a place he wants to be, I think it’s way down on the wish list. Love is “much better” with or without Rubio, at least to the extent that a bunch of other teams will pay him as such.
It’s cute to watch the budding bromance but thinking that they’re going to be Troy and Abed in a tent fort for the next 2 contracts is a bit iffy.
I really hope they do...
…and I think at one time in the not-so-distant past this would have worked. Right now, and with Love and Rubio being who they are, I think winning and getting as much as possible while winning is the bit. I think these guys are in such a different stratosphere in terms of income, exposure, talent, etc that it’s really hard to wrap our heads around what should be good motives on, say, $50k at a decent job. I completely hear what you’re saying and I wish it could work out that way. I just don’t think it will.
WAIT A SECOND...
They’re NOT going to be Troy and Abed in a tent fort for the next 2 contracts?!
Rubio would be Abed in this scenario, yes?
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I see the crystal rain drops fall and the beauty of all when the sun comes shining through…to make those rainbows in my mind when I think of you sometime…I wanna spend some time with you…just the two of us…we can make it if we try….sets lighter on fire…….Building the castles in the sky…just the two of us you & I…..
We look for love no time for tears….wasting water all that is…and it don’t make no flowers grow..good things might come to those who wait…not for those who wait too late…we gotta go for all we know…..
Oh you’re talking about David Kahn and the ineptitude in not signing Love to the most obvious deal of all time. I got confused with brilliance for sarcasm. My bad.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
That should read Wolves ownership/Kahn^
Kahn alone shouldn’t be held accountable for this failure.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Or, you know, they could both just leave.
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:22 PM CST up reply actions
Not together.
The Wolves will be able to offer Ricky a much better contract than abybody else in the league.
What should have been a positive day of stories about the T-Wolves and the great young duo they are building upon...
…instead turned into sarcastic tweets from Bill Simmons and an SI story about how hopefully the “awkwardness will wear off in time” from this contract.
A short list of reasons this was a terrible idea (I’m sure there are more):
- crapped all over the positive story that could have gone out today
- continues to make Kahn and Taylor look cheap and just plain dumb in negotiations
- unsettles and upsets the best player on the team
- turns the best player away from really investing in the team and the city for 5 years into thinking about how in 3 years he can always opt out
- guarantees that Love’s 2nd and 3rd years on the deal will be filled with DRAMA and speculation and be unsettling to him, the rest of the club and potential free agent signings, even if he re-ups with the Wolves
- makes Rubio less secure that Love will be here long-term
- makes Adelman less secure that Love will be here long-term
- sets the stage so that in 3 years Rubio, Love and Adelman can all leave together or close together
- and finally…LeBron FREAKING LEFT after a 3 year contract following his rookie contract! So this deal continues to make the recent lockout and new CBA, which was supposedly about fiscal restraint and small and medium markets teams being able to compete, look absolutely ridiculous. Being able to sign one of the top 10 players in the game, who is just about to enter his prime to a max contract (which is below his market value) for 2 more years IS the financial advantage that small/medium market teams need.
I realize this has a chance to all work out just fine and Love and Rubio re-up and we become western conference powers in 2-3 years. But it is needlessly risky and smacks of people who have an EQ and IQ in the mid-double digits. But I will not hang this on Kahn entirely. Taylor had to have a hand in this and he should bear the major blame. He also hired Kahn. The real responsibility is Taylor’s, not Kahn’s.
by Django Z on Jan 26, 2012 1:14 AM CST up reply actions 10 recs
great post
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 1:18 AM CST up reply actions
Dwight is about to leave after his 3rd year on a 2nd contract
Think about that. The Orlando Magic with Dwight Howard have been farther than any Wolves team in franchise history (the Finals) and they surrounded him with better players than are around Rubio and Love at pretty much every step of the way. He plays in an income tax free state with nice weather and he’s going to leave them.
Superstar production: Lock it up when you can for as long as you can and worry about the rest later.
Is it possible
Kahn wanted that 5-year contract for DH? (even if it isn’t, let me dream)
Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!
Nope
The 5 year bit is for extensions, not new deals (DH would be a new deal, as he’s about to be a UFA). This is an incentive for teams to offer a bit extra to awesome players being extended on their rookie deals. You know, players like Kevin Love. The “carrots” here are the extra year and…well, that’s pretty much it. It doesn’t even really make much sense.
Let’s say the Wolves end up extending or giving Love a new 5 year deal at the end of the 3 years. If the NBA makes more money in years 4 and 5, the max money goes up. They could end up paying more on the last 2 years than had they simply signed him for 5. Moneywise, and security wise, this is kind of crazy. You don’t play around with this type of production. It is rare. You pay for it and you lock it up for as long as you can. Now, the Wolves have a situation where Love can test the free market in 3 years with the possibility of the NBA’s BRI being higher and other teams being able to offer him what will be more than….well, nothing about not giving him 5 makes sense.
kind of confusing
they could end up paying more if they sign him to a new deal/extension after 3 years if the bri goes up.
also, the “hometown discount” is 7.5% contract escalation with Bird rights as opposed to 4.5 without. state taxes can take care of that.
Then all I can figure
is that Taylor’s scared of injuries, although it’s hard for me to see how we get championship rings without KLove
Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!
I think it is more:
Taylor is a small market owner who made a fuss during the lockout about uppity players forcing their way to other teams and about how there was no competitive balance in the league. He also remembers the meme of “KG’s contract made it hard to win” and, by golly, he’s not going to let that happen again. The owners are in charge, here!!! …is pretty much what I think his basketball philosophy boils down to at this point.
Who is doing the thinking here?
Like how can they justify that logic, if it exists…
Players are forcing their way to other teams… lets give a contract that lends all leverage to the player? sure!
A mega-millionaire has to be smarter than that right?
(I'm just extrapolating that part from his stance during the lockout)
I think it is a part of making the players make harder decisions on shorter time scales.
Isn't there a difference in rookie contract max (20%?) too?
…vs ‘2nd contract max (25%)’?
.. or is that just dictated by years in the league… so year 5 on rookie max contract would be the same as year 2 in the opt out/re-up ‘2nd max contract’ scenario..?
Wouldn't doubt this is it, Taylor has not shown he is a good basketball mind during his tenure at all
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:25 PM CST up reply actions
But it still counts against the cap
Look, I get that we want Love here as long as possible. But this is the NBA. A 5 year deal doesn’t insure that he won’t demand a trade in 2 years if he doesn’t like how things are going (see Vince Carter as an example). It also doesn’t guarantee that he doesn’t get hurt or he doesn’t do something stupid off the court (see Gilbert Arenas). In local sports terms, what happens if AP is never the same? What happens if Mauer never touches his MVP #s again? Just cause Love is a good guy and works hard doesn’t mean that it will always work out in the end.
While I don’t like the deal and think it’s the wrong decision, to make it sound like there is no way a rational person could make this decision isn’t true. And to make it seem like Taylor is trying to teach someone a lesson or correct past mistakes is speculation.
I agree there will be more uncertainty surrounding what will happen but pretending like the same thing couldn’t happen if we signed Love for 2 more years isn’t true. No one knows what is going to happen. There is greater risk that Love leaves sooner, but there is also less risk if something bad happens. It’s business, it stinks, but it isn’t “crazy” or “irrational”.
by Sterno on Jan 26, 2012 9:23 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
The new CBA has an app for that
Per Larry Coon:
• 2011 CBA: One year, starting at the lesser of half the replaced player’s salary or the non-taxpayer midlevel exception.
• Who benefits? This exception provides teams with the ability to sign an emergency replacement for an injured player. Under the previous CBA, the player could be signed to a five-year contract, meaning a permanent replacement could be obtained. This also opened the door to situations where the injured player returned to the team while his replacement was still on the roster. By reducing to one year in the new CBA, this exception will more closely match its intent — to provide a short-term emergency replacement for an injured player. Teams will now have to fend for themselves if the player’s injury keeps him out for more than a year.
Agreed but that is short term
Look, we’re all dealing in hypothetical situations now in the future. No one knows what will happen.
If Love is great for 2 years and demands a trade midway through the 3rd year because he wants to leave, then we the fans are screwed but it still doesn’t make it the wrong decision now. In hindsight yes, but that is always 20/20.
I don’t have a problem with people not liking the deal. But simply stating that there is no way this could be smart isn’t true. I think they thought through all the options and made a decision. Some of the irrational stuff (“show the player who’s boss”) may have factored into it but when we’re talking about $60 million, I think generally these get done when everybody is the LEAST UNHAPPY (not the MOST HAPPY) and you get to an agreement that works for both sides. Note that “the fans” are not considered here. Love gets some real tangible benefits with the option. The Wolves think they have lower risk with a shorter contract, and that they will have a decent shot of resigning Love. We will see.
I think it is massively irrational
How much more evidence do people need that handing superstar production an ETO after their 3rd year is a recipe for saying goodbye? Cleveland and Orlando went to the Finals. They had awesome players. The Wolves have Darko, Luke, and Wes Johnson starting next to Love and Rubio. This will work out smashingly.
It takes hard work to not have a rookie for at least 8 years.
(As for the speculation bit, yeah…the show the player who’s boss is pure speculation but I’m pretty confident about the KG part of it. Very, very confident.)
technically speaking
DWade stayed…and he had to recruit 2 of the 3.
We will already have 2 of the 3.
This has all the makings of heavy drama down the road, and not guaranteed to be bad.
the elephant in the room in my opinion is Adelman’s age, how long can this guy be on the sidelines?
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by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 9:45 AM CST up reply actions
Just why even set up for the drama to happen? What is the point?
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:26 PM CST up reply actions
pretty confident about the KG part of it
Gaah.
If KG had been on a ‘max’ contract (or had his uncapped contract grandfathered), the pups would have been fine cap-wise.
Does Glen really not realize that the problem was that KG
occupied something like 2 contract slots?
Couldn't agree more
Granting an ETO to a rookie superstar that will likely get 29 other offers for the max extension is probably the worst decision possible.
If they lock KLove up for 5 years, they could have re-upped RR at a 4-yr max (he wouldn’t turn it down either or both because of $ and KLove bromance), then extended RA in same year, and then re-signed KLove 1 yr later saying, hey, we have RR and RA for 3 more years too — you in, KLove?!
Instead its unnecessary drama 2.5 years earlier. All that force a trade and make the team more competitive, roster flexibility is nonsense. This CBA provision is Taylor made for Love and Wolves did the exact opposite — whoever did the decision tree on this, well let’s just leave it at that.
by PoohRichardson on Jan 27, 2012 12:00 AM CST up reply actions
Exactly
I just, thinking about this, do not understand what they were thinking. The only possible reason I can think of is that Taylor doesn’t understand how good Love really is—A Love-on-the-bench-like situation, if you will, except this time Love can escape.
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 27, 2012 12:02 AM CST up reply actions
They just tied their own noose, IMO
KLove is 23, has been an all-star, improves every year, plays on a small market team who doesn’t attract free agents, we have no other 5-yr designee possibilities except RR (but it doesn’t matter because he will accept 4-yr max extension because of greater $ and risk reduction due to earlier timing of being able to lock in extension). The only reason to do this is incompetence or risk of injury. If risk of injury, then this team will never be competitive or cohesive offering max of 3-yr contracts, which by the way holds no water considering that they signed Rid and JJ to 4 years. Incomprehensible.
by PoohRichardson on Jan 27, 2012 12:13 AM CST up reply actions
This should be rule #1 in handbook
Never grant an ETO to a max player. Since it is widely accepted that the max player salary is less than what they would make on the open market without a salary cap and therefore can pick their team when they exercise the ETO, economics 101 would support that this was irrational behavior by the Wolves front office/ownership.
by PoohRichardson on Jan 27, 2012 12:29 AM CST up reply actions
Or
so risk averse, they will never be competitive and should consider swimming in a shallower pool.
by PoohRichardson on Jan 27, 2012 12:31 AM CST up reply actions
Same applies to Cleveland and LeBron...
hell they even had the “hometown” thing going for them. Meanwhile, Love’s hometown, just happens to be one of the most appealing and powerful franchises in sports.
Orlando and Cleveland both put together solid teams around their superstars and they lost them in exactly the same fashion we are setting ourselves up to lose ours’. You could probably argue the same thing for Utah and Denver (in fact the Nuggets put together a team that was much better than it’s star). Toronto and NOrleans both did a pretty crappy job surrounding their stars, but they also made it a hell of a lot farther than we can guarantee the Wolves will make it in the next 2-3 years.
The history for keeping players on non-LA, Boston, NY type teams after ceding the leverage of post-rookie contract is miserable. Love was willing to go the Durant, Rose, Westbrook route and we turned down the opportunity.
The fish rots from the head.
by vjl110 on Jan 26, 2012 8:57 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
"The fish rots from the head."
I actually wrote this before reading your usage of the phrase earlier.
Taylor is going to reap what he has sown here. It just sucks that we all get hit by the shrapnel.
by vjl110 on Jan 26, 2012 9:02 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Would that be.... fish.... shrapnel? Which he's sowing.... ?
Lord knows I do love my Timberwolves fan brethren (and sister-then), but when we’re hitting overwrought mixed metaphors, maybe we need to take a breath. It doesn’t smell like exploding fish seeds when I watch the highlights from last night’s win.
"First, I'd like to blame the Lord for causing us to lose today."
by feral on Jan 26, 2012 9:28 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I deserved comment on that one...
I noticed the terrible mixed metaphor when I wrote that up, but decided it was too early to make pretty.
It's truly wonderful. Wouldn't change a thing.
"First, I'd like to blame the Lord for causing us to lose today."
Of course, Mr. Friedman. You have a column to write. ;)
Gary, you didn't kill your brother. Those gorillas did.
by nja700 on Jan 26, 2012 1:10 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I think we blew it with the Love extension
But in the new CBA this is the last year that sign & trade/extend and trades are legal, right?
That at least gives the hometown team a little bit more of an advantage, since he can’t just pick where he wants to go and get paid unless they have the cap space.
Yep
The kicker is that…well, look at Dwight in Orlando. What can Orlando possibly sweeten the pot with financially to make him stay? If Dwight hits the free agent market he’ll be eligible for 5 years with 7.5% increases and that’s that.
The Wolves basically just moved the possible blow-it-up-again date up 2 years for no good reason. Hell, out of all of this post-KG nonsense we could get to watch, what, 1 or 2 years of winning ball before we start over…possibly with him walking for nothing after 3 and Rubio and Adelman following him out the door? Ick. They’ve certainly leveraged the hell out of a single season 3 years from now.
At the very least you will have some pretty high trade value
should it become apparent he wants out.
I don’t think wcs is starting over. Meanwhile the roster won’t be stagnant for the next couple of years. And for glass half full folks this allows Rickey to get the 5 year (assuming he is worthy at that point).
Anyway, lots of fans were skeptical a couple of months ago whether he would sign at all, so it may not be perfect, but it’s pretty darn good.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 9:33 AM CST up reply actions
Five years to Ricky?
But what if he gets injured? That’s an awfully big risk. He’s such a fragile little guy.
i think we can agree the injury angle was smoke
But for the sake of argument, ok, five years to Wes.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 10:58 AM CST up reply actions
Is that right?
I thought that if Dwight becomes a full-blown free agent, only Orlando can offer that 5th year. Other teams can only offer 4. Same for CP3 and why it was a big deal they were both trying to force their ways to other markets via trade, so they could get the maximum extensions with their new teams versus leaving $20 mil on the table by moving via free agency.
If he declines the ETO
He will retain his Bird rights with the team and he could force them into paying him the extra $30 mil over the course of the contract before trading him….or, I think he could just roll the dice for a few months and get a big 5 year max deal somewhere where he wants to play.
Bird rights allow a team to go over the salary cap to resign their guy. I think they also exist in UFAs who have played 3 seasons without getting waived.
According to this:
http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/33514559
Bird rights give him the ability to sign a 5 year deal with the Magic (or his new team if he’s traded before the deadline). 4 years with any other team as a FA. Same reason Deron Williams will opt out in NJ even if he plans on staying. That way he can sign the 5-year max with his own team as a FA.
And if he signs the monster extension with the Magic to get that extra cash, why the hell would they trade him? He’s locked in for 5 years.
Awesome
They can offer him the 5th year. Other teams can give him max money for 4….sort of a bigger version of what we just saw with Love. Thanks for the link. Orlando’s carrot is the 5th year and he’s thus far turning up his nose at it. They can sweeten the pot with another year of huge money, not more huge money per year, right?
You also still have the 7.5% raises for a Bird Free Agent versus the 4.5% raises for signing as a free agent with another team.
Michael Beasley is a Small Forward. Derrick Williams is a Power Forward.
That's about it.
5 years, ~$100 mil with Orlando or 4 years, ~$80 mil elsewhere is how I’ve read it. And the ability to extend is really limited. So even if Dwight wanted to stay in ORL, he’ll opt out and sign the 5 year deal with ORL to get the most years/money.
This is also why I think the Hornets/Magic have more leverage now for calling these players’ bluffs. If he or CP3 really wanted to go to a marquee market, they were going to have to give up a lot of money to move as a FA. Right now, the only “big” markets looking at major room next year are Dallas and NJ. And NJ blows. The Lakers aren’t going to contend for FA for 3 years with Kobe taking up half the cap. So they’d have to take less money to go a non-preferred destination.
Mark Cuban made the point that more bluffs should be called
1- you make the player make the tough choice and 2- you get to the lotto quicker.
Looking it this way,
Maybe they’re planning on Love opting out, giving him the full 5 year deal and then giving Rubio the 5-year rookie extension. Long ways down the road and they run the risk of Love being a UFA, but that might be their thinking here.
I mentioned it above..
….but I think we’ll see a broad owner trend of forcing players to make tougher decisions on shorter time scales. 4 year deals with lots of ETOs. More movement = the best way they can get closer to wide scale-closer-to-the-NFL parity (i.e. competitive balance).
If the goal is NFL-style parity
I don’t think they’ll ever get there. The two leagues are too apples-and-oranges. Everything from the different degrees of randomness inherent in the games to the length of schedule to the pool of athletes…
Of course, that doesn’t mean NBA owners won’t try.
I don't think they'll get there, either (and I know the games are reallllllllly different)
But I am pretty sure that they want shorter deals with tougher choices which would give more incentive for more player movement.
They have a resource problem and if they want parity (and bad play) they need to spread out the really good players as far and as wide as possible.
Probably doesn't hurt (in their eyes)
that now they’re protected from some of their dimmer members from signing the next Rashard Lewis contract.
(Of course, maybe not…)
Agreed on the resource issue (the elephant in the room is there are simply too many teams, imo).
And fwiw, I tend to think many of their rules designed to enhance “competitive balance” end up making teams’ lives more difficult. The MLE, for example, more often than not inflates the value of leftover players. Or matching salaries on trades? If the impetus there was to eliminate baseball-style, Johan Santana-like trades, why do that? That’s typically a great way for teams to reload (Johan’s return notwithstanding), and the cap/luxury tax in essence supresses those moves, anyway. Maybe then, when a team has to move a KG or D12, the offers are a bit more numerous/competitive.
But who knows?
I don't have a problem with this if this ends up being a league-wide trend
Sounds good to me…
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:32 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, I'm not happy with it
I thought giving him 5 was a no-brainer.
Still, presumably not having the Sign/extend and trade option should give us more leverage. There would have to be a team out there with maximum salary space that he wanted to go to if he became an unrestricted FA.
I just wish we didn’t have to be worrying about it coming to that. There’s no reason.
This may be true...
it is a bit disingenuous for me to use what happened on the old CBA to predict how Love’s situation will unfold.
It'd be better
if we didn’t have to try predict how the new CBA will affect our negotiations in 3 years.
Loves hometown is Portland, not LA.
Interviewer: Can you understand why teams value potential ahead of experience and accomplishment in the draft? Wes Johnson: "Yeah. I understand. It’s the youngness of everything – older guys like young women, so it’s the same way."
by Xand1 on Jan 26, 2012 9:55 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
DH is such a POS for how he has handled his situation, Carmelo as well
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:23 PM CST up reply actions
Dwight signed a 5 year extension...
..and is leaving after the 4th year of that contract. Not quite the LBJ/Wade/Bosh/D-Will circumstances.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
If I were the Magic I'd make Dwight give up the money.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Bet that Love wont opt out with team success
And then extend both Love and Rubio for 5 years in the same offseason.
Michael Beasley is a Small Forward. Derrick Williams is a Power Forward.
I hope so
They’ll need 1 more guy. They need #3. We’ll see. Adelman + Love + 2 other above average guys = success. Rubio is one of those other guys. (Waiting for the obvious shoe to drop.)
I don't see an S-n-T now,
but can you see a way Portland matches any offer to Batum if they re-sign Crash (as they should)?
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
I think they can only sign one player for 5 years
by MrBungle85 on Jan 25, 2012 11:03 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Only one 5 year rookie extension. Love could still sign for 5 years as a Bird free agent.
Michael Beasley is a Small Forward. Derrick Williams is a Power Forward.
Didn't realize that was me
Just did a Canishoopus search and found the original unicorn is none other than Antoine Walker playing defense. Looks like Wyn coined the term first.
Michael Beasley is a Small Forward. Derrick Williams is a Power Forward.
Shouldn't Love opt out no matter what?
Even if he likes the team, he can re-up for 3, 4, or 5 more max years, right?
Barring injury
You can't...dust...for vomit.
See, C.C.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 10:03 AM CST up reply actions
There is no bet here. Of course he will opt out. There is absolutely no question that he will opt out
The only way he doesn’t opt out is if he is severely injured. This is a 3 year contract. Everyone should understand that. He isn’t going to play on a 1 year deal (the option year) when he can get a full max deal by opting out. No way that happens regardless of what the team situation is.
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 25, 2012 11:03 PM CST up reply actions
I'd take that bet in a heartbeat, at this moment.
Love would be a fool not to opt out after three years, Bird rights intact. Boy is gonna get paid, as though he’s not on this new contract.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Here's my only theory
Which is based on trying to inhabit Glen Taylor’s rube-like mind:
Kevin Love’s teams had won 56 games in 3 seasons, and attendance was near the bottom of the league. His rookie season wasn’t particularly noteworthy, and SportsCenter rarely showed highlights of his team’s games.
A year later, with roughly the same roster except for Rubio and Adelman, the team is much more competitive and successful to this point, receiving national buzz, a consistent fixture in highlights, and a noticeable increase in attendance.
I’m not saying it’s a good rationale, but is it possible that Taylor sees Rubio as a more desirable franchise asset, both because of ticket sales and because of being more integral to team success? This has been mentioned multiple times, but primarily in basketball terms. Don’t you think a part of Glen wants that big offer available just because his presence has a higher revenue potential than Love’s? Teams make decisions based on selling tickets all the time. That doesn’t make it good rationale for those decisions (I think winning in MN brings fans in unless you’re the Dome Twins), but I can visualize Taylor coming to that conclusion.
The good news is hopeful doesn't mean dumb. The bad news is cynical doesn't mean smart. -- Sarah Silverman
by pagingstanleyroberts on Jan 26, 2012 1:01 PM CST up reply actions
On the bright side...
they (meaning the whole team) worked their asses off tonight.
And beat the (Dirk-less, yes) defending champs with two freaking guards (no, Wes Johnson, I am sorry, you are not a shooting guard, despite what you may think)—one an NBA rookie and one who many on this board were recently arguing did not even belong in the NBA! And it wasn’t all the Super Two or WhateverTF we are calling them.
So there’s that.
I am done lamenting the 4/3 v. 5 after the group melt-down of earlier today. I have no control over such matters (I am clearly not going to switch my allegiances over what I perceive as an incorrect move by the FO, so I won’t pretend). I am glad I resisted tweeting at Kevin Love in the throes of disappointment though.
Two wins against the champions
holds some shine for me, tonight.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
I tweeted at Love
I really doubt he reads any of them though so whatevs
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:24 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah I sent him a...err...Lets just say I deleted it a few minutes ago and sent him something very positive
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:52 PM CST up reply actions
It was more like..."Taylor should have given you the 5 man, forget about it, enjoy your 61 mil" or something
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:35 PM CST up reply actions
The moment Love recognized the Stephen A. Smith sock puppet on his draft night,
it was pretty clear the world was very, very small for him that way.
But speaking of “functional human beings,” yeah…. I’m still irritated by the team picking up Corey Brewer’s option a couple of years ago, and this one here is really not worth stewing about.
We do not, ever, really have inside information about how contract negotiations really go. Fans have wildly overblown reactions to them, seemingly always. Kevin Love says stuff on his twitter feed that he maybe shouldn’t say. People still complain about Sprewell’s sad attempts to negotiate for himself, when Latrell was doing exactly what lots of fans say they want by going without an agent at the time.
You’re pretty much damned if you do and damned if you don’t.
The only negotiations I can remember offhand that weren’t “awkward” would be a) rookie scale deals, over which we had larger-scale “awkwardness” in that CBA window; and b) Gilbert Arenas’s love fest re-signing in Washington, which baffled the heck out of me.
"First, I'd like to blame the Lord for causing us to lose today."
I think, based on on-the-record comments from both sides, we have pretty good information
on what happened here.
Because after any sensitive negotiation, usually both sides tell the full truth on twitter.
M’kay.
"First, I'd like to blame the Lord for causing us to lose today."
fist pound
for my brother feral
http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub
by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 9:30 AM CST up reply actions
They're telling the same story though...
Both saying Love wanted a 5th and the team didn’t want to dish it out. I don’t see what the spin would be on that, from either side.
Even more reason not to believe it
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 9:51 AM CST up reply actions
Sure, if there was something to be gained by it
I don’t see what benefit either side would be getting by spinning this.
Not sure
Just, we’re all happy. Yes, Kevin wanted this, Wolves wanted that, and we came to an amicable compromise. You have to bet though that the two sides agreed how to posture this publicly.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 10:08 AM CST up reply actions
On-the-record-comments = twitter?
M’kay.
But in all seriousness, Love told the Star Tribune that he wanted to make a five-year commitment, and the Wolves felt otherwise. Don’t you think, if this wasn’t true, someone in the organization would have refuted it at least a little bit?
Or, you know, at least Kahn wouldn’t have explained in a post-game interview why the Wolves wouldn’t go five years?
Its the Illuminati, man
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:36 PM CST up reply actions
Who's to say...
Kevin Love (or his agent) didn’t want a 4 year deal with a opt-out on the last year? Adelman and Rubio’s contracts are up that year so maybe he wants to see what the Timberwolves are really going to do.
Kahn and Kevin Love say.
That’s who.
by Madison Dan on Jan 25, 2012 11:11 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Apparently everyone is to say
both Love and Kahn said that the team didn’t want to go 5, and Love said he wanted 5.
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 25, 2012 11:11 PM CST up reply actions
Which of you turns into an element and which into an animal?
My suspicion is that EiM can only turn into the ice cold bucket of reality…
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
by JMGrady on Jan 25, 2012 11:25 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Shape of Lake Wingra
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 25, 2012 11:27 PM CST up reply actions
Man, I love you.
You are the most consistent poster on the site outside of PD’s ephemeral, ineffable lewdness.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Thank you
I try to maintain. Try to maintain.
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 25, 2012 11:32 PM CST up reply actions
Honestly, I used to resent your negativity.
But then I came to terms with your negativity being my denial.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
impressive
Too hot to handle, too cold to hold
They're called the Ghostbusters and they're in control
OK, that's pretty funny
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 26, 2012 8:11 AM CST up reply actions
Can you blame Love for this?
If the Wolves had a track record like the Thunder, Spurs, or Nuggets I could see him extending for 5 years. The approach to extend and see what the club does to build a winner is entirely reasonable.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 26, 2012 6:21 AM CST up reply actions
Instead they're a team with a history of paying their best player lots of money
He’s their best player; they’re waiting for something they don’t have access to. He’s as good as they’re going to get. Pay him.
It can also be a six year deal
Is everyone overlooking that this deal can be extended during year three to a total of six years. I get why he might opt out if it was just one more year at max but if it is three additional years is it that far fetched?
I don't think that's right
If they extend him during year 3, it can only be for 1 extra season.
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 25, 2012 11:16 PM CST up reply actions
Wolves have said it is up to 6 year deal
There is a clause that during year 3 two years can be added to the back end of the deal…making it a six year deal.
I heard that it was
a 2 year extension, that would be the same as a 5 year deal, but with a chance to re-evaluate in the middle. really odd though.
Will the Real Thor Please Stand Up ... ?
by the Real Thor on Jan 26, 2012 12:24 AM CST up reply actions
2 year extension on top of 4
it’s in essence structured to be two consecutive 3 year deals, this is part of the flexibility. Guys this is what shrewd business feels like. Plenty of cheeseheads were fed up with TT over the years for moves that didn’t feel good at the time for fans, but were clearly part of a bigger picture. I’m not saying Kahn is Ted Thompson, but there are similiarities.
by Bob Wolfey on Jan 26, 2012 9:29 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Love will opt out after 3.
No matter what. Guaranteed. Why would he extend at less than he can make by opting out? All the rest is just PR.
Kahn quote tonight on wolves post game show
“There were only two reasons why we were hesitant [to go to 5 years]. One was the injury factor, and that is out of Kevin’s control. And I think that not only does it cover for 5 more seasons if we had gone that route, but it’s this season too. Now that he signed the contract today, he is protected for this season and five more seasons. Five and three quarters seasons, that’s an awfully long time.”
“And the second reason is strictly from a flexibility standpoint. It allows us to play with the roster a little bit more down the road, and also there’s this new concept of a designated rookie extension. It just was very hard to rationalize giving it out 45 days into the CBA and not being able to use it again until 2017. That’s a long time. And so, you know, this was a close call. But I think that it had nothing to do with Kevin or his performance, I think we had to do what was in the best interest of the team.”
Kahn is a negative PR lightning rod
I’m sure the decision to not guarantee a fifth year involved ownership at some level.
Michael Beasley is a Small Forward. Derrick Williams is a Power Forward.
by Ebomb on Jan 25, 2012 11:19 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Yep. We're back to wondering what Glen Taylor's thinking.
Jeez, I hate that exercise. No thanks.
"First, I'd like to blame the Lord for causing us to lose today."
My two cents
The part about it being “very hard to rationalize giving the [designated rookie] extension out just 45 days into the CBA” definitely sounds like Glen Taylor’s (an owner’s) perspective. That is a small market owner’s only meaningful tool to strong arm a young star into staying with the team.
small market owner...
being the fifth richest owner in all of American sports. let’s just remember he is willing to spend when needed, ala the KG years.
by bringbackbrewer on Jan 26, 2012 1:05 AM CST via Android app up reply actions
And look how that turned out for the Wolves...
and their ability to get players around KG during all of his prime years except for the one.
by Krotz the Wall on Jan 26, 2012 8:05 AM CST up reply actions
The logic flaw in the "45 days" is that
This is a five year thing. It ends in five years. If the Wolves were to give Wayne Ellington a five-year max deal next year (hey, he’s the only one eligible next year), that would tie the team up until 2018, for Wes 2019. No matter when you do this, it’s a five year thing. It only matters now because of Rubio. Only Rubio. If you think this has anything to do with anything else, you’re searching for extra reasons to hate Kahn and Taylor. Be happy with the reasons you have. This is all about Rubio.
I’m not defending that here (though I do elsewhere), it just is, and trying to break down whatever else is said is an exercise in futility.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
Umm...
This isnt an argument of whether Taylor(or his GM at the time) was good at getting good players. This is about the fact that Taylor has shown the propensity to spend when needed, and also that he isnt really some struggling small market owner, he has alot of cash and more than any other NBA owner other than one.
by bringbackbrewer on Jan 26, 2012 4:05 PM CST up reply actions
I wish Kahn would not actually say what's on his mind
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:32 PM CST up reply actions
"the nba has ... lets say a habit ... "
There’s certainly entertainment value along those lines but I am not sure it’s in the best interest of the franchise. I like to have first round picks.
What's with the injury excuse?
Any player is any sport is prone to the same odds of injury. Was Kahn just lost for words because it looks like the silliest statement a GM could fabricate to cover his ass.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 26, 2012 6:23 AM CST up reply actions
To cover his owner's ass
This is how it works
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 8:37 AM CST up reply actions
This
and only this
http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub
by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 8:39 AM CST up reply actions
We'll also pretend that...
…the owners of the Hornets, Wolves, and David Stern did not wink-wink their way to offering 4 year deals to players in the same draft class.
It’s really interesting to watch this 5 year bit play out. The smartest GM in the league jumps at it while owners of small market teams and the league-owned bit hand out 4 year deals while pretty much daring the player to either turn it down or hit free agency as an RFA where they will be offered a contract by another team that is less than what they could have received from their own team…which can then be matched.
you are correct sir
and i can’t say that i blame them, this is what they negotiated for.
what will really get me steamed is if this team gets to be on the cusp of something really big, like contending for a Title, and the Wolves play the fiscal responsibility card as a reason they won’t reach for a player.
http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub
by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 9:02 AM CST up reply actions
Collusion?
I’ll be watching for more of the same.
Anybody know if Stern ever worked with Peter Ueberroth???
The collusion idea really makes sense to me – owners running a “back door cut” around the CBA
"Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously."
— Hunter S. Thompson
It wouldn't take more than a couple players..
..going to RFA for them to start accepting lesser deals.
QO is a huge monetary loss upfront – when these young players neeed to be capitalizing. I am starting to think that is the strategy for the NBA hornets and gordan.
That was kinda disjointed...
I meant that QO is too detrimental a path.. so the only paths are RFA or resigning. And if the team can force RFA they will save money. Or something. And I expect that from gordan.
Owners of the Hornets and David Stern in the same sentence.
That’s a double negative.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Elaborate please
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 26, 2012 10:03 AM CST up reply actions
Insurance doesn't cover a full contract and not all players
The NBA’s insurance policy only pays 80% of a salary and only after 41 games are missed.
The Carrier also has the right to refuse to cover 10 players a yr. And it’s a yr to yr deal.
If a player has a really serious injury,the carrier will likely not insure him the next yr. See Amare and Roy for examples.
A team can buy their own insurance,but that comes out of their pocket and is likely to be pretty pricey for someone w/a pre-existing issue.(Portland did it w/Roy.)
my only take is
I don’t think Kevin will opt out. He wants to win. Who can blame him. I think he likes this team and wants to stay but he wants to win. This team will be deeply entrenched in the playoff picture in three years. I think he stays.
My other take is that David Kahn had everything to gain personally by getting a five year deal. Beating Love out of a year i
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 25, 2012 11:13 PM CST reply actions
is
no feather in his cap. This was clearly an ownership decision.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 25, 2012 11:14 PM CST up reply actions
He will opt out
As I said above. He could re-sign with the Wolves, but he is definitely going to opt out.
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 25, 2012 11:17 PM CST up reply actions
Tell me what it's like....
in the future.
by nchillsdale on Jan 25, 2012 11:18 PM CST up reply actions
He'd be a fool not to opt out.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Can we get a beach?
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:53 PM CST up reply actions
central florida!
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 12:08 AM CST up reply actions
I was never good at geography
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 12:57 AM CST up reply actions
so is Tracy McGrady, apparently
Too hot to handle, too cold to hold
They're called the Ghostbusters and they're in control
The impetus is now entirely on the FO.
They absolutely have to build a winner in the next 2.5 years or the Love signing is wasted (save for the possibility of “look at what Minnesota is building”).
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Just like ARod and CC.
The opt out clause just lets you resign and extend a similar or better contract in the future.
by Boss10 on Jan 25, 2012 11:50 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Entirely.
It gives Love free reign to determine if the franchise has done enough between now and then. I don’t think for an instant that he would resign unless they have made a pushed beyond the first round of the playoffs.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Like to the finals?
Like James and Howard?
long time reader
first time commenter. Had to sign up just to say this is the best post I’ve read on here. agree completely. It’s putting the horse before the cart. Re-sign Love and then Ricky is more likely to stay. Why put the decision on Love?
welcome
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 25, 2012 11:23 PM CST up reply actions
I thought so
but after today I’m not so sure. This is why Kahn gets mocked on the internets. Even if it was Taylor’s decision I’m sure Kahn didn’t try to talk him out of it.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 25, 2012 11:30 PM CST up reply actions
Well, no.
Kahn gets mocked for being a slimy dick. He says too much, offers too much, throws in hyperbole, and then gets a solid “Good luck,” from Chris Webber. He’s really been pushed back into the cone of silence lately, but it’s his mouth that causes his problems.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
On draft day, I completely agree.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
I was thinking
today about a Rubio, Curry, Lawson backcourt…
by PhinneasGage on Jan 25, 2012 11:37 PM CST up reply actions
so who comes off the bench?
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 25, 2012 11:44 PM CST up reply actions
This was
the one hang up…. which made it enjoyable to think about, I guess. But yeah, Lawson is too good to be a back up.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 25, 2012 11:48 PM CST up reply actions
I wonder what % of the hardcore fanbase still thinks about curry
I personally don’t but most of my buddies do…
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:54 PM CST up reply actions
I do more now
than I did back then. I didn’t think Curry would hold up in the league.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:01 AM CST up reply actions
Spare yourself the agony, my friend.
Someone posted recently about the what ifs. If SnP had his way, if I remember properly, Curry, Derozan, DMC.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Not to mention
his mole. He should get that thing removed or stay off camera. Some people can wear one, say, Marilyn Monroe, but David, not so much.
Enjoy your stay here at CH
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:33 PM CST up reply actions
absolutely
I live in Seattle and no one here talks about the Wolves like you lot.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 25, 2012 11:36 PM CST up reply actions
Im in Olympia recovering from Snowpocalypse blackouts
Headed to the game in Portland in early March. Two weekend Wolves games in Portland this year which is awesome in this condensed schedule. Welcome.
Michael Beasley is a Small Forward. Derrick Williams is a Power Forward.
Snowpocalypse!!
Haven’t lived in MN for 10 years but it still makes me laugh that 3 inches of snow can make people throw around words like snowpocalypse. Then again I didn’t lose power.
I’ll be at the game in early March. It’ll be my first Blazers game too, which will be a blast.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 25, 2012 11:57 PM CST up reply actions
yeah
Seattlites are bad in the snow. We got over 20 inches in three days and then the freezing rain came and turned the snow in the trees to ice bringing down trees, branches, and power lines. Lost power for 3 days in total. No electricity sucks without a fireplace or wood stove. When the power went out I had no power in any of my 2 kindles, laptop or cell phone, it was humbling to realize how dependent I am on power.
Michael Beasley is a Small Forward. Derrick Williams is a Power Forward.
We got
the freezing rain but it doesn’t compare to any of that. Hoq long was your power out? I know they were thinking it could be weeks for some areas.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:16 AM CST up reply actions
Glad to see you are okay.
I was lucky enough to be in a power secure part of Seattle. I was unlucky to be sick all week so I couldn’t romp around in the snow with my classes being cancelled. Bah.
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Everyone
here acts like they haven’t heard of any NBA team. Mention Kevin Durant around a group of people and there’s a collective groan. Tears are involved. Tears of rage mainly.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 25, 2012 11:58 PM CST up reply actions
I can't imagine
That’s got to be horrible
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 12:02 AM CST up reply actions
I remain steadfast
in my boycott of Thunder-support.
I love Durant, but until Clay Bennett and his crew of slimeballs are no longer involved in the team, I can’t support them. Seattle got fornicated on.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 12:03 AM CST up reply actions
NBA fans
in Seattle appreciate the support. It helps us through these dark times knowing that everyone understands how completely fucked we got. Yeah, attendance was down, and people didn’t want to pay for a new arena after Safeco and Qwest, but most of that can be explained away by the shitty product that was put on the court… even the marketing fell away to nothing! I can’t even think about it without getting angry and ranting at people.
And I still get League Pass because I can’t not watch basketball! It’s fucking infuriating.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:14 AM CST up reply actions
Minnesota sports fans
have been issued stadium ultimatums more often than any other sports town (it seems to me), so it’s easy to see where you guys were coming from.
And then to see (in Bennett’s emails and such) how premeditated the heist was . . .
I lived in Oklahoma when the Thunder got there. I wouldn’t even pay for a ticket to see the Wolves visit. Infuriating is right.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 12:17 AM CST up reply actions
I lived there
when the Northstars left, but it was nothing like the this.
The thing that gets me is the collusion by the league. It’s like watching FIFA. I’m mostly convinced the officiating has been so terrible this year because Stern told the refs he needs a high draft pick for NO.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:21 AM CST up reply actions
Ugh, I don't want to touch this...
but the officiating in that MN/NOLA game was heinous. The Clippers game also comes to mind.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
I still can't believe
the blocking calls at the end of the MIA and ATL games. That’s two more W’s against quality teams. Potentially. Now if only they’d stop playing down to the level of the competition…
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:30 AM CST up reply actions
yes,
and that was a sad, sad day. how can Dallas support a Hockey team better then MN? also, I call that other team that left MN the “Minneapolis Lakers Currently playing in LA.” which is sadly the real truth. I wonder how many Lakers fans realize that is a stolen team. for that matter, other then the Galaxy, has LA ever had a team not stolen from else where?
Will the Real Thor Please Stand Up ... ?
by the Real Thor on Jan 26, 2012 12:35 AM CST up reply actions
eventually will steal another football team
Joe Mauer grounded into double play, second to shortstop to first, ________ out at second
LA Vikings!
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 12:37 AM CST up reply actions
More likely the Rams
which incidentally used to play in LA via Cleavland.
Will the Real Thor Please Stand Up ... ?
by the Real Thor on Jan 26, 2012 12:46 AM CST up reply actions
Oh, I remember.
The St. Louis move was weird, because they’d just lost the Cardinals (I had always thought it was cool that St. Louis had two teams named “the Cardinals”).
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 12:56 AM CST up reply actions
haha
I was so upset about that stadium stuff when they first threatened a year or two ago, now the state seems to have called their bluff
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 1:00 AM CST up reply actions
I'd be thrilled
if the state legislature could stiffen up and just say, “Build your own damned stadium.”
Billionaires looking for handouts. Eff them.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 1:03 AM CST up reply actions
Agreed
But as long as someone is willing to build a stadium for these teams the sports team hostage situations will never end
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 1:06 AM CST up reply actions
Be nice if the communities could all collude together
No such luck though.
Here in Sacramento, we are likely to lose the Kings soon...
…next year, or shortly thereafter. The team sucks and the ownership is even worse. Although Sac is a pretty shitty locale, per capita, it’s aggressively supports its sports teams – we lead the league in sell-outs for years in the 90s, and the AAA team consistently leads their league in attendance as well. And we don’t even need to get into the business ineptitude and missteps and the millions of daddy’s dollars the idiot Maloofs have squandered.
I kinda feel like Portland, Seattle, and Sactown
are in the same boat. Great fans, but wanting of an appropriately worthwhile team. Post-Adelman, the Kings have been really awful.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Completely understandable.
I loved me some Glove, Rainman, X-man Sonics. I would’ve loved to see Ray retired in green and yellow. Seattle got treated so terribly in the OKC deal. Just messed up. Terrible by the NBA.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
I loved watching Kemp.
All of the electricity of LeBron, but none of the douchiness.
Of course, that may have been different if Twitter had existed back then . . .
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 12:14 AM CST up reply actions
Heh
the reign man on Twitter would’ve been priceless. We’re all poorer off.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:19 AM CST up reply actions
I have nothing to say that can't be said by this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uluRwJ_i1Ik
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
My favorite team of all time
I had a Sonics Starter jacket because of that team.
And tell me those aren’t good fans, Stern.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:25 AM CST up reply actions
Man, I loved that team.
I am still a Glove fan because of how filthy he was on man-to-man defense. Give him a single bad dribble and that jit was going the opposite direction for 2.
I cannot tell you how unhappy I was when he signed with the fucking Lakers in hopes of a ring.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Several thoughts:
When’s the last time a Timberwolf finished a play like Kemp did at 3:43 of that video. Has it ever happened?
It’s amazing to think of how stacked that Sonics team was, even including Detlef Schrempf and his Minecraft hair.
Kemp in his prime was LeBron before LeBron was Lebron. (Are we sure Kemp isn’t LeBron’s father?). Terrifying in the open court. A menace in the post. Just phenomenal.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 12:30 AM CST up reply actions
Before the lockout of 99, Kemp couldn't be stopped by anyone.
He came into that season so out of shape, he destroyed the whole team dynamic. His downside happened so quickly, so decisively, I cannot find an equal for it.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Outside of KG
Kemp is my guy. He was one of those Freak Athletes Simmons likes to talk about. And his game was so rounded.
He’s no Kemp but D-Will has had a couple strong finishes.
Also,this reminds me of that alley oop Terry through to Wright tonight. That was pretty.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:41 AM CST up reply actions
That oop was ridiculous.
I really like D-Thrill. I still just can’t see how he fits on the roster. K-Love isn’t a bad defender, but shedding the weight he did makes him light for a 4, let alone playing more 5 like many of us suggested during the lockout.
Williams doesn’t have the quickness to guard 3s consistently, but he’s sure been aggressive attacking them rim from 19-24 feet in the last couple weeks. He’s got that 3-point range, too. Offensively, he seems like a 3, but defensively, he’s just too bulky and slow.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
He had trouble
guarding Marion tonight, who’s wily but by no means quick. That being said I’m optimistic he’ll improve. If so you let Beasley walk and slide him over. I just wish he’d straighten up on his jump shots a little.
Not sure I want to give up on Beas yet either.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:55 AM CST up reply actions
I wish Bill Walton still commentated :(
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 1:01 AM CST up reply actions
I am so glad he doesn't.
He sounds like a shit salesman with a mouthful of samples.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 1:04 AM CST up reply actions
He's no Czar
and he sure as hell is no Hubie. I still have a warm place in my heart for Harlan, no matter what he does.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Harlan!
Hell yes!
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 1:14 AM CST up reply actions
I don't know, honestly, if it was that he called Wolves games
or if he was just that fucking good.
“PUNCH IT, BIG TICKET” is forever written on my brain.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
You can't beat calls like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KkrccHEAqg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1YI06ZTNOk
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 1:14 AM CST up reply actions
I agree.
Any moron can Google that shit. And it’s such a strained connection. Boris Diaw to Beethoven? Come on.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 1:52 AM CST up reply actions
Its not about how actually good it is in terms of real metaphors
Its just ridiculous and you can tell he’s trolling the suns organization when he’s talking about it. I don’t think he’s great for Hubie Brown-like commentary, but for getting a laugh during a game there’s no one better
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 1:58 AM CST up reply actions
I'd agree with you
If I’d ever laughed at his schtick.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:00 AM CST up reply actions
The thing about Hubie
is that he’s of age with Wes, but stll has the insight of a coach. He sees what’s happening on the court and recognizes the wise play.
Just like Wes, if only his body could still recall the athleticism he one had.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
See, that
I laughed at. Even though it hurt me to do so. Hubie is awesome. Walton made me want to murder children.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:04 AM CST up reply actions
I live on one-liners
even if they require a bit of set up.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
My MO as well.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:06 AM CST up reply actions
I suspect this is why we set one another up for them.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Seriously, though,
how do you manage teaching while staying up to 2am?
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
I teach MWF.
Most semesters, anyway. I’m the guy who volunteers for all of the early sections so I can get my max.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:14 AM CST up reply actions
Are you a professor?
I thought you were a high school teacher.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Community college instructor.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:42 AM CST up reply actions
We should get beers some time.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
No doubt.
Are you in the metro area?
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 3:40 AM CST up reply actions
There you go again
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 8:53 AM CST up reply actions
He's too busy dressing up as a water bottle
Someone please find the picture. (episode of shark tank).
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 8:43 AM CST up reply actions
Ray Ray
is still one of the best players I’ve ever seen in person. So smooth.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:18 AM CST up reply actions
Greatest stroke I've seen in 30 years of watching NBA ball.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
thanks
feel like I know all you guys already
You don't know us all until you've met
Maynholup and Indigent Richard.
"Humor is reason gone mad." Marx (Groucho, for the reason-gone-mad impaired)
MAYN has been gone for the last few games, what's goin on?!
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:40 PM CST up reply actions
How many different medical prescriptions do you think he has
Since moving to California? Instant hypocondriac.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 4:29 PM CST up reply actions
I just got what you meant by crop haha
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 4:47 PM CST up reply actions
Lmao i wont lie mayn det got dat Gooooooddd ova here
Mayn when im not gittin thowed watchin dem wolves doe i be making moves left and right mayn im busy being a yung boss out here mayn im finna be de nexx scott rudin in dis bitch mayn. De time difference iz why i aint round fo dem games doe mayn, shit i watch dem on dvr later but ill catch a few live dont even front mayn smoke sumn
MAYN HOL UP!
by MAYNHOLUP on Jan 26, 2012 6:45 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Beautiful.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 6:56 PM CST up reply actions
You know
since my guy’s guy switched from brown to green, I’m getting what you’re saying much better than I used to. I just wish my wallet wasn’t bleeding quite so hard.
Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!
mayn i been on a Purp-only diet lately
Gotta rep Minny in any way i can ya feel me. mayn dat brown shit aint nuttin you gotta at least get de green playboy!
MAYN HOL UP!
by MAYNHOLUP on Jan 27, 2012 10:31 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
f all that Love contract stuff
we’ve had 2 massive threads on it already.
this was an awesome win! love and rubio of course just killing it. wes hitting a couple shots and a nice pass. wayne playing good ball. pek getting his longest run of the season. defeating dallas on their ring night!
at times tonight, we had this edge. killer instinct. the end of the half was amazing. a nice 3rd quarter, and a huge 4th.
it was a great basketball game.
On the topic of Pek
At some point, especially if he keeps getting minutes, Refs will get used to him and he will get respect. When that day comes he’s going to be great.
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:34 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That's what I'm hoping for.
It was always talked about how Shaq’s sheer size and strength caused refs to call fouls against his defenders. He was a superstar from day one. I think a similar thing is happening with Pek. He’s freaking enormous, and strong as an elephant. When people bounce off him, even when it’s a normal play, it looks violent.
He’s committed his share of fouls, but until he starts getting some consideration from the refs, he’s going to continue to be called for bullshit, just because he’s a physical anomaly.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 25, 2012 11:43 PM CST up reply actions
Yup, its understandable from a reffing point of view
I remember Love getting BS calls on him all the time when he was still coming off the bench, that certainly went away as he made his presence known
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:55 PM CST up reply actions
I wrote that wrong.
I meant to say that “Shaq’s sheer size and strength cause refs not to call fouls against his defenders.”
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 25, 2012 11:57 PM CST up reply actions
Good correction.
Especially considering the walks, elbows, and asundry other offensive fouls they ignored due to his size. Pek is Shaqesque (word invention rules) without the high billing that won him BS superstar calls from word one. I am stunned by the way they look for 3-second calls on him.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Rubio
played his best game tonight. Excellent decision making, played under control, only threw up one ugly brick, and was all over the defensive end of the floor. You could tell he wanted those last 3 rebounds.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 25, 2012 11:39 PM CST up reply actions
He didn't play his best, but he did finish well.
And it was enough to finish out the diminished champs with a 9-man roster. 12 assists to 7 TOs is not a good ratio, give or take 46.5 minutes played. He’s still remarkable, exciting, and someone people coalesce around.
Love that kid.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
"He's still remarkable, exciting, and someone people coalesce around"
Awesome description.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 26, 2012 11:22 AM CST up reply actions
Thank you, sir.
You don’t put a saddle and reins on a magical unicorn, you bareback it and put faith in nature.
The post game presser made me chuckle..
Adleman: “I was really happy with our guards sticking it out today. But I bet Ricky isn’t too happy with me. He’ll be fine though, he’s young.”
Not his best game
He missed 12 of 16 shots and committed 7 TOs. Granted he got tired but worked his ass off in those 46.5 minutes and played amazing defense. That pass from underneath the basket to Love for a 3 from the top of the arc was amazing. B+ effort from me tonight for RRubio
Joe Mauer grounded into double play, second to shortstop to first, ________ out at second
Didn't realize
he had 7 TO’s but I’ll still give him a break for essentially playing the whole game. He just seemed to play a little slower tonight than he has been recently. Not effort wise, but poise wise.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:45 AM CST up reply actions
You can see when he's gassed.
He makes a lot more lackadaisical passes. I’m sure he doesn’t see it that way, but the burn in the legs always shows true in the long run.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
His shot
seems to improve though towards the end of the game. That’s probably just perception but I’m very comfortable with him taking clutch shots. More so than during the course of the game.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:50 AM CST up reply actions
I don't even believe in the banana sandwich
but he sure seems to hit shots when they matter.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
He's rushing his shot more now
Than earlier in the season. When he sets himself he’s fine. I think he’s putting a lot of pressure on himself to keep this team competitive right now and ends up focusing more on other things.
by Dr. Wolfenstein on Jan 26, 2012 6:54 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
FG%
wasn’t great, or good, but I thought his shot selection was solid. Just missed some open looks and had trouble getting his shot off in the lane again.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 12:49 AM CST up reply actions
Oh I'm not complaining
without Rubio we don’t win the game. As long as he takes good shots they will start to fall. I’ll take 40% from the field with the double double and 3 stls a game
Joe Mauer grounded into double play, second to shortstop to first, ________ out at second
The problem is he's practically the second option
on offense. He’s taking way too many shots right now. Part of that I think is the coaches encouraging him to stay aggressive, but a bigger part of it is a lack of offensive weapons around him.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 26, 2012 11:26 AM CST up reply actions
Yeah, I think he just needs to keep shooting
to keep defenses from overplaying the pass. Especially coming off a pick. Making the shot is almost a secondary goal at this point.
Agreed, and he's not gonna become a better shooter by shooting less.
Rascal’s origin point is true too though, too many shots because there’s not enough around him.
Ricky’d be leading the league in assists if there was just one more above-average guy on the team.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 26, 2012 1:19 PM CST up reply actions
I'm still at a point
where I’m almost incapable of criticizing Ricky.
But his shot selection sucked, last night. Many of those shots were out of control and early in the shot clock.
He hits a decent rate of the Sebastian Telfair Specials, when he’s left wide open with time to line things up.
I don’t worry about it, though — I think he’s just playing at full speed for so much of the time that he sometimes ends up in positions where he should shoot to avoid a worse mistake.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
He does shit
As long as that continues to be the case, he can miss a few shots. Making shots are just gravy.
He never stops doing shit. You never see him just sitting there.
It’s so refreshing to see an NBA player with that kind of drive.
I absolutely love his defense
Always in the right spots, plays the passing lanes well, doubles on bigs,rotates over when needed and stays in front of his man and takes charges. wow
Britt's power rankings this week said
per Basketball Value, teams score 11 points less per 100 possessions when he’s on the court. Pretty damned impressive.
You don’t put a saddle and reins on a magical unicorn, you bareback it and put faith in nature.
He's like the Euro PG version of KG like that.
A comparison I’m not sure KG would like…eh, maybe he would. Read he told Ricky Minnesota fans are great.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 26, 2012 1:21 PM CST up reply actions
The constant motion on offense...
reminds of Steve Nash.
The weird part with Nash is that he manages to shoot so well while doing that.
The weird part with Rubio is that he has energy in reserves to play JUST AS HARD on defense.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
Totally Agree
Enough talk about contracts. We possibly played our best game of the year tonight with a severely undermanned roster. Is it just me or is the Darko-Pek combo looking pretty potent these days? Darko had 7 (!!) blocks tonight and Pek had 13 points on six shots.
Pek has been delivering for about 4 games straight
Darko, I still don’t feel we can rely on. He was epic on national TV, but… well, Darko lefty hook performances follow. Solid win, though. They absolutely dominated the second half.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
PEK!
I need my shirt to come tomorrow.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 1:53 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
The other belly dancers are going to get jealous
of your natural talent if you keep up with these late nights. They will go all he/she is too much, how can he/she keep up with this pace?
Pace yourself, son/daughter. Stress will cause your goatee to get all frayed, and clearly, that will confuse your non-paying customers…
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
That seems familiar.
Where have I read that . . .
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:00 AM CST up reply actions
I really prefer not to get into your daddy issues.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Yeah. That's going into a deep well of bad.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:05 AM CST up reply actions
I heard that Pek shirts only come in one size, xxxl
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 8:57 AM CST up reply actions
Two different sources
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 8:59 AM CST up reply actions
Before even reading the whole post or the comments,
I have to commend you for beginning the post with a Darii syllogism. Well done.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
I just reread that, and the logic doesn't hold up
Is this intentional?
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 25, 2012 11:56 PM CST up reply actions
It is a syllogism
that doesn’t do the work it’s supposed to. It’s neither valid nor sound. I trust that SnP intended it that way, so I gave him kudos.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 12:01 AM CST up reply actions
Oh, got it
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 12:02 AM CST up reply actions
Yeah, I missed it, too
I thought he was making a direct point…with flawed logic. (And depending how you read what I just wrote, he did!)
You can't...dust...for vomit.
KLove, Rubio and Hockey Fans
Debatable fact – KLove alone doesn’t win games.
Debatable fact – KLove alone doesn’t sell tickets.
Cold Hard Fact – I was able to easily talk my hockey playing buddy into watching the entire game tonight because Rubio is fun to watch, even for a puck head that hates basketball.
While me, you and every Wolves fan with 1/2 a brain would have given KLove the 5 years months ago, if I was the owner of this team and got a look at the revenue Rubio generates vs Love it might make me care deeply about being able to offer Ricky 5 years down the road.
by fanslaststand on Jan 25, 2012 11:48 PM CST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
this is such a good point
I’m a prime example. I’ve never been a huge basketball fan but I am a sports fan. I was intrigued by the adddition of Rubio and Williams this year so I watched a few games early on.
Rubio is a big reason I continue to watch. Yes, Love is better but Rubio is just exciting to an amateur fan like myself which most fans are.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
yeah...
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 12:00 AM CST up reply actions
can someone explain the one player extension rule????
I am not an avid NBA fan I favor MLB and NFL. However this wolves team is a ton of fun to watch.
I’ll say I’m pretty confused by the max player deals and the one rookie extension deals. This is my understanding of NBA contracts. The incumbent team has a right to pay a player more than a new team right like 20% if I’m not mistaken? I remember that from all the Lebron bullcrap a year ago. So with the new CBA a team can only max extend one rookie contract right? So if the Wolves extend Love then they’re basically screwed from giving another of their own players a max extension until Loves contract is up?
They can still sign a free agent to a max deal though is this correct? Not that max contract guys are going to leave teams to come to the Wolves very often. I’m just trying to get some clarity.
So basically by the wolves not giving a max extension to Love ensures that if someone like Rubio or Williams becomes worthy of such an extension they can do so?
Am I understanding this correctly or not? I assume I’m not fully aware as this is just what I’ve taken from bits and pieces of conversations I’ve heard/read.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
off topic
Why did ridnour not play?
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 12:13 AM CST reply actions
+1
Boxscore says coaches decision. I can’t imagine they’d try to trade him right now.
by Bad News Wolves on Jan 26, 2012 12:23 AM CST up reply actions
just looked it up..it said knee
Rested tonight to go friday
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 12:24 AM CST up reply actions
herpes flare up
Too hot to handle, too cold to hold
They're called the Ghostbusters and they're in control
by littleboxes on Jan 26, 2012 7:38 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
knee
"pokin' the animals at the Canis Hoopus zoo"
by pastyearsears on Jan 26, 2012 10:17 AM CST up reply actions
Sir Pastyearsears
One of the Knights that say “knee”.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 10:29 AM CST up reply actions
Quit yer whining.
We’ve got love for 4 years as long as we don’t regress. Plus this deal has an option to extend to 6 years, which is even better than the 5 year deal. Plus we still have the 5 year deal to use on another player! Rubio is around for the next 3 years or whatever on his rookie contracts. So we can bring in a 3rd superstar to take this team to the promised land! This is a great deal you negative nancies!
by wolver on Jan 26, 2012 12:19 AM CST reply actions 2 recs
Well...
The Wolves have a number of contracts coming off the books (AR, Eas, AT), that will allow them some flexibility in the off-season. That said, NOLA, even run by the NBA, would be foolish not to match any offer for him, or risk having no one in the seats next season.
That said, I’d think much like Batum, they just throw out the big, big offer and see if the NBA (or POR) will match.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
With no extension for Gordon , is this the time to try and trade DWilliams for him? Can we request permission to talk to his agent before we engage in trade talks? Have to think that an up and coming TWolves squad has to look alot more attractive than 3-15 NO at this point….
by Down in the Valley on Jan 26, 2012 12:42 AM CST reply actions
The only way the Wolves end up with him, to my understanding,
would be a sign-and-trade. You don’t take him on as a rental player, obviously.The only other way would be the post season offer NOLA could match. Would they? No idea. Pure mystery to me. And as it’s going, NOLA would have to have more picks, unless they’d take the Jazz/Grizzlies protected picks.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
with no extension
can they still do a sign and trade? I thought extensions were to be done by yesterday…
You're right.
You don’t put a saddle and reins on a magical unicorn, you bareback it and put faith in nature.
DWill +1 for Gordon
would be a steal. A draft pick would definitely help. Not sure Stern would want to help the Wolves improve though. Would just lessen the chance of a high lottery pick from the Paul trade.
by PhinneasGage on Jan 26, 2012 1:00 AM CST up reply actions
WHAAAAT?!
Why are people so unhappy about this?
Isn’t the 5-year deal a one-time thing that they can only use on one specific player? Now wait, I know you’re probably thinking “KLove SHOULD be that one player.” You do NOT win championships with 1 player (e.g. KG). We can’t be strung around KLove’s salary just to keep him hear a couple years more while we face salary cap/payroll woes.
Signing Love to this shorter deal gives us more room to breath to sign other players to deals to build around Love. Sure, in principle you’re like “best players should be around for as long as possible.” Yup, but what’s the point if you can’t win with JUST your best player?
I’m happy with this. Is it risky? Yes. But if anything, it proves to me that this organization is focused on winning not just securing players to sell tickets.
I'm still a Minnesotan at heart...
Could you elaborate on how "this shorter deal gives us more room to sign other players"?
Maybe a specific example or two. That would help.
It's like how the Big Al trade created the cap space necessary for that singular move
Too hot to handle, too cold to hold
They're called the Ghostbusters and they're in control
Anyone remember what the singular move ended up being? Anthony Randolph?
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:43 PM CST up reply actions
Rick Adelman
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 4:32 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Isn't the 5-year max contract an $80 million contract?
As compared to this one which is what…about $20 million dollars less? Even 4 years (technically 3), that’s the cheaper option.
I’m actually a little offended that you guys are acting like I’m just reading this shit off the internet and copying/pasting it here. Unless I have something seriously incorrect with the payroll, how is that incorrect?
I'm still a Minnesotan at heart...
You have something seriously incorrect with your math
How does this give them more room to sign more players? This is your claim.
62/4= an average of 15.5/year
80/5= an average of 16/year
Each contract gives him the most he can possibly earn for the first 4 years (7.5% increase with Bird rights). The only reason the 80 year deal is “higher” is because it has an additional 7.5% increase on an extra year. It doesn’t save the team any money. If anything, when they extend him, it is likely that the NBA will have increased its BRI and he will be owed more on the extension.
Here’s what he could make with the Wolves:
Year 1
Wolves can offer: $13,668,750.00
Another team can offer: $13,668,750.00
Year 2
Wolves: $14,693,906.20
Other: $14,283,843.70
Year 3
Wolves: $15,719,062.40
Other: $14,898,937.40
Year 4
Wolves: $16,744,218.60
Other: $15,514,031.10
4-year total
Wolves: $60,825,937.20
Other: $58,365,562.20
Year 5
Wolves: $17,769,374.80
Other: not available
How do they have extra money to sign someone when they’re paying him the same money in the first 4 years of either contract (and if he extends, the same or more)?
by Stop-n-Pop on Jan 26, 2012 11:55 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Alllllright I stand corrected.
I'm still a Minnesotan at heart...
by urluckyday on Jan 26, 2012 5:31 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I respect people who admit when they were incorrect
+1 to you
by Django Z on Jan 27, 2012 11:47 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I think most Wolves fans
recognize that they have not one, but two superior players now. Love can now re-negotiate in 2015, instead of 2017, to decide if the franchise has made sufficient steps toward a championship team. For him, it’s a brilliant move, but for the team, it puts additional pressure.
Maybe that’s what they need. Prove you deserve me on your team. I’d sure love to see it.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
I'm off
It was good finally joining in the conversation.
Hope to hear more from you and other lurking wolves fans in the future
Joe Mauer grounded into double play, second to shortstop to first, ________ out at second
Really good win tonight
I just got done watching a recording of the game.
Love & Rubio carried the team throughout, with a lot of help. Ellington was solid on both ends. Williams got to the line and provided some scoring earlier. Darko was a block machine. Pekovic provided some scoring and (surprise) rebounding late.
Darko & Pek were actually a pretty effective duo tonight.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
I did not enjoy Ellington tonight
he made some nice plays but he took a lot of bad shots and missed a ton
Too hot to handle, too cold to hold
They're called the Ghostbusters and they're in control
I just have to insert somewhere here:
A very young man achieved a 60 million dollar contract in the morning, (something I can’t even begin to imagine) and who shows up at the game last night? Absolutely Lunch Pail Love. He got hacked and beat on all night and he gave it back in full measure (just ask Roddy BooBwahaha.) He was cold blooded from three. The hit and fall he took when Wright fouled him on the break away defined durable to someone (me) who has doubted the utility of the term.
"pokin' the animals at the Canis Hoopus zoo"
by pastyearsears on Jan 26, 2012 10:33 AM CST up reply actions
Worthy of noting
Per Alan Horton — BEEF has committed 1 turnover in the last 9 games. Wow.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Rubio played 46 minutes.
Ouch, this can’t last.
Live And Stupid From England
by JonesTheCat on Jan 26, 2012 1:47 AM CST via mobile reply actions
I hope you slept through this game
despite it being a great win. Pure second half dominance.
When you’re down to 9 men, only two of them guards, you go with what you got.
The minutes showed. 7 TOs for Rubio, but end result, 15 point win and semi-Super Darko.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Git down, girl, go head, git down.
I know you are not a girl, but that song just jumped into my head. :)
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
So far
You told Eric you love him, set up a date with Jason and are boogeying with Jones. Talk about fickle?!
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 9:10 AM CST up reply actions
It's possible I was looking at the world
through beer-colored glasses. Ahem.
You don’t put a saddle and reins on a magical unicorn, you bareback it and put faith in nature.
Now you're gunna go breaking hearts
Oh yeah, I’ll call you…….
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 7:21 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, I didn't watch, can't do midweek games live.
I’ll grab it on league pass this evening.
Keep forgetting how many injuries we have.
Live And Stupid From England
by JonesTheCat on Jan 26, 2012 2:15 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
In fact, those two minutes sans Rubio, who the hell played point!?
Live And Stupid From England
by JonesTheCat on Jan 26, 2012 3:13 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Ellington
It was pretty inconsequential time in the frame of the game itself. When you only have 9 guys, only two of which qualify as guards, you do what you must.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
You're completely forgetting
About our (normally) starting shooting guard. I don’t even know why Adelman was worried.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
Roddy Beaubois looked pretty damned good defending Rubio
(I thought he was the anti-Flynn.) Although I thought Ricky handled the pressure well, when Ricky sat down at the end of the third and Wayne set things up with the clock winding down, and beat Roddy to get all the way to the iron for the lay in, I thought it was one of the high points of the game
"pokin' the animals at the Canis Hoopus zoo"
by pastyearsears on Jan 26, 2012 10:44 AM CST up reply actions
Money Can' t Buy You Love.
Five, four or three years it´s the same, you will need a competitive team in order to keep him, or he will be asking for a trade. Now you have more flexibility, therefore it will be easier to keep him and, more importantly, to win. Kahn´s strategy might have looked like crazy, but some times you have to take a mistake until the end to conquer. That´s how Castile and León discovered America (they were looking for a route to Asia, and they had miscalculated the distance and were at serious risk of dying), how Hernan Cortes conquered Central America with a few hundred men, the same with Pizarro and Peru. You have to be crazy to conquer. A few teams own the NBA land, you won´t conquer it by being prudent.
Money has bought us Love
for three (and maybe four) years.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:13 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Sorry.
You wrote something substantial, and I responded with my usual thoughtless one-liner.
I’m just not prepared to counter the the Spanish conqueration of the Americas at this ponit of the night. You da man. I’m just visitin’.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:22 AM CST up reply actions
(Here's a secret--
most cynics are softies. We just don’t follow convention.)
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 2:43 AM CST up reply actions
Wow, way to go balls deep into Spanish conquest as basketball success
The biggest thing about this signing is that it narrows the window for Kahn or the Adelmans to create a winning team. If, after three years, there’s not significant progress, Love is just gone.
Bringing honor to uncle rico's family since 2011.
Charles Barkley's plan for protecting his daughter ;)
When asked how he will handle his 12-year-old daughter’s future boyfriends, NBA hall-of-famer Charles Barkley responded, “I figure if I kill the first one, word will get out.”
The problem is the prison time
what’s needed is a really bad accident to befall the boyfriend and rumors
Too hot to handle, too cold to hold
They're called the Ghostbusters and they're in control
Barkley is awesome
Can’t wait for Inside the NBA tonight
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:44 PM CST up reply actions
This is great news
I will become a season ticket holder now.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
Did you forget the %
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:45 PM CST up reply actions
Here's another thought about flexibility
The league could earn more money in years 4 and 5 and he’d be able to demand even more with the extension while being yet another year older on the 2nd deal. FLEXIBILITY!!!
More flexibility
The 5th year bit can only be used on extensions. This way, if the Wolves magically get someone like a 27-28 year old superstar, they can extend them all the way to their late 30s on their second contract! FLEXIBILITY!
These Tears are Dated maybe 2015/16, 2016/17
This Smile is Dated and Confirmed
2012/13
2013/14
2014/15
http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub
by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 7:56 AM CST reply actions
You really just don't give up
Mr. Koolaide.
Taylor started competing against Love and his Agent
And forget he was competing against the other teams in the league.
Can someone find me a team in the league that is disappointed Love has a 3 year out?
As I said before tho.
I’d kinda like to get a look at the Wolves revenue post Rubio to see how valuable he is.
by fanslaststand on Jan 26, 2012 8:22 AM CST up reply actions
If you take away Love, but leave Rubio, the team would still be high flying but would probably have just as bad of a record as last year
I don’t see anywhere near the buzz happening that is happening for them now
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:46 PM CST up reply actions
Y, you never know tho. Basketball is weird like that.
Take out a stud and sometimes everybody else steps up a little.
I’m glad we have them both for at least 3 years.
by fanslaststand on Jan 27, 2012 10:18 AM CST up reply actions
After last night's win, John Hollinger now gives the Wolves
a 31.8 percent chance of making the playoffs!
This is awesome
PTS/G: 95.6 (13th of 30) â–Ş Opp PTS/G: 94.3 (14th of 30)
SRS: 1.50 (15th of 30) â–Ş Pace: 92.9 (7th of 30)
Off Rtg: 102.9 (15th of 30) â–Ş Def Rtg: 101.5 (15th of 30)
Expected W-L: 10-8 (16th of 30)
They lead the league in the number of games decided by 4 points or less. They don’t get blown out much. They’re close. If they could find a way to get more minutes for Williams while having him be average or above or flip him for a guy who can play 30-35 mpg alongside of Love with above average production…bingo. Soooooo close.
as magical as the Offense has been
It’s the defense that Adelman has pulled a rabbit out of
http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub
by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 8:48 AM CST up reply actions
True
It’s just not a rabbit. It’s coaching. And had the team any semblence of an NBA coach last year the contrast would be less stark.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 9:12 AM CST up reply actions
And obvious coaching
I think you could have had someone who knew nothing about basketball coach the team last year better than Rambis based on nothing more than defensive shot charts and some spreadsheets. “That line…shots beyond it are worth 3.” Good to know.
We are in 100% agreement
I’m celebrating!
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 9:39 AM CST up reply actions
agreed
It’s just not a rabbit. It’s coaching.
=
It’s the defense that Adelman has pulled a rabbit out of
http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub
by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 10:23 AM CST up reply actions
It's just that the only illusion
Was pretending Kurt could coach in the NBA.
However, your point still stands!!!
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 10:44 AM CST up reply actions
Adelman also seems to be getting good performances out of just about everyone
No coach is going to be able to turn Royal Ivey into Michael Jordan.
But Darko is playing a more fitting role and has some good games (like last night). Pekovic is starting to avoid some of the errors that kept him off the floor last year while providing very high efficiency post scoring. Rubio and Williams are both off to promising starts as rookies, with Williams understandably less impactful due to the minutes crunch in the front court. Ellington is playing above my expectations. Luke has been thriving in the two PG alignment in more of a shooter’s role. And the team defense is light years ahead of last year.
I’d say Beasley, Wes, AR, and Tolliver all seem to be playing more poorly than last year. Not sure if his coaching style is not helping them, or if they are experiencing the normal ups/downs of an NBA season, or ? I suspect with Beasley and Tolliver it is normal statistical ups/downs. With AR, I’m not sure he has the BBIQ to thrive in Rick’s system. Wes is an enigma.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 26, 2012 9:49 AM CST up reply actions
I share all these sentiments
But then I go to the schedule and look at the rest of the season game by game and anything over 20 wins seems miraculous.
"pokin' the animals at the Canis Hoopus zoo"
by pastyearsears on Jan 26, 2012 10:51 AM CST up reply actions
that's really true
It’s hard for me to take off last year’s glasses, but these guys just beat Dallas twice. They’ve only been out of two games and haven’t been blown out once.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 11:09 AM CST up reply actions
I don't even want to defend my own argument
I’m a fan, a homer and not an expert, when I look ahead at the schedule the most objective question I can ask myself is “If I were a fan of the other team would I think my team should beat the wolves?” and then, “How good are the Wolves chances of winning each of these games?” For me it takes a lot of upsets to get to 500 or the playoffs or anywhere I want them to be. I end up just watching the games one at a time soaking up whatever pleasure I can. So far this year Cleveland, Toronto, and Houston have been downers, the others have left me feeling pretty good.
"pokin' the animals at the Canis Hoopus zoo"
by pastyearsears on Jan 26, 2012 11:43 AM CST up reply actions
What's the designated rookie extension?
Whizkid quotes Kahn saying the FO didn’t offer Love 5 yrs b/c of injuries and flexibility:
flexibility…allows us to play with the roster a little bit more down the road, and also there’s this new concept of a designated rookie extension. It just was very hard to rationalize giving it out 45 days into the CBA and not being able to use it again until 2017. That’s a long time. And so, you know, this was a close call. But I think that it had nothing to do with Kevin or his performance, I think we had to do what was in the best interest of the team.
So Kahn is saying that the team can only use the DRE on 1 player? And Love signing a five year deal would have exhausted the DRE? And that Love’s mini-Moses Malone production was insufficient to warrant using the DRE? Thereby implying that the team is going to save the DRE to use on Rubio or D-will or Malcolm Lee or some future rookie (when we don’t have a first round this year)?
If this is what Kahn is saying, I agree with the pessimists - that no halfway decent free agent is going to be happy to play for a small, cold city in a tiny media market - we shoulda used the DRE on Love. This 3/4 yr deal sucks sabertooth tiger balls…
by Los Lobos Del Bosque on Jan 26, 2012 8:44 AM CST reply actions
Yeah, not using his name
may have confused a few that he was possibly including Williams or a future first rounder. But that first rounder would have to be a 2012 first rounder to interfere with Love’s five-year deal (2013 draftee would be eligible at end of 2017, after the five years are up). So Williams, Rubio, and a pick that is 20% mid 1st and 80% nonexistent. Or Wes or Wayne. So yes, he’s just not saying Rubio’s name.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
Love deal not an F, not an A
It should have been an easy A — 5 years.
An F would be no deal, of course.
Gotta hope that the team makes great strides — contend for 8th seed this year, make playoffs with a 3 – 7 seed next year, and then contend for finals. Otherwise that 2014-2015 year will be all about “who are we gonna get to replace Love and Rubio?”
Enjoy it for at least 2 more years then….
signature
Derrick Rose Rule
I guess I was a bit surprised that according to reports, Love was anxious for an extension. My understanding of the CBA is that based on his experience (< 6 years) Love was guaranteed a maximum salary of $9MM or 25 % of the current cap ($14,511,000). I don’t know how his raises will be calculated – fixed rate or increase based on cap increase – but I suspect that this is how his total compensation will be in the $60 – $62MM range for the next 4 years.
I am curious if the DRR might have been available to him. It looks like he is a lock to make his 2nd all star game, which would have made him eligible for a maximum salary equal to 30% of the cap. He would have had to wait until the summer when he would become a RFA, but it seems to me that had he waited that his chances to earn a higher salary for a longer term might have been greater. The CBA states that only “a player coming off his rookie scale contract” qualifies for DRR status. Is Love still technically on his rookie scale contract? Or is there something that I am overlooking? Thanks.
No, he would not have been eligible for the Rose Rule
Because you have to be voted into the all-star game to qualify. He would have had to win the MVP this year to qualify.
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 26, 2012 9:10 AM CST up reply actions
I tend not to go against the consensus of the best basketball minds
on this site. But I for one wanted to save the five-year thing for Rubio. I think the single most important element to an eventual championship is our unicorn. SnP uses some faulty logic, implying that the advantage of being able to offer a fifth year is negated by state taxes (like those in MN, NY, CA, most anywhere in the NBA except Florida, where they have other fees). Even if MN were an exception, the logic doesn’t hold. The fifth year is still a big deal compared to only being able to offer four. In other words, if Wolves’ money wasn’t as good as, say, Orlando money, then the Wolves are really screwed if they can only offer four years.
But all the above assumes the Unicorn is truly magical. I think the consensus of these best basketball minds is that he is magical. And suddenly resorting to “only 18 games” seems trite after declaring your complete worship, love and submission to his golden aura.
The key to whether this is a good deal or not depends on 1) elements of Love’s contract, such as time of when he has to opt out of the 4th year (it could be any time after his second year), and when/how long they can extend him, and 2) future things we don’t know, such as whether this team looks like it could win a title, whether they add a piece, whether they keep Adelman a while longer, and of course, whether it’s the key to signing Rubio, which it might be.
I’ve never been an immediate gratification sort of guy, and it seems to me that it’s possible this could have been the optimal strategy. But again, I think Rubio is the key to winning a championship…Love just a very important part that could possibly be mostly replaceable in the right situation. I don’t think Rubio is, and I’m willing to forego the security of Love for five seasons over three…to go all-in with our unicorn.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 26, 2012 9:09 AM CST reply actions 4 recs
And amazingly...
…players like Dwight and LeBron and now Love all have had ETOs without the 5th year.
Good catch on the state taxes bit up top. I meant that to refer to 7.5 vs 4.5. Sloppy writing on my part. I’ll make an edit.
This shouldn't have any significant impact on signing Rubio.
Let’s pretend we used our 5-year designation on Love. Rubio would still be effectively forced to re-up with the Wolves for 3+1 or 4 years for the same reason that Love was. The teams has tons of leverage on post-rookie contracts. This leverage is above and beyond the designated player contract.
but doesn't having that 5th Year Option
Dramatically, and I mean dramatically increase the guaranteed money?
Can other teams offer 5 year deals? My understanding is that an outside team can only offer 4 year deals.
http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub
by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 9:22 AM CST up reply actions
only net
on a yearly basis, players can still get extended to the highest amount for 4 years on their rookie deal. love is getting paid as much as the team can give him…without the 5th year.
also, let’s say love extends to 6 and they do get to use the 5th year on rubio. how is that conversation going to happen with love the year after rubio gets 5?
the future is the future. pay now. no matter what, you get rookies for 7-8 years. they could have had love for 9 with 7-8 with ricky and williams (if they want to keep him) by just not being cute.
having Love signed to the 5 year slot
would have made negotiations with Rubio simpler too, as a 5 year contract wouldn’t even have been possible and in the discussion.
Love (with five) would be here for only one more year
After Rubio’s required five years. Plus, Love might be locked up longer if the extension is the way it goes.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 26, 2012 10:06 AM CST up reply actions
Oops, this was supposed to be in response to below
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 26, 2012 10:07 AM CST up reply actions
vjl110, your point here
is one I didn’t give enough thought or creedence to. You’re right, really. But then again, Ricky’s a different animal than American players…Minnesota’s about as far away from Spain as it gets (not just in distance). It’s possible we need every bullet in the arsenal. But you’re right that the first deal off the rookie contract generally hasn’t been a problem.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
Love (with five) would be here for only one more year
After Rubio’s required five years. Plus, Love might be locked up longer if the extension is the way it goes.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 26, 2012 10:07 AM CST up reply actions
I remained convinced up to the end
That the delay must have been on Love’s side because Wolves management couldn’t be that stupid. Alas, wrong again. I think that if the roles were reversed and they had been signing Ricky instead of Love it would have been the same four year bs. They weren’t saving the max for Ricky. It might be that there is all kinds of good business logic here, heaven knows I wouldn’t recognize it, but it seems penny wise dollar dumb just the same.
"pokin' the animals at the Canis Hoopus zoo"
by pastyearsears on Jan 26, 2012 11:10 AM CST up reply actions
Sad but true
Ricky would not be getting 5. It’s just too scary for the FO.
You lock up Love, Rubio is more likely to stay
Now you have a situation where both of their contracts end at the same time. They should have just signed Love.
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:50 PM CST up reply actions
Getting back to the game
One of the many things I like about Ricky is his ability to calmly run the 1/2 court offense despite increasingly fervent ball pressure and double teams. Dallas picked him up full court a few times I think, and doubled him fairly often. That he did not have more turnovers was a bit surprising. The ones he had were a result of trying to force a pass somewhere vs. getting it stolen.
This is especially useful when the Wolves have a lead. Last night I think we were up around 10 with about 5-6 minutes to go. This is an eternity in the NBA. Ricky’s deliberate, clock-eating 1/2 court offense, coupled with some good team defense, actually made those minutes fly pretty fast. It is like have a running game in football.
Much, much different than last year’s panic-mode “rush the ball up, make maybe one pass, then fire up a contested 18 footer”.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 26, 2012 9:39 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
Ricky's ball dominance reminds me a bit of Nash
Nash has the ball in his hands a lot, but it is for the purpose of running the offense and creating shots for his teammates.
Not saying Ricky is in the same stratosphere with Nash in terms of shooting.
However, Nash was never the defender that Ricky already is either.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 26, 2012 9:41 AM CST up reply actions
In other good news, Batum didn't get extended.
I think we actually have a chance to get him as an RFA.
I'm no expert,
but I think with Love’s new deal, we could have $10 million or so if we let Beasley, Webster, Miller, Randolph and Tolliver go. That ought to give us the room we’d need to sign Batum ($40 / 4 yrs?).
by Madison Dan on Jan 26, 2012 10:01 AM CST up reply actions
Ha!
Once again. Madison you MoFos.
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 26, 2012 10:02 AM CST up reply actions
Depends on the cap
but if they renounce everyone, they might wind up with $10 million or so. They could probably get a little higher.
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 26, 2012 10:01 AM CST up reply actions
Maybe
In order to have any real cap space, they are going to have to decline all their player options (Miller, Webster) and their QOs (Beasley, Randolph). That’s all fine with me, really
I've changed my sig. The Wolves are now like a reasonably decent meal.
by Eric in Madison on Jan 26, 2012 10:01 AM CST up reply actions
I think they can get down into the high 40s
I want them to trade now for Ray Allen and then throw a pile of money at Batum in the off season.
This would be ideal,
especially if we could get one non-expiring contract off to Boston in the process.
by Madison Dan on Jan 26, 2012 10:05 AM CST up reply actions
Probably not happening unless...
a) Boston likes Pek
or
b) Williams is included in the deal (which seems unlikely from both ends)
That would be awesome
But I would not want to trade Williams for Allen that is for sure.
Perhaps if they made those two moves they could trade Williams for an athletic center.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
by Wile E Coyote on Jan 26, 2012 10:09 AM CST up reply actions
What could we trade then?
I’m trying to think of what would have positive value… Pekovic? I like the guy but I’d be OK with having his salary off the books.
Otherwise… Tolliver? Ridnour? 2nd rounders? To have a shot at Ray we better be hoping the Celts are doing very badly at the trade deadline.
It's Danny Ainge
Beasley.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 26, 2012 10:18 AM CST up reply actions
Ah, good call
Beasley might be a little bit of a wild card. I could see a few GMs having a thing for him.
me too
A player’s trade value tends to erode with the fan base first. It isn’t always a reality.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 10:47 AM CST up reply actions
well since his value was somewhere between
2 2nd rounders (what we paid)
and less than nothing (what Toronto turned down to take him)
two years ago, when he was younger and had fewer minutes…
I’d say in Beasley’s case it’s the exact opposite, in that there are apparently still fans who for some reason think he has trade value.
Some one made a good case
that it might actually be higher.
Something like, Miami had to make a trade where they got no salary back and didn’t want to trade him to an East team or a good team in the West, have him blossom and come back to haunt them. So 2nd round picks where the only thing they could take back as 1st round picks have guaranteeing contracts.
i don’t remember exactly how it went, but it was a good argument for why he might have a little more trade value than what we got him for
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Camby
was traded from the Nuggets to the Clippers in 2008 for the opportunity to switch 2nd round draft picks.
What a team got at one point doesn’t determine what they can currently get. Shoot, Beasley may have a little value as an expiring contract if nothing else. He’s not worth much, but all you need is one team to make/accept an offer.
right
I agree
I have no clue. a 7 million dollar expiring could easily be worth a draft pick if a team is cap-strapped enough. Or he could be considered so toxic we’d have to trade a 2nd round pick to get him
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Beas + Wes
an expiring ‘wild card’ and Wes for Ray Allen.
works on trademachine.
Miluakee is the team I like
scoring deficient teams are the ones to target
Beasley+Wes for Larry Sanders and a first rounder
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:56 AM CST up reply actions
This is too much. Wes alone....
Is better than Gary Shandling
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 11:30 AM CST up reply actions
Dude check this out
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/sandela01.html
bizarre stat line to read, but 11 PER which is pretty blah, but .103 WS/48, 6% blk rtg
if there is a defensive sleeper out there in the NBA that could be very gettable for a cheap price…it might be this guy.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 11:50 AM CST up reply actions
I was trying to figure that out
comparing his Dx to BR he grew two inches (to 6’11") and put on 20 pounds (up to 235). I couldn’t find wingspan measurements but I think there’s a reasonable chance. I think they’re using him as Bogut’s backup so he’s worth investigating.
If they'll take him
I would try to move Beasley first since they score almost no points and Beasley at least showed enough hustle on D early this year that Skiles might buy into him. Then again, they already have Jennings to jack up shots so I doubt they bite but it’s worth a try.
Can he play the wing?
Because that’s a bigger need even before we send on Wes and Beas. Who do we have left to trade for a SG/SF?
Pekovic
Seems like we’d trade big for small, and vice versa, if we’re going to do small-time moves. Work with another team to balance both rosters type thing.
I'm really starting to think
Pek + Ridnour to the Blazers for Batum (and maybe Thomas) makes sense for both teams. They need an extra big to back up an aging Camby, we need a wing and they really need someone other than N. Smith to be their backup point guard.
I don't think
That even works with the money. Both Wolves make more money than Batum, and I don’t think Thomas makes much either.
by Vandelay Ind. on Jan 26, 2012 2:58 PM CST up reply actions
No!
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 3:01 PM CST up reply actions
gotta start somewhere
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
I've asked this elsewhere
but can Portland still sign and trade him now that the 25th has passed?
I don't know,
but I would guess not. I would also guess that we could still trade for him, so that we’d have the RFA matching rights.
by Madison Dan on Jan 26, 2012 10:43 AM CST up reply actions
That's a good point about the matching rights
That could make it worth it.
Let's give him a 5 year max
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:51 PM CST up reply actions
You can argue this all you want
But I believe Adelman had substantial input into the strategy. No one will EVER admit or verify this, but Kahn and Taylor are not going to ignore his opinion here.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
One thought re: team building after watching game
Remember when LeBron was holding court during his FA summer and requiring interested teams to bow down and pay homage? Team execs and players were doing it.
You know who wasn’t really doing it? DRose. He was noticeably reserved about the whole thing despite the Bulls being possible suitors and in need of wing scoring. He liked the guys on the team, he liked being “the man” on his team, and he wanted the ball to stay in his hands.
Right now Love is “the man” on this team, and the more Rubio handles the ball the better. I think the major roles that they’ve been thrust into are pleasing to them and a reason to stay long term.
So when assembling the team, the FO might want to keep this in mind. Picking up a SG who wants to have the ball a lot, pound it for 15 seconds, and shoot 30 times per game is probably going to cause issues.
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." -- Yogi Berra
(Good point, but...) Adelman is unlikely to want such a guy
And Kahn has shown he tries to get the coach what he wants.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 26, 2012 10:11 AM CST up reply actions
I agree with this
Too bad he wasn’t rewarded as such. Typically, when people get fancy new titles, they get the pay bump that goes with it. ;)
Instead of being like Rose (I know, he has his own special rule…but he’s still a max type guy) or even Westbrook, Love gets to be told, once again, he’s not an A1 option.
Defining an A1 option is important
I do think Love is a top 12 player in the league, better than Russel Westbrook at his position, capable of taking a game winning shot, worthy of a max contract, and a team can win a title with him as their best player.
That being said we still need to find a Ginobli to his Duncan. He hit a great, wide-open, set play to beat the Clippers in epic fashion which was awesome. But I’ve also seen him try to do that step back with John Luer in his face because he isn’t the guy to break someone down on the perimeter with the dribble.
He does have a limitation as a superstar and it’s important that is recognized in the discussions on how to “win now” as winning now will have a cap on how much we can win. My guess is ultimately this is why he didn’t get the 5 year deal, which I think is crap as you can find a player for cheaper than a max who can be the perimeter scoring threat Love and Rubio need (and potentially is already on the roster with the Thrilla) to win at a contender level.
Eric Gordon would be an excellent choice to solve this issue.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:22 AM CST up reply actions
What's your point?
And how is it any different than mine?
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:27 AM CST up reply actions
I believe I agree with you
Isn’t that what I said?
I wanted a 5 year so bad for Love. I think it’s actually worse for the Org than it is for Love. Love will opt out and get paid even more by us or someone else in 3 years…we could have locked him in for 5? you kidding me that would have been a steal
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:35 AM CST up reply actions
Not arguing
Just pointing to the contract to drive home the point. Came off as dickish arguing. My bad.
Cool
We agree on things sometimes, but we also have a history of debating. Which is cool and why I come here cause I like discussing Wolves in good place (I actually can’t stand talking Wolves with most other people outside of a few friends who also frequent this site, because the conversation is so watered down basketball talkers)
It’s tough to read into text sometimes especially when it could go either way in a convo with SnP ;)
But yeah. Love should have got a max, still gotta get a Ginobli type…but we’re close.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:39 AM CST up reply actions
I'm not quite sure what people are so upset about.
Even if Kevin Love leaves in 3 years, that’s still three championships for Minnesota. How much more do you guys want? Greedy…
Follow me on Twitter @timallenonline
by TimAllen on Jan 26, 2012 10:14 AM CST reply actions 4 recs
Don't forget nipple rings
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 7:07 PM CST up reply actions
Go no further!
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 7:56 PM CST up reply actions
lmao
I’m already out of character.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 11:30 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, but the pall hanging over the third
Will be difficult for me.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 26, 2012 10:15 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
good point
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:22 AM CST up reply actions
I've been wanting to ask a question
I know he’s not available, but is Wesley Matthews exactly the guy we want/need for this team, or am I missing something when watching him?
You can't...dust...for vomit.
He's solid
He is a bit over-paid, but the logical question is would it be worth it?
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:23 AM CST up reply actions
No, the logical question is
How in the world would you get him away from Portland.
Cool
I don’t think he’s a slam dunk acquisition…But I’d be interested in looking into it. He is over-priced and basically just solid. But I’m down if we can get him…if we can get him
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:58 AM CST up reply actions
What is amazing me..
Is how well the Wolves are playing without Beasley.
You gotta pay the troll toll, to get into this boy's soul.
twitter.com/JayAreW
Really?
For as big of a “I give Beasley a lot of leeway” guy as I am, dude was playing un-watchable basketball before he got hurt.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:31 AM CST up reply actions
This amazes you?
It would lead me, as a researcher, to study the relationship…with a covert hypothesis of cause-effect. Or you could read all the posts of of the last two years that state Beasley is detrimental to the idea of winning. Or did I just fall into a troll trap?
You can't...dust...for vomit.
by twinstalker on Jan 26, 2012 10:34 AM CST up reply actions
The record
With Beasley is 2-5. Without Beasley, 6-5.
by MarlonMaxeyEra on Jan 26, 2012 10:35 AM CST up reply actions
It is kind of interesting
how much easier the schedule has been since Mike went out. The Wolves are over .500 in 11 games and the best wins were over the Clippers without their best player and the Mavs without their best player. The other 4 wins were against teams that will compete against one another in the Anthony Davis Sweepstakes.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
Except!
No Love (2012 Love) and no Unicorn. Our best players then weren’t very good. The optimist in me says the team is just getting used to winning now. The realist in me has made the same post.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
Two things:
1) Beating bad teams is a clear sign of improvement;
2) The 08-09 Crew may have been a decent team that would have improved into something legitimately good. Jeff’s injury derailed that, Kahn took over, re-re-build, etc.
Just pointing out that this recent stretch without Beasley hasn’t been quite as rosy as some want to make it out to be. The early stretch of near-misses versus OKC and Miami, and convincing wins over (healthy) Spurs and Mavs seemed like better basketball. My hope is that Beasley comes back, shoots a little bit better than he was and the natural order of things on offense helps the team a little bit.
www.punchdrunkwolves.com
@PDWolves
by Andy G on Jan 27, 2012 9:19 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Interesting
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 27, 2012 10:30 AM CST up reply actions
Beasley would be a welcome addition with the lack of depth and wings they have.
Granted, he’s going to need to change his game, but it looked like he already understood that and was trying to do that before the injury.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 27, 2012 12:06 PM CST up reply actions
Beasley will prove you all wrong
And find his role. Let the magic happen.
I think you are correct
however I don’t believe it will happen with this team
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 10:55 AM CST up reply actions
Hi injury has been timed perfectly
Love and Rubio set up their roles, everyone else has to fit in with that.
Beas will be better than any other SF we have by a lot.
We talk about Love and the pressure he was under with the contract but forget about the pressure Beas is under for the same thing. He either fits in, finds his role and gets paid… or he stands to lose a load of cash.
I think Derrick Williams has already been better
and as many posters point out he might not even be a real small forward.
Williams can do offensively everything Beasley can do, but he does it better and smarter and he’s only a rookie.
Even if he isn’t a long-term plan at SF, he’s a much better option right now
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 11:07 AM CST up reply actions
Not even close in my book
When he’s on, Beasley is better in every facet.
The questions is if he’s on, and how well does he know he role. When he was playing d and driving before he got hurt, he got the makings of a great new role.
by Rodman99 on Jan 26, 2012 11:27 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'd argue Williams has cost us as many wins as Beasley did
I believe he’s the one who let Wade get the oop that Adelman warned him to watch for, no?
Beasley at 3 > Williams at 3.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 26, 2012 11:54 AM CST up reply actions
Yeah sure
he also hit a huge three in that game too that kept us in it. Idk
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
I'm not arguing against DWill
I personally think we need all the skilled players we can have. I want to see us improve with a free agent SG (Wilson Chandler; if we overpay he’s ours) and then keep a deep team.
My point is Beasley is a good player. He’s got to relearn his role. He can still light it up, he just needs to get his mojo back.
by Rodman99 on Jan 26, 2012 2:13 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Rubio playing more is the difference
The turnovers hurt because he’s not getting player movement he needs to make easier passes, but his bbiq is higher than anyone else on the court.
Last night he had two steals where he just crept behind Mavs players to slip into the passing lane. The passer never saw him, but Ricky saw the passer, the Mav with his back turned and his own man he had to defend. You can’t teach this.
If you saw that pass to Love in the 2nd quarter that Love had blocked by Beaubois you’ll see what I mean. Rubio’s court vision is just spectacular. He goes for loose balls when I lot of players just stand and watch things happen. He gets finger tips on the ball, but this is all you need to deflect. What you must have are teammates with the same desire to go get that ball too.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jan 26, 2012 10:55 AM CST up reply actions
TOs
It seems like since he’s taken on the starting PG role and ramped up his minutes, our TOs as a whole have gone down. I’ll gladly have him take the hit on TOs if it means others have to make less decisions with the ball and our team TO rate goes down as a result.
by Rascal Flatts on Jan 26, 2012 2:47 PM CST up reply actions
Interesting point
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 4:39 PM CST up reply actions
In the end, the two sides compromised on a four-year contract worth nearly $61 million that gives Love the option to become an unrestricted free agent after the third season. “I wanted to be here,” Love said. "I love Minnesota. I love the Minneapolis-St. Paul area. I love the fans. Everyone who has been around me the last four years knows that. Obviously, the cold weather is tough at some points, but the fans have been so great. “There were some naysayers in my career, even before draft night, after draft night. But the fans have been with me since Day 1, so I thank them. That message is really heartfelt and sincere.” Minneapolis Star-Tribune
I think Love loves Minnesota and likes the “direction” it appears we are headed in. He might hate his Boss, but he did what was best for the team. Which is freaking awesome. He could have gotten his diva on and waited this thing out to summer, but he realizes there could be something good here.
Hate this deal, but it gives Love 3 years to see if we can actually do anything in this place he likes…and if not he can opt out when he is still young. Good deal for him, bad deal for us
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Couple points are overlooked in all the drama
- Rubio is here: Howard has Rashad Lewis? Lebron had Mo Williams? Bosh had Bagnoli? CP3 had no one. We got Ricky “freakin” Rubio. That counts for A LOT.
- The big three in Miami and aftermath shake-up were pretty unusual circumstances. Not many teams can just clear up cap room and sign guys to max deals. Just doesn’t happen very often. My point? Why worry about it. Seriously, name all the times this happened.
- Owners want shorter deals and Taylor towed the party line. It looks bad now, but it will prove to be the norm over time.
Did I mention we have Ricky Rubio!!!
by Rodman99 on Jan 26, 2012 10:36 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
Wolves should go ultra hard
after Gordon and Batum in free agency. Both guys are on teams that it doesn’t appear likely they would match an offer.
Minnesota is becoming an attractive place to play.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
A couple of notes
Wes is almost out of – WS/48 if he has even a reasonable game friday he could be out of it!!!!
vj110 gave me crap the other day cause I said “Williams was before the Houston game above .100 ws” because Williams was at like .9 at the time and vj110 said “whatever he was he isn’t now.” so I’m just gonna be a playful douche and point out that Williams is again over .1 :-p (gotta stick up for my boy)
Nikola Peckivic is a very solid backup center, probably should be starting….but here is my logical train of thought….at what point does he become trade bait? Do we have the makings of a “package” with Ridnour, Pekavic and Randolph and maybe Beasley’s expiring contract…or is that still wishful thinking/do we even want to deal Ridnour and Pek since they are become reasonably effective players?
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Pek
should be starting on our team….not necessarily starting on all NBA teams
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 11:03 AM CST up reply actions
Honestly Pek is playing so well
That I want a good player back if we deal him. He + Ridnour are two very capable players that many teams would like to have and I want a starter back in return. That’s also roughly $8mil/year in salary so we would surely be able to afford a Batum/Okarfor/Gordon if those two are part of the deal.
Yeah
trade value is hard to gauge with guys like that, fringe level starters that would absolutely boost a playoff team but aren’t really slam dunk starters can go for anything really.
I don’t think Gordon would be a deal just cause N.O. has no chance of making the playoffs. But Batum is in the realm of possibility as they might be looking to bolster the bench
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 11:09 AM CST up reply actions
I know you are just having fun...
but for clarity’s sake, the issue of 0.09 vs. 0.1 is much less important than using season finder to lump a player with better players, rather than places ego at the mean.
BTW… here is your list using his new WS/48. I should note that this is a pretty good list. Almost everyone on the list became a decent to good player. No superstars however.
by vjl110 on Jan 26, 2012 11:18 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Haha
It’s cool man.
I’m sticking up for my guy, you’re trying to bring reality into the equation which is totally welcomed (as I need it)
I don’t know that I think Williams will be a superstar…however could he be a perfect counterpart to Love and that offensive option we need on the perimeter? I think that is an absolute possibility with his upside. But he’s my guy, love him in college. Still like him in the pro’s he has a little more rust than I thought he would but he still looks solid.
Good stuff though, let’s see where the end of the year rolls. If Williams gets to like .137 I might have to make a point of it, and if he drops to like .07 I will surely not make mention of it but instead make a ton of excesses and then two years from now tell everyone “we should have traded him when we had the chance”
:-p
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 11:45 AM CST up reply actions
God he is that bad huh?
Kid’s got a long ways to go. And may never even get there.
Didn’t hate him in the role he was in last night though. Not saying much for the 4th pick in the draft but just kind of a “get in there and don’t do anything outside of what we’re asking you to do” type role for 20 minutes looked a lot more appealing than the 35 minutes of “we need you to be as good as the other teams starters” type role he’s been in the last year and a half.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 11:47 AM CST up reply actions
He still looks pretty bad
Yesterday he had a moment where Rubio skip passed it to him for a wide open shot in the corner which he declined, instead pump faking no one and taking two pointless dribbles toward the basket before turning it over trying to pass back to the perimeter. It was awful.
He may have also hit
the proverbial “dagger in the coffin” shot with that like 13 footer he hit when we were up by about 10 with like 2:30 left
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 12:05 PM CST up reply actions
I don't want to trade Pek. I just don't. Anyone else.
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 2:58 PM CST up reply actions
This!
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 3:01 PM CST up reply actions
And again, the more minutes he gets, the more refs will "get" him, and the more successful he will be
If he didn’t get called for 3 seconds randomly, as well as dumb fouls, he probably would have already had a few 20 point games this year
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 3:05 PM CST up reply actions
I agree that Love should've got the fifth year.
But I’m really, really hoping that all the threads don’t devolve into this kind-of “Oh Noes!” type thing.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Jan 26, 2012 11:44 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
I think we gotta get over it
Contract is signed. Hopefully Love forgets about how crappy his bosses are as we keep winning and then want to stay around longer 3 years from now
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 26, 2012 11:46 AM CST up reply actions
I think we'll all feel better if we look at EG
hopefully not in a Pacers uni though
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Love
Was all over the place on defense last night (in a good way). There were a few possessions where he was on Terry/Beaubois looking uncharacteristically active and agile. The weight loss really has helped on defense.
Garbage pail Love, indeed.
The hard pick on Roddy deserves another look:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_-QAlBrMac
basketball-reference has Love's DRtg at 99
which is an improvement over his career avg of 108.
Advanced stats gurus: how much of DRtg has to do with overall team defense— can it be relied upon as an indicator of individual defense?
The league leaders in DRtg seem to be the anecdotal “good defenders”…
by mayorhoiberg on Jan 26, 2012 12:01 PM CST up reply actions
He's playing good team D
showing hard on screens, and switching off on wings, chasing them out at the 3 pt line without getting burned badly on drives. He’s showing good help D on discouraging penetration, but still isn’t great on stopping or altering shots on players that do challenge him in the lane.
I just hate
that teams aren’t rewarded for identifying and drafting cornerstone players.
This isn’t giving Gilbert Arenas a 6 year deal after 2 knee surgeries, this is extending a 23 year old Love and a 25 year old Rubio to deals that help to solidify and extend their relationship to a team, which will hopefully be a career long relationship.
If there’s been any trend that I think should frustrate the league, it’s the relative lack of career cornerstone players where young players bolt their squad during the peak of their talents (Lebron, Bosh, Deron, CP3, Melo, STAT) from teams that wanted to keep them.
That isn’t a good thing for building a fanbase. It’s nice if you’re at one of the places where the star doesn’t bolt (Chicago, Miami, LAC, LAL, OKC) but it sucks for the rest of the league.
Also, OKC gets to sign both of their building blocks to 5 year deals? That’s ridiculous, Clay Bennett has to be blackmailing Stern at this point.
well yeah
i know it’s legal, but it just highlights the ridiculousness of only being able to sign 1 guy to that deal for the rest of the league.
It would be like SLC having to decide whether Stockton or Malone got the 5 year deal, Chicago having to extend Pippen for only 4 years or the Celtics deciding between Parish, McHale and Bird.
It’s not terribly common to have 2 or 3 young difference makers at that level, but it’s not like it’s amazingly uncommon and when you have talent like Durant, Westbrook, Love and Rubio, teams should be able to sign those guys long term.
OKC should be able to offer Harden 5 years if they think that’s going to make their team better. and if you extend Eddy Curry, Ben Gordon and Luol Deng (Baby Bulls) to long term deals and it doesn’t work, well that’s life too.
rule of thumb:
first guy gets 5. Second guy gets 4. It seals up the combo for the maximum number of years with no hard feelings, as each player is offered the max they can be given. It’s not that complicated.
Everyone understands the Bird Rights
well, the first player on a rookie scale to be worth the max has Bird In The Hand Rights. It’s in the CBA, look it up.
side note
man, how did the Bulls screw up with Curry, Gordon, Deng, Chandler, Hinrich, Nocioni and they still screwed it up.
That team should have been pretty damn good (is also a possible argument against collecting too many guys that are going to get paid at the same time)
Thank heavens they have David Stern
As their emergency personnel director.
You can't...dust...for vomit.
Nothing will be good enough for the fans...
…but the bottom line is that Kevin Love isn’t an idiot. The Wolves have a long history of blowing themselves up every time they looked like they had something good going. Kevin Love is thinking to myself “do I want to, one day, be the 35 year old backup power forward on my first championship team elsewhere…or do I want to be the big star power forward in his prime on a championship team, whether its in Minnesota or elsewhere?”
The organization just doesn’t have the clout or established trust to lock up their players long term. We all know that, but for some weird reason, we can’t accept it.
So you just don't believe Love when he says that he wanted to sign for 5 years,
or the Wolves when they say they didn’t want to offer it?
by Madison Dan on Jan 26, 2012 12:42 PM CST up reply actions
Not possible.
The 5 year rookie extension is very specific. It can only be a max contract with no early term, player or team options.
600 N First Ave "like a Pirate's cove".
Hollinger pipes in:
And for what? So they can keep a “designated player” option around for Ricky Rubio? We don’t even know whether Rubio is a max-caliber player, let alone one worthy of signing to a five-year deal three years from now. And if Love is already gone by then, what’s the point?
Rather than beginning to cement the core of one of the most improved teams in basketball, Minnesota started the clock ticking on its best player’s departure. Love’s family is from Southern California, and the Lakers won’t have any contracts in three years; you do the math. Yes, Love could extend the deal before then, but he’d be able to extend it by only two seasons in 2014; he might decide it’s better off to force a trade and re-sign (or extend) in his new digs.
At best, the Wolves have created some needless drama for the next two seasons in return for a dubious advantage of paying Love for three years instead of for five. On a day when nearly every other decision made perfect sense, this one still has me scratching my head in bewilderment.
by LoveTo on Jan 26, 2012 12:56 PM CST reply actions 3 recs
I haven't followed the Love situation, but do you really get the feeling that he will try to pull a Lebron or Paul to get back to LA?
I’m hoping him and Rubio stick around so ESPN has to show more of the small market teams instead of focusing on LA and Miami. If us small market teams can’t keep star players we draft, then we won’t stand a chance vs the LA’s and NY’s of the NBA.
by SharkKings49 on Jan 26, 2012 1:07 PM CST up reply actions
I get the feeling he wanted to stay here - because he and the wolves both said so
and the team told him ’we’ll get back to you on that in 3 years, okay?’
It’s so refreshing to see a star player, who could totally cash in in LA, actually prefer to sign the long deal and stay with his team. It’s completely on the Wolves if he goes.
FWIW Kevin was just on Chad Hartman
and he was saying all the right things, without hesitation and without any bullshit alerts going off.
paraphrasing “i see this as a 4 year deal with the opportunity to sign a 3 year, a 4 year even a 5 year extension down the road, i’m looking at this as a long term commitment.”
http://loisaidabbclub.tumblr.com/
Twitter: @loisaidabbclub
by beatsandpeasnyc on Jan 26, 2012 2:18 PM CST up reply actions
Kevin Love is a champ
Bless his soul
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Expensive
A $1500 pack of gum.
He’s back to his old self, eating everything in site and jumping fences while still somehow managing to be lovable…but just barely at this point.
But is he better? Faster? Stronger?
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 3:44 PM CST up reply actions
That would be epic.
But would the kids understand? Hehe.
"Oh my, oh my, oh my. Is that great basketball or what?" --Hubie Brown, Jan. 20, 2012
by Cynical Jason on Jan 26, 2012 3:50 PM CST up reply actions
Amazing how effective
$61 million dollars are at helping a guy tow the party line.
In fairness, he knows he’s going to make more money than he knows what to do with. And if he stays healthy, he’ll make a boatload more.
Good news. Always got to respect a star that stays in a small market.
by SharkKings49 on Jan 26, 2012 3:00 PM CST up reply actions
Sorry
but this is not a small market. Not unless you think there are only a dozen real cities in the U.S.
The Twin Cities aren’t just a big metro area, this is the sports hub for the Dakotas and Iowa as well. (If Minnesotans could ever get over themselves, they’d sell a lot more tickets to Iowans but I now how much you folks cherish your cheerleader jokes)
Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!
by TMiss on Jan 26, 2012 4:14 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Maybe not "small market"
but it isn’t a place that the superstars want to go to if they have the option to go to a major media market. While the area can support multiple sports teams, it just isn’t that desierable of an area for stars to play in. Howard could push this team up to par with the Thunder, but I don’t expect him to even give the Wolves a look when he has Dallas, LA and Brooklyn trying to get him.
Nothing against the Twin Cities area (and the other states they cover), but I lump that region in with some small market teams that struggle to get big FA’s and consider the Wolves to be one of the many teams that should benefit from the new CBA.
by SharkKings49 on Jan 26, 2012 4:34 PM CST up reply actions
The Twin Cities are a mid-major market. Yeah, they're not Chicago LA or NY, but they are in the tier below there
I think the Wolves are just looked at as a bad destination because the NBA season is during wintertime (not so for MLB or most of NFL season—Vikes and Twins have no problem spending) and the front office has shown itself to be inept over the years
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 4:49 PM CST up reply actions
That probably has a lot to do with it
When the stars come to visit the Wolves, they have to go during the snow and ice and get a bad impression based on that.
by SharkKings49 on Jan 26, 2012 5:41 PM CST up reply actions
Time to ramp up
the global warming tourism ads: MINNESOTA! NOW WITH LESS SNOW (AND MORE MOSQUITOES)
But back to the market thing, some of the TV stations here go statewide and I was shocked the last time I went to Canada to discover that the motels all have the Twin City channels on cable. For a city of 2-3 million people, the Twin Cities culturally dominates an area with a population of 12 million people or more. Yes, more ads for brats than ribs, but consumers are consumers.
Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!
Damn
Really?
That’s nuts. Minnesota channels in Canada, who’d have thunk..
Look at map of Canada
that area north of Minnesota? Ain’t nothin’ there but Winnipeg off to the side but let’s not talk numbers because Canada ain’t got none. Very big place but not a lot of peeps.
Yo ho ho and a FirstRow stream!
I don't mean to be a negative nancy
But what did you expect him to say?
“Yeah, I’ll see what this team is doing in 3 years and then probably bolt if we’re not championship level”
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 3:04 PM CST up reply actions
I'd expect him to say less
I really thinks he likes it here and he is quite the big fish.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 4:43 PM CST up reply actions
I'm not too optimistic on this front
Love was pretty ticked about this bit. Here’s his brother on the Twitter machine:
Collin Love @CollinLove Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
Nice of the @MNTimberwolves to rent @kevinlove for 3 years.
Collin Love @CollinLove · Open
“……Minnesota started the clock ticking on its best player’s departure” @johnhollinger has all the right views in that article.
i just think here he is a number one
If he left for LA or title contender he’d almost certainly be second fiddle to a highlight reel.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 6:04 PM CST up reply actions
I think we agree
Win and it’s moot. (I hope)
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 7:10 PM CST up reply actions
Ehhhh
LeBron won in Cleveland though.
I’m not saying Love is mindset the same as LeBron….but LeBron won, D12 won in Orlando, both guys went to the finals.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
voodoo
Lebron did not have rubicube.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 11:33 PM CST up reply actions
I agree
I’m just saying, winning is not everything for everyone.
But, I like Love I believe that he love’s Minnesota and if we win he’ll stay
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 27, 2012 10:31 AM CST up reply actions
he might hate his boss though
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 27, 2012 10:32 AM CST up reply actions
Just looked at that, he got in a nice little argument with hoopshype
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 5:21 PM CST up reply actions
So when do we look to trade him?
Lol is basically what I am reading here.
It looks like all we’ve done is maximize his trade value for the next three years if the tone of these tweets is accurate
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Well, even if he feels this way right now (I don't doubt it), his tone might change in a few years
if we’re good. Who knows. I don’t expect it, and I do expect him to flee as soon as he can, but I would like it if he stayed.
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 8:21 PM CST up reply actions
so true
Today has little to do with tomorrow.
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 26, 2012 11:41 PM CST up reply actions
I'm just joking
hope I’m wrong :)
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Jan 27, 2012 10:31 AM CST up reply actions
Anything anyone says on Love's side or on the Wolves side is BS right now
Check back in 3 years. See if this has followed the same trend that has been taking place over the past 3 or 4 years. Carmelo, Amare, Dwight, Deron, LeBron.
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 3:02 PM CST up reply actions
Hollinger nails it on the head
90% of the crap I say on here is sarcastic
by CoffeeJanitor on Jan 26, 2012 3:01 PM CST up reply actions
About the game...
A few observations:
- It was noticeable how much Dirk’s absence helped the Wolves D; they were able to sag in the paint more and keep their bigs closer to the hoop, leading to more blocks and DRebs.
- They were able to pull away by making more free throws than usual and playing D w/o fouling. Dallas wasn’t getting screwed; the Wolves knew when to use their hands.
- That said, every time I expected Dallas to knock down a momentum-changing 3, they couldn’t do it. Terry and Beaubois combined 1-10. It turned a within-striking-distance game into a cruise-control win.
- Their quick strikes were well-timed. The 8-0 run to end the half, including 6-0 in the final 30 seconds, was fun to watch.
- They understood that the primary value of having Pek on the floor is his paint scoring, and they made him a primary option offensively. That doesn’t always happen when a good offensive player isn’t one of the best players, but they fed the hot hand and were rewarded with 5 offensive boards.
The good news is hopeful doesn't mean dumb. The bad news is cynical doesn't mean smart. -- Sarah Silverman
by pagingstanleyroberts on Jan 26, 2012 1:22 PM CST reply actions
Sorry if I missed this, but...
does anybody know how soon the Wolves and Love would be able to negotiate on an extension to the 4 year deal? Would it only be after he used his “out” clause?
6 months early right?
Wolves 2011-12: Crossing the Rubikahn....alea iacta est...... " et tu Ricky?"
by Tangerine dream on Jan 27, 2012 11:37 AM CST up reply actions

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