New J.R. In Minnesota
by GaryCraigTrentSmith on Feb 12, 2012 11:21 AM CST
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J.R. Smith's Chinese team has been mathematically eliminated from the postseason. Smith will be eligible to sign a contract as an unrestricted free agent "shortly after" his team's last regular season game on February 15. There is still uncertainty about where he will land, but Smith will serve as a volume scorer regardless of what team he winds up with this year. He's been connected to the Clippers, Lakers, Knicks, Thunder and Timberwolves. Smith averaged 12.3 points, 4.1 rebounds, 1.2 steals and 1.6 treys in 25 minutes per game with Denver last season.
This is the first bit of speculation I've heard suggesting the Wolves may be involved in Smith's pursuit - though obviously this smacks of baseless rumor. The idea intrigues me nonetheless.
Two strongly opposed schools of thought to consider here.
1) Smith is immature and batty (could be genetic), and regardless of ability, is too much of a chemistry liability to join a young team fighting for a playoff spot and building for the future.
2) Smith presents exactly the skill set the Wolves need so badly - a scoring, slashing, athletic wing with unlimited range. Let's take our chances.
I lean toward the latter - always enjoyed watching J.R. play, warts be damned. But admittidly, this guy's character and commitment are major concerns. I also know nothing about the kind of contract J.R. will require and if it will make sense to the Wolves' bottom line.
What does Canis Hoopus think?
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I want him if the price is reasonable..
better than Mayo and Marrow in my opinion. Not as good as Batum or Harden obviously, but JR would be great along side Rubio with Adelman hopefully getting through to him.
I basically agree...
Although I am not sure I like him better than Batum. I wish we would have kept Delonte instead. Guy can defend, play both guard positions, and hit 3’s. Plus he would be cheaper. Don’t want May or Morrow at all.
Timberwolves' record: Undefeated (5-11, if you go by so-called "Advanced Stats")
good point
Why does no one ever mention that this team had beno udrih and delonte west at different times? Just completely overlooked that we have had some decent pieces here that we deliberately moved along. I don’t recall CH posters making any fuss at the time about this.
Smith is a player that George Karl had a difficult time dealing with. Karl is a good coach. I don’t think he would want him back. That’s enough for me to shy away. He’s a plus with too many minuses. Hopefully Malcolm Lee will be given an opportunity to blossom on his return from the D-League.
by ogishkemuncie on Feb 12, 2012 9:56 PM CST up reply actions
I would roll the dice
If the price was cheap enough that it wouldn’t hurt to stick him at the end of the bench if he messes with chemistry. I’d bet he’s not that cheap, though.
If the Wolves are in on Smith, it's news to Smith
Via JR’s Twitter page:
NYK? LAL? LAC? CHI? ORL? iNDI?
28A23716 Come find out!
by GaryCraigTrentSmith on Feb 12, 2012 11:52 AM CST reply actions
I have no idea what 28A23716 means
Maybe it’s code for TWolves! ;)
by GaryCraigTrentSmith on Feb 12, 2012 11:53 AM CST up reply actions
Yeah. He ain't coming here.
He is going to go to a contender\big market for a half year rental. I am hoping the Knicks because then they might have to dislodge one of their wings in the process. I’d be up for Landry Fields or something.
I'm sure he'll end up in NY
The big stage, reunited with Melo, etc.
It would have to be for the pro-rated remainder of the MLE - about 2.5M
I’d do it. He’s a knucklehead, but Adelman has a history of being able to work with knuckleheads. And he’s a much better player than Mayo.
Would JR pick us? He’d probably have the best chance to “showcase” himself for his next contract playing for us. He’d get all the playing time and shot attempts he could handle with our death at the wing.
not worth it
Admittedly, I often do like the roll of the dice with a ‘character issue’ player, but this team is too young. We are just about to have our first winning season. We might play in some big games at the end of the year, we have two guys really coming into their own, and it just isn’t the right time for a guy like this. Maybe next year or the one after, but we need a lot more solidity first.
by TO12 on Feb 12, 2012 12:36 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Let's not put the cart before the horse here.
We MAY have a winning season, but right now teams seem to be catching up to what we can and can not do. And our lack of wings – especially SGs is becoming more glaring by the game.
JR isn’t going to poison guys like Love or especially Rubio (who has been a Pro about as long as JR has). If Adelman can work with guys like Artest and Bonzi, he can work with JR.
just don't think it's worth it
Not now. Matter later. Honestly, there isn’t a ton to gain at the moment
by TO12 on Feb 12, 2012 2:16 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Why later?
We need to win now. We don;t have a draft pick, so we gain nothing by losing, and we need to start showing Love we’re serious at this very moment.
honestly
We don’t.
I want to win, I want playoffs, I am not going to root against any of that, believe me.
But you know what we really need? Time and continuity. Now don’t get me wrong, we shouldn’t hang onto our shitty players just for the sake of keeping everyone. And in not saying we can wait years and years either. But there is really no reason to bring in a temp guy like JR for a few extra wins now. Really, leave him to a desperate contender.
by TO12 on Feb 12, 2012 2:27 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
I wouldn't cry about JR
But I just don’t think he helps us enough to warrant the move.
by TO12 on Feb 12, 2012 2:29 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
You bring him in now,
because if he turns out to be a good fit for the roster, you have a good shot at resigning him to a longer deal.
If he doesn’t you let him walk. But at least you actually tried out a REAL shooting guard.
and much better than Mayo?
Not sure about that
by TO12 on Feb 12, 2012 12:37 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Much better.
OJ: .533 TS%, .496 eFG%, 2.2 ORB%, 9.7 DRB%, 5.9 TRB%, 13.4 AST%, 1.7 STL%, 12.5 TOV% .070 WS/48
JR: .547 TS%, .515 eFG%, 2.4 ORB%, 11.0 DRB%, 6.7 TRB%, 14.2 AST%, 2.0 STL%, 11.5 TOV% .089 WS/48
Add in that JR has the size and length to properly play the position
by Simitar on Feb 12, 2012 12:51 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
better
Not ‘much better’
Anyways, JR is older and a proven head case. You don’t know what your getting. And the height difference doesn’t matter if you aren’t playing any defense.
by TO12 on Feb 12, 2012 2:15 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
2 years older.
We could resign him to a 4 year deal and he’d STILL be in his prime at the end of it.
And yeah, he is much better. Those shooting #s and WinShare are significantly better.
There will be money to spare
at the conclusion of this year w/ Beasley, Randolph, and Tolliver probably not getting re-signed. Throw in an amnesty player and there should be some money on the table. Give JR a look and see if he would be viable for a longer deal after the season concludes.
by Stabby Stabby on Feb 12, 2012 4:51 PM CST up reply actions
OJ Mayo right now has a .111 WS/48
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Feb 13, 2012 10:17 AM CST up reply actions
According to basketball-reference, he has a .100
JR last year had a .121 – and 4 of the last 5 years he’s been over 1.2. On the other hand .100 is a clear career high for Mayo.
But I MUCH prefer Wins Produced over Win Shares. And NBA Geek has Mayo at .91 for WP (averaged SG is .99).
JR Smith had a .153 WP/48 last year.
An excellent piece on the Wins Produced metric:
For example, in Wins Produces, Rubio is much more highly ‘rewarded’ for his play than in Win Share – Barea and (especially) Ridnour are much closer in responsiblity for wins (per minute) as Rubio is.
WS/48 / WP/48:
Rubio: .120 / .202
Luke: .103 / .074
Barea: .081 / .033
OJ Mayo is having a pretty good season man
I am all for JR Smith but the OJ Mayo not being a good player take has gotten so watered down at this point. He’s been ridiculously effective in the NBA and there hasn’t been a single word of trouble out of his mouth or coming out of the team.
Mayo is a good player and he is a guy who has learned to accept a role, which to me spells super positivity about acquiring him and moving forward with him as a building block in the future.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mayooj01.html
guy is having a good season and is pretty effective in almost all areas right now.
JR Smith might have more of the proverbial talent than Mayo, but Mayo is playing well in the NBA and is not looking to be a knucklehead at the moment either (although he has had a fair amount of knucklehead episodes in the past)
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Clarification
when I said “OJ Mayo has been ridiculously effective in the NBA”
I meant that THIS SEASON (not career) Mayo has been very effective in his role with the Grizzlies, in the NBA, while Smith has been playing in China
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
No one is saying Mayo isn't good.
Just that JR is better and won’t cost us (likely) a draft pick and a player to get.
ehhh
I’d say plenty of people still lay Mayo with the stigma of being a gunner who doesn’t do a whole lot. He’s changed his game up quite a bit. Good player. would be incredible here with Rubio
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
I agree with this take
it all depends on what it would take to get him. I think he’s less of a headcase than JR and thus would prefer him.
not sure if I want JR,
he s great at scoring but the problem is that we also need somebody at the wing able to stop opponents,I don t know how much he could help in this area…
The problem is that
the player you are describing isn’t on this squad. Smith is definitely a better option than Ridnour, Barea, Ellington, or Webster at the SG. Not even close… offensively and defensively. Maybe Webster will come around… he is still fresh off the IR
by Stabby Stabby on Feb 12, 2012 1:40 PM CST up reply actions
But not well.
He’s another guy that can’t put the ball on the floor, is spotty on defense and really is best as a catch and shoot guy.
I'd take him
But likely only on a half year, or 1.5 year rental. He can shoot from anywhere, and definitely provides an upgrade on offense. On defense, he’s not likely to bring much to the table, BUT neither does what we currently have, so anyway you look at it, he’ll at least add something to the table.
I’d prefer someone like Batum as well, but that’s obviously not happening until next year if ever. JR Smith doesn’t guarantee us a playoff spot, but with at least a semi competent wing, it’ll guarantee that will be in the mix.
I feel it would help too, because they can run Ridnour more as the back up point, and spell Ricky a small bit more. His numbers were far better when he was coming off the bench, playing less minutes. Could just be small sample size, but it could be Ricky is not fully used to playing 35+ mpg professionally. Ridnour is better served as only occasionally sliding to the 2 guard, not majority of the time.
I like your nurses uniform guy. ...They're OR scrubs. Oh are they?
I see no reason
why we wouldn’t at least try to bring in a free agent at a clear position of need. It is a unique opportunity to acquire a player mid season without giving anything up. As long as the price isn’t over the top high it seems like a no brainer that we would at the very least give him a call and gauge his interest.
Wilson Chanlder
would be my choice between the two, but I would take Smith
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
He could probably play some 3
so why not :)
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
by VoodooMagic on Feb 13, 2012 10:19 AM CST up reply actions
I'd only sign him for this year, but I would spend as much as possible to do it.
He’s the legit-sized 2guard who can bury open jumpers we need.
by googoleeoottooooleeoottooooleeeatta on Feb 12, 2012 1:37 PM CST reply actions
can I ask why here on CH everybody seem so in love with Batum?
He s a nice player,but is not a stud and the problem with Batum is that is gonna take a trade (unlikely since we have nothing interesting for Portland) or overpay in free agency next summer to get him…isn t easier to go after people like Rudy Fernandez (not huge fan,still ha can ball and is big friend of RR), OJ (like his shot) or even Dudley (best defender and team player of all of them)?? they aren t also game changer but I feel they can be functional in Adelman’s system without requiring the big payday that Batum would imply…
Batum is my man-crush
for certain. He defends 1-4 on the court which is very helpful for protecting other players defensively. He can shoot from 3 and he fits well in this offense because he is smart and does not need the ball to be effective. He would be a lob machine with Ricky on back cuts, and once Love figures out that pass to the cutter from the high post that Miller knows how to throw- well, Batum would be beautiful on the receiving end.
I too am a lone wolfpack.
good points
It’s tough though. Not many 2 guard options in the entire league, let alone ones that might be available.
For my money I like OJ probably as much as Batum, but I think Batum’s potential still has people a little more excited.
Anyways, it’s a crapshoot. Really not many legit 2 guards anywhere. Any team that really needs one will have to overpay or luck out in the draft. That’s one of the reasons that we have held onto the Wes/Webster/Ellington dream for so long, unfortunately.
by TO12 on Feb 12, 2012 2:22 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
For me, it's not potential, it's production.
Batum has size for his position, scores efficiently, doesn’t turn it over much, and rates well in WS, WP, ORTG, and DRTG. Looking at his advanced stats and comparing them to what the Wolves have on the wing should explain it all. It’s been discussed over and over here for the last several months.
How badly do we need a SG?
In our last 3 games, our starting SG has gone:
2-7 for 5 points.
2-8 for 5 points.
1-8 for 2 points.
Webster has given us 8 total points over the past 3 games.
Ellington has given us 2 total points over the past 3 games.
Barea has had 1 good game, 1 decent game and 1 horrible game.
Neither is Luke or Webster.
Or really Ellington for that matter.
We need to decide on either Luke or JJ. Both guys are best suited as an offensive spark off the bench. I’d keep JJ because he at least tries to defend and while he’s not the shooter Luke is, he’s much better at creating offense.
YES!!!!
If he acts like an idiot then cut his ass for the rest of the year.
by Doug West Domination!!! on Feb 12, 2012 3:35 PM CST reply actions
Is it wrong to miss the old J.R.?
Sigh. Those were fun messed up days, am I right?
I too am a lone wolfpack.
by OR-7 on Feb 12, 2012 4:23 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
I like Smith for us
for the same reason I like Mayo…these guys would score 20 ppg with their eyes closed playing next to Rubio.
Wilson Chandler is another option to consider, brings a little more defensive upside but not quite as good as the other two offensively.
I don't know what an art house is, I don't know what goes on in an art house, I have never been in an art house, and I can't imagine it's any place I ever want to be.
Sadly, we are still evaluating our talent
at JR’s position according to the POBO…
Once we have had the time to totally analyze our ineptitude at the 2 and 3 and the season has ended, we’ll be ready to entertain offers for our cast of characters at those positions. This will be followed closely by the period of re-evaluating our options at both positions while we wait for the phones to start ringing.
If there is a God and he has any sense of humor at all, this will be followed by Khans firing and his future employment as cabana boy in charge of Mayn’s chief!
Then when RA assumes POBO duties, we will actually acquire talent at those positions and start the years of playoff contention….
Ricky is lobbing at an Ooptimal level!
J.R., Mayo, Batum, a few thoughts
I don’t believe Memphis is so anxious to get rid of Mayo. If so, I think he’d be gone already. He’s a useful bench player for them. If they trade him before the deadline it will be for a salary dump and a draft choice, and I doubt that the Wolves can make that deal.
Thirteen million seems a lot for Batum. For that kind of money he better be everything bloggers here think he is. Interesting to me is the fact that his numbers are about the same as Denver’s Corey Brewer. I’m intrigued because of the way players improve or falter when moved. I don’t know of any reason Batum would not play well here, but I’m somewhat mystified by the Wolves inability to find anyone who can consistently make shots. D’Antoni seems to make good shooters out of most anything he finds laying around. How does he develop that kind of confidence? I realize it’s not the same player every night, but they spread the floor and find that guy.
I’ll confess a fondness for J.R., although I’m probably not up on the full dimensions of his “craziness.” If it’s logical for him to come to Mn where he can shine, does he make that choice or does he crazily decide that he can make the difference on a contender? Is he so crazy that others keep him at arms length, or is he poison?
"pokin' the animals at the Canis Hoopus zoo"
Memphis has "virtually" traded Mayo 3 times since last year's deadline.
All 3 fell apart at the last moment. So it isn’t like they’ve been trying. Mayo IS a good bench player for them, but I doubt they will be willing to give him a value contract next year considering how much they owe the rest of the team.
And the Wolves likely DO have the parts to make a deal. For the pick, we can give Memphis back their own 2013 1st rounder. We can also give them an expiring player or 2 – or a guy like Ridnour, since they really need a back-up PG.
Did they extend the qualifier to OJ?
Isn’t he kinds like Beasley where he will be free at the end of season or am I completely wrong on that? I am not the most knowledgeable when it comes to these things.
They don't have to decide on qualifying offers until after the season.
Same with us for Beasley and Randolph.
And I don’t think they even know what the QOs will be yet since they are not so much “slot based” as “performance/minutes based” under the new CBA.
Why get him when we have a bonified all star high light real
Wes Johnson at SG is a stud. Not only does he give us barely over 5 points a game, he also rocks in .8 assists. Sure Rubio can give 8, but Wes he gives you .8. Wes also gives you 2 rebounds a game. Anyone can get 13 K Love, but Wes is the only one who continuously gives you quality product out there. I for one am jacked for more Wes Johnson career starts to keep going on because lord knows he deserves it.
Realistically if you can get JR get him, sign him. Adleman can deal and if not he can walk.
by mnsportswopwopwah on Feb 12, 2012 9:41 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
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